Is "gamer girl" a derogatory term?

    Share
    avatar
    Forum Pirate
    Chosen Undead
    Chosen Undead

    Posts : 6625
    Reputation : 232
    Join date : 2012-01-30
    Age : 26
    Location : International waters

    Re: Is "gamer girl" a derogatory term?

    Post by Forum Pirate on Sun Mar 31, 2013 10:52 am

    I'd argue the opposite. Sexism directed at women is real and problematic for sure, but as a man, I can hardly move without being called sexist. If treat them differently, I'm doing it just because they're women, so I'm sexist, but if I treat them as I treat other males then I'm crude and/or insensative and/or not acknowledging the difference, so I'm sexist.

    Its a no win.

    I'd argue a very, very vocal (and growing) group of people is so focused on not being sexist, they are, in fact, being sexist, by putting either gender first or by implying that the subject of the "sexist" attitude has no control over the situation (as a whole) thus painting the subject (ie women) as powerless victims, meaning they are inferior (else they wouldn't be powerless) which is the same thing they vehemently claim is not true.


    This subject is tiresome.


    _________________
    Your rules are yours
    My honor is mine.
    Perspective is everything.
    We are Exiles, and our home is Painted with the blood of trespassers.

    User1
    Abyss Dweller
    Abyss Dweller

    Posts : 9912
    Reputation : 106
    Join date : 2012-12-18

    Re: Is "gamer girl" a derogatory term?

    Post by User1 on Sun Mar 31, 2013 10:54 am

    Agreed on that.
    avatar
    densetsushun
    Hollowed
    Hollowed

    Posts : 1999
    Reputation : 40
    Join date : 2012-12-29
    Location : The nether regions

    Re: Is "gamer girl" a derogatory term?

    Post by densetsushun on Sun Mar 31, 2013 11:09 am

    Forum Pirate wrote:I'd argue the opposite. Sexism directed at women is real and problematic for sure, but as a man, I can hardly move without being called sexist. If treat them differently, I'm doing it just because they're women, so I'm sexist, but if I treat them as I treat other males then I'm crude and/or insensative and/or not acknowledging the difference, so I'm sexist.

    Its a no win.

    I'd argue a very, very vocal (and growing) group of people is so focused on not being sexist, they are, in fact, being sexist, by putting either gender first or by implying that the subject of the "sexist" attitude has no control over the situation (as a whole) thus painting the subject (ie women) as powerless victims, meaning they are inferior (else they wouldn't be powerless) which is the same thing they vehemently claim is not true.


    This subject is tiresome.
    That's assuming that the options are between one extreme and another. What's wrong with treating every single person(or rather, stranger, family, friend, whatever subset they belong to) equally? If you're crass, you're crass to everyone. No serious feminist would expect anyone to baby women and go to their rescue, but is it really too much to ask for when the only demand is for them to not be treated as something different?

    If someone sucks, call them on it. If you're jealous about their skills, be equally abrasive and butthurt to everyone who's better. If you admire someone for being skilled, admire them. The only thing that feminist gamers require are these simple words: Don't bring gender into it. There's absolutely no reason for it and it detracts from the validity of your argument or the content of your message. It detracts from the gaming experience.


    _________________
    George Takei:
    Here's a little Internet tip: If you feel offended by something someone else posts, remember two simple rules:

    1) It's not about you.
    2) If you try to make it about you, you'll sound ridiculous.

    Steve Jobs:
    Almost everything--all external expectations, all pride, all fear of embarrassment or failure--these things just fall away in the face of death, leaving only what is truly important. Remembering that you are going to die is the best way I know to avoid the trap of thinking you have something to lose. You are already naked. There is no reason not to follow your heart.
    avatar
    Rynn
    Chosen Undead
    Chosen Undead

    Posts : 4689
    Reputation : 257
    Join date : 2012-01-26

    Re: Is "gamer girl" a derogatory term?

    Post by Rynn on Sun Mar 31, 2013 11:26 am

    Dubscythe wrote: I like to think that the ones who stream and have three pictures of themselves taking up 90% of the screen fall into this.
    Presumably if they do both though, right? silly

    Pretty much, I consider it a derrogatory term. I'm just a gamer and a streamer, my gender doesn't matter, it's worth two ****. I usually hear "Girl Gamer" said about those that go outa their way to mention that they -are- female and playing a game... like it's something important or ground breaking.

    TBH it's the same problem I have with incredibly vocal bronies.
    "Yes I'm a guy, and Yes I like ponies"
    "Okay, cool, shut up and get outa my face"

    "Yes I'm a girl, and Yes I'm playing Call of Duty"
    "Okay, cool, shut up and get outa my face"
    avatar
    Rynn
    Chosen Undead
    Chosen Undead

    Posts : 4689
    Reputation : 257
    Join date : 2012-01-26

    Re: Is "gamer girl" a derogatory term?

    Post by Rynn on Sun Mar 31, 2013 11:27 am

    Dubscythe wrote: I like to think that the ones who stream and have three pictures of themselves taking up 90% of the screen fall into this.
    Presumably if they do both though, right? silly

    Pretty much, I consider it a derrogatory term. I'm just a gamer and a streamer, my gender doesn't matter, it's worth two ****. I usually hear "Girl Gamer" said about those that go outa their way to mention that they -are- female and playing a game... like it's something important or ground breaking.

    TBH it's the same problem I have with incredibly vocal bronies.
    "Yes I'm a guy, and Yes I like ponies"
    "Okay, cool, shut up and get outa my face"

    "Yes I'm a girl, and Yes I'm playing Call of Duty"
    "Okay, cool, shut up and get outa my face"
    avatar
    Forum Pirate
    Chosen Undead
    Chosen Undead

    Posts : 6625
    Reputation : 232
    Join date : 2012-01-30
    Age : 26
    Location : International waters

    Re: Is "gamer girl" a derogatory term?

    Post by Forum Pirate on Sun Mar 31, 2013 12:27 pm

    A growing section of the public is currently dealing in extremes. That is something I deal with on a regular basis.

    They are different. Thus its sexism of another kind to assume they are not. Everyone is different, true, but there are notable differences in typical behavior patterns, information processing and typical skill sets between males and females. They are not universal, but they are there, put there by some combination of culture and evolution.

    Just as I treat every person different based on my experience with them, i treat every group different based on my experience with them.

    Is this relevant to video game skill? Not at all, thus I don't bring it up in that regard.

    Equality is not about being the same, something the entire western world doesn't seem to understand, equality is that no one is inherently or unilateray superior to anyone. That no one persons/groups interests or feelings are inherently (key word) more important than anyone elses.


    _________________
    Your rules are yours
    My honor is mine.
    Perspective is everything.
    We are Exiles, and our home is Painted with the blood of trespassers.
    avatar
    Serious_Much
    Moderator Trainee
    Moderator Trainee

    Posts : 14641
    Reputation : 287
    Join date : 2012-01-17
    Age : 24
    Location : The Dark Side of the Moon

    Re: Is "gamer girl" a derogatory term?

    Post by Serious_Much on Sun Mar 31, 2013 1:40 pm

    My biggest problem with 'sexism' is the fact that many women I know think it only works one way- them being treated badly.

    Most women object to lower pay, being domestic wives etc, yet they still fully expect the other side of sexism- treating them unconditionally well above which you'd treat men, without classing it as sexism. It really ridiculous frankly.

    The least they can do if I have just as much, or even less money than them is not expect me to foot the bill for everything, jeez :|

    I guess that's probably why I avoid 'girly' girls like the plague silly


    _________________
    PSN and other stuff:
    PSN: HolyPK9 "You are free to sever the chains of fate that bind you"

    Sage Andarta, Founder of the Crystal Seekers; The Noble Knights

    Principal GremSay of the Karmatic Gremlin Gang

    Moderator of the Wiki Chatroom- Come join the fun  cheers

    PRAISE. THE. SUN. lol!
    avatar
    Dibsville
    Abyss Dweller
    Abyss Dweller

    Posts : 9377
    Reputation : 134
    Join date : 2013-03-09
    Age : 20
    Location : Gensōkyō

    Re: Is "gamer girl" a derogatory term?

    Post by Dibsville on Sun Mar 31, 2013 1:44 pm

    I really don't care about people who are girls and playing games.
    Just means they're bored with everything else, kind of like most people who are playing games. You don't really have anything else to do with your time...


    _________________
    PSN: Dibsville
    The Exiled of Ariamis; join the cause!
    EarthScraper wrote:OK, now I've just learnt that you never mess with Dibs on a Dark Souls topic, cause he will put you down.

    User1
    Abyss Dweller
    Abyss Dweller

    Posts : 9912
    Reputation : 106
    Join date : 2012-12-18

    Re: Is "gamer girl" a derogatory term?

    Post by User1 on Sun Mar 31, 2013 1:45 pm

    Apart from come here! They are the only two things I do with my life, really.
    avatar
    Tolvo
    Town Crier
    Town Crier

    Posts : 13287
    Reputation : 542
    Join date : 2012-02-01
    Age : 25
    Location : The Forest, Illinois

    Re: Is "gamer girl" a derogatory term?

    Post by Tolvo on Sun Mar 31, 2013 2:06 pm

    I've run into those situations before. Let's just say people think I'm very hateful of women and a sexist if the discussion ever comes up "Would you hit a woman?"

    My answer is always this. "If I feel I would hit a person in the situation, I will regardless of gender." I've fought women before and lost one of those fights because she was an experienced fighter and kicked my ***. It wasn't because I went easy on her, it wasn't because she was a woman. She had more experience than me and muscle mass.

    But since I consider women equal to men apparently I'm sexist. Now I of course know females who agree with me. It's just the issue that our culture demonizes hitting women so much that often it can't even be depicted on screen unless showing the male off as being a monster.

    Also Forum Pirate, it's called Social/Political equality. Egalitarians sometimes can't agree on what they believe equality means, so they have a few different philosophies. The asymmetrical equality view typically falls under Social/Political Equality.

    User1
    Abyss Dweller
    Abyss Dweller

    Posts : 9912
    Reputation : 106
    Join date : 2012-12-18

    Re: Is "gamer girl" a derogatory term?

    Post by User1 on Sun Mar 31, 2013 2:11 pm

    Tolvo wrote:
    It's just the issue that our culture demonizes hitting women so much that often it can't even be depicted on screen unless showing the male off as being a monster.



    This seemed to be some kind of rule all boys must apply to in High School. I never understood it. In my experience in High School, the girls are *****, because they know they can get away with it, without being hurt.
    avatar
    Tolvo
    Town Crier
    Town Crier

    Posts : 13287
    Reputation : 542
    Join date : 2012-02-01
    Age : 25
    Location : The Forest, Illinois

    Re: Is "gamer girl" a derogatory term?

    Post by Tolvo on Sun Mar 31, 2013 9:07 pm

    By the way a small thing in relation to gaming and the travesty that is sexist representations of female leads. One series that was always great about that was Metroid. The fact that Samus was a woman didn't even factor into the equation, a good deal of people didn't even know it. Her gender didn't matter at all. Samus was a bounty hunter and warrior. She wasn't a Woman Bounty Hunter or Woman Warrior. She just was what her job was.



    In recent years she has been totally ruined by developers. I love Nintendo but this is a case where they really need to pay attention to what they are doing. In one of her most recent incarnations, Metroid Other M, she is portrayed as a scared woman that struggles with asserting herself and facing the dangers that men bravely go against. She is submissive to every male character and constantly brings up the idea of motherhood and how she feels empty inside unless she is nurturing children. Note, this in canon is really late in the story. This is after something like five death defying adventures and developing her as a strong person who happens to be a woman. I mean really, I don't understand how female activist groups can get pissed about God of War when this **** exists. Previously Samus almost always wore her armor except perhaps at the end if you beat the game 100%. These days, she seems to be stripping down to her skimpy zero suit whenever. Not to mention she was somewhat masculine in appearance originally but they dolled her up more making her slender and large breasted.



    I just brought this up because I got reminded of Samus and what happened to her and god damn does it always piss me off what happened to that character.

    She wasn't a female role model. She was a role model that happened to be a woman.

    User1
    Abyss Dweller
    Abyss Dweller

    Posts : 9912
    Reputation : 106
    Join date : 2012-12-18

    Re: Is "gamer girl" a derogatory term?

    Post by User1 on Sun Mar 31, 2013 9:09 pm

    God damn, I hate it when developers do this. I preferred the old Metroid, why did Nintendo have to do this? What form of motivation did they have?
    avatar
    Tolvo
    Town Crier
    Town Crier

    Posts : 13287
    Reputation : 542
    Join date : 2012-02-01
    Age : 25
    Location : The Forest, Illinois

    Re: Is "gamer girl" a derogatory term?

    Post by Tolvo on Sun Mar 31, 2013 9:18 pm

    They gave the game over to one man to essentially have every bit of control over it. He believed he was an artist and progressive man with a great image. Essentially he thought he was the Orson Welles of game developing. Nintendo had slightly sexualized her in a few games but generally they didn't go so far into the "She's a woman so she needs to be like this" category. Yoshio Sakamoto is pretty much the cause of this whole Mother fixation Samus has.

    Let's just say in game she says the word baby literally like a hundred times. The baby metroid she didn't care about since it was just some creature, suddenly it's like her baby and she feels awful for its loss. Other women, they're just subjects of men's tyranny without any way to fight back. Literally every female in the game is totally submissive to men except in a few instances. However let's just say the few instances, there is something revealed that totally negates that making every female really submissive. He thought showing Samus as a caring mother figure would cause people to like her more.

    So who else likes it when your protagonist spends fifteen minutes talking about how much of a man they are and how they should be *** women and teaching their boys how to play catch? No one? Okay good.

    Nintendo was pretty taken aback by it, but they aren't excused. They gave him total control and are also responsible for what happened. What is really crazy too is in general the game has high ratings. A lot of people consider the game greater than the original Metroids.

    If you want to see the travesty. Retsupurae did a Wrongpuray where they did commentary over the whole campaign's cutscenes.

    Trust me you'll want that commentary, sitting through her constant flashbacks and retelling of events five minutes prior can be really hard to sit through without them.

    http://youtu.be/2rSagGwWTVM

    User1
    Abyss Dweller
    Abyss Dweller

    Posts : 9912
    Reputation : 106
    Join date : 2012-12-18

    Re: Is "gamer girl" a derogatory term?

    Post by User1 on Sun Mar 31, 2013 9:29 pm

    So, some guy who thought he had immense design skills took pretty much all control over Samus, and made her into some kind of wannabe mother, because he thought people would like her more? She must be just plain annoying with the amount of times she mentions the subject. I would never play this, if the protaganist I knew long ago is just some sexualised, submittive model.

    And since when would making her submittive to all men make her liked more either? It just comes across to me as some kind of trying to make the game more, 'touching', when all it comes out as is just an annoying, repetitive series of attempts to make the story saddening.
    avatar
    Tolvo
    Town Crier
    Town Crier

    Posts : 13287
    Reputation : 542
    Join date : 2012-02-01
    Age : 25
    Location : The Forest, Illinois

    Re: Is "gamer girl" a derogatory term?

    Post by Tolvo on Sun Mar 31, 2013 9:31 pm

    What Renegade?

    Having a character look at their hand randomly then narrate over about how they were looking at their hands to see if anything remained on her of the Baby Metroid which made her feel whole before it was killed?

    You know, the Baby?
    YOu don't like Babies?

    What's wrong with Babies?

    I'm stuck saying Baby. ***.

    By the way you should watch that. It's so terrible at points it is god damn hilarious. Pay attention for thumbs up and thumbs down. Like literally, Samus gives the thumbs up and thumbs down a lot in the game. Even though she is fully voiced.

    User1
    Abyss Dweller
    Abyss Dweller

    Posts : 9912
    Reputation : 106
    Join date : 2012-12-18

    Re: Is "gamer girl" a derogatory term?

    Post by User1 on Sun Mar 31, 2013 9:34 pm

    I think I'll start watching that now. I really want to see just how terrible this is.
    avatar
    Tolvo
    Town Crier
    Town Crier

    Posts : 13287
    Reputation : 542
    Join date : 2012-02-01
    Age : 25
    Location : The Forest, Illinois

    Re: Is "gamer girl" a derogatory term?

    Post by Tolvo on Sun Mar 31, 2013 9:37 pm

    Let's just say this much, in Other M Samus talks about how other people treated her differently for being a woman in the military, because it was normal for only men to be soldiers.

    In Metroid Prime Corruption the military has people of various genders, they also don't care that she is a woman and just consider her a hero.

    God damn everything about Metroid Other M pisses me off.
    avatar
    Serious_Much
    Moderator Trainee
    Moderator Trainee

    Posts : 14641
    Reputation : 287
    Join date : 2012-01-17
    Age : 24
    Location : The Dark Side of the Moon

    Re: Is "gamer girl" a derogatory term?

    Post by Serious_Much on Sun Mar 31, 2013 9:43 pm

    I'd like to object that the game was generally given fairly high ratings. I wanna put it's scores into perspective.

    In the AAA market, a game is guranteed over 80.

    Within AAA market, a game as perfectly awful as the latest call of duty has averaged scores of 83 on metacritic.

    The average of Metroid other M is only 79. It is so bad, it doesn't even get the minimum 80 that is mandatory for any popular series.

    (Disclaimer, this post is mainly for amusement purposes and I have never played, nor will I ever play this game silly )


    _________________
    PSN and other stuff:
    PSN: HolyPK9 "You are free to sever the chains of fate that bind you"

    Sage Andarta, Founder of the Crystal Seekers; The Noble Knights

    Principal GremSay of the Karmatic Gremlin Gang

    Moderator of the Wiki Chatroom- Come join the fun  cheers

    PRAISE. THE. SUN. lol!
    avatar
    Rynn
    Chosen Undead
    Chosen Undead

    Posts : 4689
    Reputation : 257
    Join date : 2012-01-26

    Re: Is "gamer girl" a derogatory term?

    Post by Rynn on Sun Mar 31, 2013 9:47 pm

    Serious_Much wrote:
    In the AAA market, a game is guranteed over 80.
    [/size]
    Absolutely true.
    Diablo 3 hit an 89.
    Resident Evil 6 got a 86.

    If you're AAA, you get high ratings. If you're not. You don't. Ratings are a lie.
    avatar
    Tolvo
    Town Crier
    Town Crier

    Posts : 13287
    Reputation : 542
    Join date : 2012-02-01
    Age : 25
    Location : The Forest, Illinois

    Re: Is "gamer girl" a derogatory term?

    Post by Tolvo on Sun Mar 31, 2013 9:47 pm

    Serious you are not authorized to give out Metacritic scores.

    By the way, in game instead of finding upgrades you need Adam, someone you knew in the past who has no command or actual power over you, to authorize you to use said weapons.

    Even though you're a hired freelance bounty hunter that can actually do whatever is deemed necessary by you.

    So no more Metacritic scores unless I say so!

    User1
    Abyss Dweller
    Abyss Dweller

    Posts : 9912
    Reputation : 106
    Join date : 2012-12-18

    Re: Is "gamer girl" a derogatory term?

    Post by User1 on Sun Mar 31, 2013 9:49 pm

    It seems more illogical things are added to the game. This game is as insane as me.
    avatar
    Serious_Much
    Moderator Trainee
    Moderator Trainee

    Posts : 14641
    Reputation : 287
    Join date : 2012-01-17
    Age : 24
    Location : The Dark Side of the Moon

    Re: Is "gamer girl" a derogatory term?

    Post by Serious_Much on Sun Mar 31, 2013 9:49 pm

    Tolvo wrote:Serious you are not authorized to give out Metacritic scores.

    By the way, in game instead of finding upgrades you need Adam, someone you knew in the past who has no command or actual power over you, to authorize you to use said weapons.

    Even though you're a hired freelance bounty hunter that can actually do whatever is deemed necessary by you.

    So no more Metacritic scores unless I say so!

    I am so totally confused by this post.. silly


    _________________
    PSN and other stuff:
    PSN: HolyPK9 "You are free to sever the chains of fate that bind you"

    Sage Andarta, Founder of the Crystal Seekers; The Noble Knights

    Principal GremSay of the Karmatic Gremlin Gang

    Moderator of the Wiki Chatroom- Come join the fun  cheers

    PRAISE. THE. SUN. lol!
    avatar
    Tolvo
    Town Crier
    Town Crier

    Posts : 13287
    Reputation : 542
    Join date : 2012-02-01
    Age : 25
    Location : The Forest, Illinois

    Re: Is "gamer girl" a derogatory term?

    Post by Tolvo on Sun Mar 31, 2013 9:50 pm

    You are not authorized to understand it!

    avatar
    Serious_Much
    Moderator Trainee
    Moderator Trainee

    Posts : 14641
    Reputation : 287
    Join date : 2012-01-17
    Age : 24
    Location : The Dark Side of the Moon

    Re: Is "gamer girl" a derogatory term?

    Post by Serious_Much on Sun Mar 31, 2013 9:51 pm

    Rynn wrote:
    Serious_Much wrote:
    In the AAA market, a game is guranteed over 80.
    [/size]
    Absolutely true.
    Diablo 3 hit an 89.
    Resident Evil 6 got a 86.

    If you're AAA, you get high ratings. If you're not. You don't. Ratings are a lie.

    Tell it to the indie game that won all the awards this year silly

    I wouldn't say ALWAYS, games like demon's souls and journey slip through the net....

    Then again I feel reviewers give the occasional unknown game a high score just to keep their reviewing credentials out of scrutiny.


    _________________
    PSN and other stuff:
    PSN: HolyPK9 "You are free to sever the chains of fate that bind you"

    Sage Andarta, Founder of the Crystal Seekers; The Noble Knights

    Principal GremSay of the Karmatic Gremlin Gang

    Moderator of the Wiki Chatroom- Come join the fun  cheers

    PRAISE. THE. SUN. lol!

    Sponsored content

    Re: Is "gamer girl" a derogatory term?

    Post by Sponsored content


      Current date/time is Sat Aug 19, 2017 2:43 am