Why so much hate in pvp?

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    Re: Why so much hate in pvp?

    Post by Guest on Thu Mar 29, 2012 5:27 pm

    It's funny hearing this proper etiquette ******** when half the time people invade they pop humanity even when the person doesn't use flask. It's funny because I've gotten hate mail for flasking only after someone popped a humanity. Bunch of hypocrites who are to lazy to farm humanity are the ones who ***** when someone heals.

    Reasoning for not throwing down a sign to dual is rather pathetic as well. You can always avoid being hit at spawn point if you're fast enough. People 2 vs 1 camping at spawn points happens all the time in different areas. Learn to avoid it & move on. Someone just as easily could camp at a spawn point in Kilin to do the exact same thing. Keeping a soap stone as your active item will basically tell you that someone is trying to enter your world before you get any sort of message about it.
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    Re: Why so much hate in pvp?

    Post by Kaminari on Thu Mar 29, 2012 5:29 pm

    Yukon wrote:In the case where they began to flip towards me rather than just circle me, I agree with you that would make things more interesting. My problem here lies with the people that do nothing different. I would have less of a problem if they tried to find my back in another manner other than simply strafing to my side over and over again.

    I am not sure I understand your question. But I think you are saying if someone is punished for doing the same thing, then tries to do something different but is still punished for it isn't is still boring?

    My problem lies with monotony so no, if you are doing different things and I counter all of them that is one thing, Its hard for me to adjust myself and counter you every step of the way.

    But say you are running at me with a knife and I side step... so you turn around and run at me with the knife again and again I side step. SO YOU TURN AROUND and you run at me again... etc.. eventually ONE of us is going to get bored. Its like throwing a dog a ball. If you throw the ball predominantly to the left the dog will start going to the left instictively, he won't even watch what you are doing, the dog is still having fun but my left arm is getting tired.

    I have a lot more fun throwing the ball when I mix it up.

    Excellent comparrison with the dog and ball. However, when it comes to YOU in this discussion, all I tried to say was that it did not seem like the BACKSTAB was the problem, but the MONOTONY (spelling) with other words, no matter if the invader is going for backstabs all the time, or tries something else, the problem is, if the one you fight tries the exact same thing all the time, Do I get you right? or would you still state that it's worse to try backstab over and over and over again, than something else over and over again?


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    Re: Why so much hate in pvp?

    Post by Tolvo on Thu Mar 29, 2012 5:30 pm

    Oo, I already said I do kill most of them when I get summoned by Farmers. I'm a forest hunter, my home is 1v2/3 PvP. What I said is I want to duel though, I'm not there for any other kind of PvP. If they popped humanity first then complain about you flasking after, alright that person is being a jerk. I think you are projecting these other people onto us.
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    Re: Why so much hate in pvp?

    Post by Yukon on Thu Mar 29, 2012 5:33 pm

    I don't think invaders are farming humanity. first of all you have to be human if you are invading as a red, second you can only pop consumable humanity. Sooo, if they are poping humanity while fighting you they are obviously doing something else since there is almost nothing you can do with humanity in the stats bar.

    Personally when I want to PVP I use a soapstone, just because my experience with it as compared to rings or orbs has been better. But I have been jumped a few times and it was pretty dissapointing.


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    Re: Why so much hate in pvp?

    Post by Forum Pirate on Thu Mar 29, 2012 5:39 pm

    Also Oo we're only a small percentage of the community. Theres nearly 1000 users here. The game sold 3 million + copies. This is all our etiquette for our playtime.

    Assuming we apply these rules to others or don't follow them while expecting others to is unfair. WE (in general) don't heal unless they do. Others do.

    If you don't like our etiquette don't follow it but telling us we're wrong or retarded is not cool nor is it your place to judge us as we don't force these "rules" on others.


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    Re: Why so much hate in pvp?

    Post by cloudyeki on Thu Mar 29, 2012 5:40 pm

    Here's a brilliant idea for all.

    MAKE YOUR INTENTIONS CLEAR! If a host wants to have a duel, then he should make it clear from the start. If an invader wants a duel, he should check if the host is willing to duel. If the host doesn't want to then the invader should bc out. No harm no foul and everyone isn't pissed at each other.


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    Re: Why so much hate in pvp?

    Post by Yukon on Thu Mar 29, 2012 5:41 pm

    "Excellent comparrison with the dog and ball. However, when it comes to YOU in this discussion, all I tried to say was that it did not seem like the BACKSTAB was the problem, but the MONOTONY (spelling) with other words, no matter if the invader is going for backstabs all the time, or tries something else, the problem is, if the one you fight tries the exact same thing all the time, Do I get you right? or would you still state that it's worse to try backstab over and over and over again, than something else over and over again?"

    Let me get out there that I have nothing against backstabs, I try not to do them too often but if I get BS'd even in a tourny or fightclub I don't get in a tissy.

    I am perfectly okay with an occasional backstab for spice, its a nice thing to try to avoid. SO I agree with you, my problem with BS remain almost exclusively with fishers. People who do nothing but circle my side, I was trying to get that across from my first post, I suppose I should have started by saying I am not against backstabs and I think they are part of what defines the souls series for me.

    I haven't really come across anyone who has tried something over and over again with the exception of backstabs. But if for example, someone tried to parry me and nothing else it would still be a little more exciting. They are still doing the same thing over and over, but there is still a huge risk on my part to even try to punish them for this. I personally get really nervous when I know my opponent can parry its like mental warfare.

    If an opponent stunlocks me and uses R1 as a spam that still has it's chances to become interesting, but often it is pretty boring as well. If someone shoots off 9 wogs I am snoring behind my controller. SO I suppose I do agree with you. My problem is more directly people abusing the same tactic endlessly. It just feels like the other tactics are not OKHO's in the case of hornet fishers.[quote]


    Last edited by Yukon on Thu Mar 29, 2012 5:45 pm; edited 1 time in total
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    Re: Why so much hate in pvp?

    Post by Tolvo on Thu Mar 29, 2012 5:43 pm

    Cloud I already do that, I always message people if I spawn away from them, and if I spawn near to them I always bow. I then hold my shield up, or Block with R2. If they do it back I let down my block and strafe left then right, usually they do the same then we duel. As well if I see them buff that is a guarantee, "Alright, this is a duel. No one buffs this close unless it is a duel."
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    Re: Why so much hate in pvp?

    Post by cloudyeki on Thu Mar 29, 2012 5:58 pm

    I know Tolvo, this back and forth is just bothersome. I don't mean to be an *** but honestly Oo is starting to sound like a 'stop-having-fun guy'

    It's a game, and I like to show respect. Do unto others and all.


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    Re: Why so much hate in pvp?

    Post by Tolvo on Thu Mar 29, 2012 6:00 pm

    I'm not a fan of too much back and forth as well when it seems like it is going nowhere, but see you are also getting a bit worked up. We just need to relax is all, these type of threads can sometimes just cause these emotions to rise. It just means time to take a break from it, and come back to it later when you're in a better mind set is all.
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    Re: Why so much hate in pvp?

    Post by Kaminari on Thu Mar 29, 2012 6:08 pm

    Yea, I didn't really thought I this thread would lead to something, I just would like to talk with people about their opinions, and see what people think. I did not made this thread to make people wanting to smash someones forehead happy


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    Re: Why so much hate in pvp?

    Post by Tolvo on Thu Mar 29, 2012 6:12 pm

    It just happens sometimes Kamin, that was the one you liked right?

    It's kind of like politics to me. I think it can be important to have talks about views between sides, that people can really gain a lot from such discussions. But often it can just lead to trouble, but it just means it's time for people to calm down and get back to a level headed state. Not that the discussion needs to be thrown out, just that they've been doing it for too long and need a rest from it.
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    Re: Why so much hate in pvp?

    Post by Kaminari on Thu Mar 29, 2012 6:27 pm

    Yea, hopefully no-one will blame me for starting this?silly As I said, I'm just curious how people think about this stuffs.

    Also, No, Kamin is what I tried to get away from XD
    Kami or Kaminari happy However, I don't take any offence to Kamin, it's just that In swedish, that is my native launguage, Kamin is the same as "Fire place" happy

    I just wonder what the developers think about backstabbing and WOTG and stuffs, and about backstab glitch/lagg, I don't really know how to know if me, myself is lagging behind someone or if it's just me being quick with a flip around them.



    small thing a bit off topic but still a bit about being cheap and stuffs, I invaded a guy in the forest, he had a phantom, I bow to the host, Point at the phantom, and bow to the host again. The host bows back both first and second time.

    The Phantom, lets me and the host have a duel while he takes care of an another DM, but when the phantom has finished that one off, he comes after me and backstabs me sad I thought I would have got a meeting with 2 nice guys, understanding if someone wants a duel sad


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    Re: Why so much hate in pvp?

    Post by Tolvo on Thu Mar 29, 2012 6:30 pm

    Yeah, that's Forest pvP. Basically if you see two people in a world it's best not to trust them. If you ever are looking for tactics, tips, and tricks in the forest in my signature is the Forest Hunter ideas Exchange thread basically. Feel free to check it out and adopt anything we've said, and add your own tactics.

    I don't blame you, especially in regards to questions. There's nothing wrong with asking about what a group of people consider taboo and what they don't, as well as general feelings amongst people.

    That's kind of funny. I was going to call you Kami then thought, "Wait, was the the one she didn't like? I think Kamin was the one he was okay with."
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    Re: Why so much hate in pvp?

    Post by HughManatee on Thu Mar 29, 2012 6:36 pm

    This really boils down to 2 different philosophies or play styles. Neither is right or wrong in my opinion. I tend to make everything I play pvp-centric if possible and I've always been an anything goes type of player.

    That said, generally, if someone bows to me and I bow back, it's going to be a straight up duel. If I don't want a duel I don't bow back. I juke around a bit and start fighting or throw a different emote that clearly is not a bow. (Although, admittedly the other day I had someone bow and accidentally hit R1 which CSS'd the poor guy in the head and killed him, sorry whoever that was, it was unintentional)

    Tolvo, you made a point about people who are standing around when invaded are probably waiting for pvp. While that's sometimes true, sometimes it isn't. For instance, I've been in human form heading to a boss where I planned on summoning Solair. When the invasion warning pops up I stop what I'm doing and start looking around for the invader to make sure I don't get ganked. This situation isn't going to be a duel as far as I'm concerned. I'm being interrupted and my state of readiness is with self preservation in mind, not entertaining my invader with a fair fight.

    On tactics I try to see everything as viable, BS fishing, BS chains, Dead Angles, whatever none of that bothers me, it just makes me get better and learn how to escape them, what to watch for, etc. To me a dead angle isn't any worse than a backstab or a parry/riposte or CHSM. They all require set up and execution so *shrug* live and let live. Sometimes I'm in the mood to try landing BS and other times I want to land a parry/riposte or whatever my mood suits.

    Live and let live 8) or Die and make other dead, in this case? :roll:


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    Re: Why so much hate in pvp?

    Post by Tolvo on Thu Mar 29, 2012 6:40 pm

    No I agree people will sometimes way around for their summons, connections are connections. I was saying a hypothetical situation in which the person wasn't there for farming, or fighting a boss. This is why I tend to message people to ask what they are up to, some don't respond because, I know. Someone's in your world you might not want to risk going to the menu to respond, but usually I get a message back saying, "I'm here to duel man, good luck." "I'm here for the boss, not here for a fight." "Come on out coward, are you ready to die?" And I abide by it. The first message, I'll come out, bow, buff, and duel. The second, I might come out and drop a humanity, but no matter what I'll BC out. The third message? I'll go up and bow from a distance, and be wary of dirty tactics from the person. I go very case by case, but in that instance I was just talking about a hypothetical situation.
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    Re: Why so much hate in pvp?

    Post by Kaminari on Thu Mar 29, 2012 6:40 pm

    HughManatee wrote:This really boils down to 2 different philosophies or play styles. Neither is right or wrong in my opinion. I tend to make everything I play pvp-centric if possible and I've always been an anything goes type of player.

    That said, generally, if someone bows to me and I bow back, it's going to be a straight up duel. If I don't want a duel I don't bow back. I juke around a bit and start fighting or throw a different emote that clearly is not a bow. (Although, admittedly the other day I had someone bow and accidentally hit R1 which CSS'd the poor guy in the head and killed him, sorry whoever that was, it was unintentional)

    Tolvo, you made a point about people who are standing around when invaded are probably waiting for pvp. While that's sometimes true, sometimes it isn't. For instance, I've been in human form heading to a boss where I planned on summoning Solair. When the invasion warning pops up I stop what I'm doing and start looking around for the invader to make sure I don't get ganked. This situation isn't going to be a duel as far as I'm concerned. I'm being interrupted and my state of readiness is with self preservation in mind, not entertaining my invader with a fair fight.

    On tactics I try to see everything as viable, BS fishing, BS chains, Dead Angles, whatever none of that bothers me, it just makes me get better and learn how to escape them, what to watch for, etc. To me a dead angle isn't any worse than a backstab or a parry/riposte or CHSM. They all require set up and execution so *shrug* live and let live. Sometimes I'm in the mood to try landing BS and other times I want to land a parry/riposte or whatever my mood suits.

    Live and let live 8) or Die and make other dead, in this case? :roll:

    an excellent post I may say! happy
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    Re: Why so much hate in pvp?

    Post by Quarik on Thu Mar 29, 2012 7:15 pm

    I've personally lost all faith in the pvp community, after winning several 3v1s and having the host disconnect AFTER I kill him so I don't get my souls or souvenir of reprisal. Unless the host makes it very clear that they're not going to be an ***, I will do anything to win.


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    Re: Why so much hate in pvp?

    Post by Tolvo on Thu Mar 29, 2012 7:17 pm

    Oh man, it's the worst when that happens. Despite all the odds stacked against you, you prove to be the better player. You defeat their summons, beat them within an inch of their life and just as the killing blow is about to be made, they vanish and you get sent back your world. What teases they are.
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    Re: Why so much hate in pvp?

    Post by BLA1NE on Thu Mar 29, 2012 7:21 pm

    ^Tease is not the word I would use, but it's a lot more politically correct!


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    Re: Why so much hate in pvp?

    Post by Tolvo on Thu Mar 29, 2012 7:29 pm

    Haha, I try when I can.
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    Re: Why so much hate in pvp?

    Post by Quarik on Thu Mar 29, 2012 7:31 pm

    That happens plenty too, but I mean actually after I have killed them. It says Victory Achieved or whatever, and I'm just about to get my souls, and then the dc message pops up.


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    Re: Why so much hate in pvp?

    Post by Tolvo on Thu Mar 29, 2012 7:32 pm

    Oh man, I've seen a few of those ones. Sometimes I wish us invaders could indict hosts haha.
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    Re: Why so much hate in pvp?

    Post by Quarik on Thu Mar 29, 2012 7:39 pm

    I personally feel that the invader should get souls if the host disconnects, because even if it's an actual connection issue it's just a few more souls and another humanity/souvenir for the invader, while the host has merely wasted 45 seconds.


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    Re: Why so much hate in pvp?

    Post by Tolvo on Thu Mar 29, 2012 7:41 pm

    See, I can see the idea of victory by default. They have that in a decent amount of games I believe, and I mean it's not like it wouldn't make sense to have it be counted as a win anyway. Though coding that I'm not even remotely sure about how that would work, sadly I don't have enough knowledge of such mechanics.

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