The Story Behind: How and Why

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    skarekrow13
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    Re: The Story Behind: How and Why

    Post by skarekrow13 on Mon Jun 11, 2012 12:52 am

    Done it. It usually doesn't end well.

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    Re: The Story Behind: How and Why

    Post by cloudyeki on Mon Jun 11, 2012 12:55 am

    Does fall control help?


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    Re: The Story Behind: How and Why

    Post by DoughGuy on Mon Jun 11, 2012 12:55 am

    Crap my build actually has the spell!


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    Re: The Story Behind: How and Why

    Post by skarekrow13 on Mon Jun 11, 2012 12:58 am

    It's possible to live if you land on the stairs in the right spot. Fall control would save some life. I believe the rest counts as kill zones

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    Re: The Story Behind: How and Why

    Post by Shkar on Mon Jun 11, 2012 1:02 am

    The only spot I saw to jump off just led to the bottom of the tower. An invisible wall kept me from the roof across from it when I jumped off, and you can't even see the wyvern from the tower.

    That being said, the dragon flys up from where Solaire stands when you first go across the the bridge. Looking down from that ledge, one thing immediately became obvious: Londo (the city you are in for the whole game, including Anor Londo) is on a mountain. Not just Anor Londo, the entire area; Solaire looks down upon an area far below the clouds.

    I tried to see if I could walk on the rocks by that platform, but my character landed, then died a half second later from a death barrier.


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    Re: The Story Behind: How and Why

    Post by DoughGuy on Mon Jun 11, 2012 1:05 am

    This is the new Glyphblades thread lol. Right, time to go back to the foodchain.


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    Re: The Story Behind: How and Why

    Post by skarekrow13 on Mon Jun 11, 2012 1:18 am

    Hey that's plagiarism! I've been touting the cities on the mountain idea. At least I think I mentioned it once. I think Emergence and I compared it to Olympus in his thread. My belief is that everything, including Izalith and ash lake are all part of the mountain. The other countries are likely those that border this anomalous mountain.

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    Re: The Story Behind: How and Why

    Post by Shkar on Mon Jun 11, 2012 1:25 am

    skarekrow13 wrote:Hey that's plagiarism! I've been touting the cities on the mountain idea. At least I think I mentioned it once. I think Emergence and I compared it to Olympus in his thread. My belief is that everything, including Izalith and ash lake are all part of the mountain. The other countries are likely those that border this anomalous mountain.

    The Bridge Wyvern seems to fly up from there, so it is probably down there to feed or something. There was probably a bunch of farms (now overrun) on the slopes of the mountain to feed the citizens. The Wyvern probably picks up some wild cows or deer or some such.

    I think we may have probed the outskirts of how much we can discuss about the Great Food Chain. Should we move on to a new topic until some new ideas are brought up? We could discuss the purpose/location of the Kiln and the buildings there.


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    Re: The Story Behind: How and Why

    Post by DoughGuy on Mon Jun 11, 2012 1:27 am

    I think it was once a city. Although now I think about it does anyone else think it looks like Oolacile tower/the one in the PW?


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    Re: The Story Behind: How and Why

    Post by Shkar on Mon Jun 11, 2012 1:33 am

    DoughGuy wrote:I think it was once a city. Although now I think about it does anyone else think it looks like Oolacile tower/the one in the PW?

    I believe at least one of the paintings in Anor Londo is of the structures, possibly the one of the burning city and the Sentinel as well.

    It obviously has some kind of portal access (the stairway to get there) as it isn't underground like it would be if it was just magically protected. You can see the sky. So where did all the ash come from? It's reasonable that it is still there, since the walls would block the wind, but the stone pillars are only melted by the First Flame. What would have been there for the flame to burn to ash?


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    Re: The Story Behind: How and Why

    Post by DoughGuy on Mon Jun 11, 2012 1:35 am

    Well as I said I think it was the first city. Its where humanity and the gods first gathered in their goal to kill the dragons. Izalith became the second city, city of chaos and anor londo was their third. The first flame burnt the city to ash when Gwn linked with it like what happens when
    Spoiler:
    you link with the fire in that endng.


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    Re: The Story Behind: How and Why

    Post by Shkar on Mon Jun 11, 2012 1:42 am

    DoughGuy wrote:Well as I said I think it was the first city. Its where humanity and the gods first gathered in their goal to kill the dragons. Izalith became the second city, city of chaos and anor londo was their third. The first flame burnt the city to ash when Gwn linked with it like what happens when
    Spoiler:
    you link with the fire in that endng.

    Hm, now we come to a point of debate. WAS it the first city? The Witch of Izalith is referred to as that during the Dark Tales (the name of the legends the intro tells), but was she known as that DURING the war on the dragons?

    If so, it supports my personal belief that Izalith and similarly ancient cities would have been underground. The dragons ruled the skies, allowing them to control the land as well. In the shadow of such oppression, humanity would have been wise to move underground.


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    Re: The Story Behind: How and Why

    Post by DoughGuy on Mon Jun 11, 2012 1:44 am

    Exactly. Izalith could always have been a region before it was a city. She could have been known as the witch of izalith (region) and the city came afterwards. Thats why they would have built Anor londo on top of a mountain, to show that they were the new rulers, the dragons no longer had power.


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    Re: The Story Behind: How and Why

    Post by Shkar on Mon Jun 11, 2012 1:50 am

    DoughGuy wrote:Exactly. Izalith could always have been a region before it was a city. She could have been known as the witch of izalith (region) and the city came afterwards. Thats why they would have built Anor londo on top of a mountain, to show that they were the new rulers, the dragons no longer had power.

    This would bring more evidence to my observation that there is a decent chance that there was a city under teh hydra lake in the forest, due to the gate that should be on teh other side of the bridge from New Londo.

    There's no real reason for New Londo to be underground. Why would the humans forsake the surface for the twilight of the earth? No, instead it seems as if there was teh city of londo in one cave of the valley, and when it came time to expand they moved to a cave on the other side and founded New Londo.

    When the dragons were defeated they moved to the surface, establishing Anor (Sunny) Londo, and probably Oolacile.


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    Re: The Story Behind: How and Why

    Post by Anchises on Mon Jun 11, 2012 1:50 am

    The intro mentions that "from the dark, they came" (I think that's it), they being the lords and the pygmy and his ancestors. These 'people' seemed to have come from hellish crags.


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    Re: The Story Behind: How and Why

    Post by Anchises on Mon Jun 11, 2012 1:56 am

    Also, I like to think that all the demons (save the titanite demons) found outside of Izalith and Demon Ruins have been moved there by the dominant gods to set up a challenge for a would-be candidate to become the new lord of cinder. They in a sense are setting up the game for you to play out into their hands.


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    Re: The Story Behind: How and Why

    Post by Shkar on Mon Jun 11, 2012 1:56 am

    Anchises wrote:The intro mentions that "from the dark, they came" (I think that's it), they being the lords and the pygmy and his ancestors. These 'people' seemed to have come from hellish crags.

    Technically speaking, in order for an organism to evolve (especially one as large as a human) that far underground, it would need to be near a source of energy due to the lack of sunlight. This would leave the most likely possibility being Geothermal energy, so they would have come from underground caves near lava flows/calderas.

    I mean, they COULD have lived off radiation like certain real life bacteria species, but that's just ridiculous.


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    Re: The Story Behind: How and Why

    Post by DoughGuy on Mon Jun 11, 2012 2:01 am

    ^I think that they started as undead, and when the first flame was created they became humans. I'll see if I can find the theory I wrote for yukon.


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    Re: The Story Behind: How and Why

    Post by DoughGuy on Mon Jun 11, 2012 2:02 am

    Thats was easy lol.



    SO in the beginning was the age of ancients. Everything was immortal. Humanity existed as immortal undead. How they interacted with the dragons is
    unknown. There is also the possibility
    of a race of gods. Then the first flame
    lit. With it cam disparity and death
    became a thing. The first to die became
    Nito, a lord soul given to the dead.
    Gwyn, either one of the gods or a human found the largest lord soul and
    became very powerful. he amassed an army
    of knights (race unknown) and went to war with the dragons. The pygmy also found the dark soul and became
    the dark lord. The dark soul is
    connected to humanity in some way, either it is humanity or it created it. With this soul the undead became humans.


    Thus the age of fire began.
    Then the first flame went out.
    Gwyn re linked with the flame but not being a firekeeper he is forced to
    draw humanity through his knights to keep it lit. He may also draw it through the bonfires that
    undead kindle. Now at some point some
    humans earnt a dark sign. (Johnnyharpoon
    had the theory that in order to become undead you must commit an act so
    horrendous your humanity literally seperates from you but thats off
    topic). This dark sign makes the undead
    immortal, effectively undoing the work of the first flame. This was most likely a reaction to the
    extinguishing of the flame. When it went
    out and was incorrectly re lit its power
    was dimished and warped and thus the disparity of life and death was
    changed. Now death is not absolute and
    this is manifested through the dark sign.


    If the first flame is to go out completely its tricky. The dark age is the age of man so theoretically
    the dark sign would no longer exist, and despite there being no disparity
    humans would still die. Now if the first
    flame wasn’t warped by its relighting that would’ve happened but it has been
    changed I don’t know what will happen.


    So thats my theory.
    Its not fact but its built on what we know.


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    Re: The Story Behind: How and Why

    Post by Shkar on Mon Jun 11, 2012 2:08 am

    DoughGuy wrote:^I think that they started as undead, and when the first flame was created they became humans. I'll see if I can find the theory I wrote for yukon.

    The Flame had to be there at the very start. It is the Dark Souls equivalent of the Big Bang (as a theory/ideal, not literally happy).

    The humans "came from dark", but the dark was brought about by the flame. The only thing mentioned by the game that could POSSIBLY have existed before the flame is a swamp (unformed ground), with archtrees and dragons. That's it.


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    Re: The Story Behind: How and Why

    Post by Shkar on Tue Jun 12, 2012 2:05 pm

    DLC SPOILERS (Of a sort) AHEAD!

    Welcome and prepare for a wild ride. We’re going to be engaging in complex and possibly annoying discussion about how time works in Lordran. There may be pain, there may be confusion; heck, there may even be some pants-wetting, but we’re already halfway there, so there’s no turning back.

    I’m going to sum everything up at the very start; forget everything you know about the linear flow of time. The Dark Souls Universe does not follow a law stating that the future is undecided. Lordran does indeed exist based on the concept known as FATE. That just means that every time you died on your way to Gwyn, was actually out of your control and you shouldn’t be angry about it. Just ashamed.

    This whole point revolves around one key aspect; the upcoming expansion. As we all know, in it we travel back in time and end up fighting Artorias himself as a boss. Now, here is where it gets a bit strange. Artorias has a grave in the main time. This, of course, means that he is dead. This can be backed up by the observation that in order to live, Artorias would have to become the only boss that you don’t actually kill to defeat. This would make it so you couldn’t obtain his armor and weapons, which would piss off the player base, so yes, we will in all probability be killing Artorias.

    But you may be asking, “Why does that prove the existence of fate”? Well, if you think about it, it is really quite simple. You have already killed Artorias by the time your character gets trapped in the Asylum. Now, don’t take that to mean that you should start with the souls for killing him. That is obviously the “future” you. However, we aren’t talking about the death of some random peasant. We are talking about the assassination of Artorias, one of the four knights of Gwyn, the most powerful beings, both literally and politically, in the world. His death would literally cause enough chain reactions for the entire “present” to have changed because of that one event. The issue is that the world has already changed before you go back in time.

    There are only a few possible solutions for you still time-traveling to kill Artorias. One possibility is that by doing so, it puts your “future” in an alternate dimension, and From has to go through and re-tweak the entire game world. I’ll say right now that this is not the path they took. The other is that the universe is already “set in stone”. You already killed Artorias in the past, so in order for the universe to stay stable, you have to travel back in time to kill him in the present we have all played through a dozen times over. This in turn requires the entire situation to be close to exactly the same, which requires all the details leading up to those details to be the same, which goes all the way back to you killing Artorias!

    For those of you who are unaware, they have a term for this. It’s called Fate. There are rather convincing arguments for using it in the real world, but that’s not why we are here. Instead, we have just used it to describe why every last event in Lordran was destined to happen. It also explains WHY we are going back in time for no readily available reason!


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    Re: The Story Behind: How and Why

    Post by Shkar on Tue Jun 12, 2012 2:06 pm

    ^ How's that for my 1000th post?



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    Re: The Story Behind: How and Why

    Post by Spurgun on Tue Jun 12, 2012 2:24 pm

    I liked the food chain discussion more.
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    Re: The Story Behind: How and Why

    Post by Shkar on Tue Jun 12, 2012 2:34 pm

    Spurgun wrote:I liked the food chain discussion more.

    Damn, I thought I had gotten somehing interesting for post #1000. Oh well, it's too late now silly


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    Re: The Story Behind: How and Why

    Post by Spurgun on Tue Jun 12, 2012 2:35 pm

    Something wierd i just noticed. Frampt gives you 100 souls if you feed him a red slab, but he only gives you 50 for all the other slabs. Why?

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    Re: The Story Behind: How and Why

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