What change would you make to Magic...

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    meridam99
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    What change would you make to Magic...

    Post by meridam99 on Mon Jan 23, 2012 4:49 pm

    For me I would not have the Pyro Glove upgradable, instead scale with a stat or humanity (yes I know the chaos versions of pyro spells already scale with humanity) but I would also add a weapon buff and a Chaos version of the buff as well. Call the spell Immolation Blade and Chaos Immolation Blade. Sorry bored and thinking random thoughts.
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    Re: What change would you make to Magic...

    Post by Reaperfan on Mon Jan 23, 2012 4:59 pm

    The problem with Pyromancy and scaling is that they tied its non-scaling attributes to the lore (that the user draws Pyromancy's power not from the self, but from nature). Since stats and humanity have to do with the power of your character, it wouldn't seem to fit, though I could see something similar to the Crystal Ring Shield's old effect of the damage scaling off of the power of another weapon you were wielding. Or maybe even a timer style of scaling, that the longer you go without using a pyromancy with the glove out the more powerful your next spell becomes, up to a cap of course, kind of following the idea that a flame would have to build up before being unleashed, and constantly using the flame's energy would deplete its effectiveness (less energy = less heat = less flame, makes sense to me at least). This would at the very least make combustion spam less abusable.


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    Re: What change would you make to Magic...

    Post by Serious_Much on Mon Jan 23, 2012 5:03 pm

    I always like the idea of more powerful spells and flame causing more stamina depletion, so you couldn't overlevel your flame for low level build and needed to have a good amount of endurance to use high level flame effectively, maybe needing say, 45 to have enough stamina to cast Fire Tempest with maxed out +5 flame.

    Also yes, the game lacks a magic flame buff and the sound of a lava style blade (chaos covenant rank up) would be a good solution to that problem.

    Also, give Sorcery it's own covenant. It's lonely and left out in the cold a lot by the lore in the game.


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    Re: What change would you make to Magic...

    Post by sparkly-twinkly-lizard on Mon Jan 23, 2012 7:17 pm

    yes! sorcery cov required! special spell would be crystal body which would look similar to havel shields effect but blue and have same effect as kirks armor + phys def boost!


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    Re: What change would you make to Magic...

    Post by Scudman_Slayer on Mon Jan 23, 2012 7:22 pm

    increase the cast times of a few spells

    especially soul spear and crystal soul spear they just cast way too fast and are way to powerfull for such a smal amount of time to cast


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    Re: What change would you make to Magic...

    Post by Carphil on Mon Jan 23, 2012 7:25 pm

    I agree souls spear should be like heavy soul arrow, and don't complain because I am a mage and I know its too fast


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    Re: What change would you make to Magic...

    Post by Dj-B-Man-Jr on Mon Jan 23, 2012 7:30 pm

    So i'm not the only one who wants a pyromancy weapon buff, good to know, do you think we'll ever get one in a patch?
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    Re: What change would you make to Magic...

    Post by Serious_Much on Mon Jan 23, 2012 7:34 pm

    There is no way there would be extra things like that added in a patch though i suspect that there may be one added in when the DLC comes out! big grin (if the rumours are true that is)


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    Re: What change would you make to Magic...

    Post by ErrJon6661 on Mon Jan 23, 2012 7:49 pm

    I've posted this before in other similar threads but I would love to see a magic system like in two worlds. If you know what I'm talking about stop reading, if not then prepare for a rant >:]

    So! First off magic would be split into three basic categories, elemental (pyro) white (miracles) and black (sorceries). Like now (excluding pyro) your ability would to use each would be determined by your stats, fth, int and a third for elemental magic.

    Spells would be composed of modifiers (like the cards in two worlds but that wouldn't fit the lore in the Souls games, most likely scrolls or scroll fragments). The modifiers would include a carrier, and effect and modifiers.

    The carrier is the method of deployment. So missile for arrows, spears, balls for fireballs, AoE for force/wog, storm for fire storm, buff or enchantment and a few others that I cant currently think of.

    The effects would determine the type of damage that the spell would do. So there could be black magic/white magic effects doing magic damage based on fth and int. There would also be fire, lightning poison and physical damage modifiers scaling with various stats.

    Lastly modifiers work to change the spell works. These can do things like create more than one projectile, make the spell homing, add extra damage ect.

    Your stats would allow you to construct spells more or less effectively. The higher your relevant stats are the larger more complicated spells you can create. Attunement would still dictate how many spells you can have attuned, but it will also determine how many slots you have to create a spell. So a base level would be 10 att given you three slots. A carrier, an effect and a modifier. As attunement goes up you get more slots within each spell, ending at lets say 10 slots within each spell.

    Effects would be separated into schools. So for example certain effects would be int based, others fth or pyro based. carrier effects would not be based on stats. Some effects however would take more slots within a spell.

    Your fth int and (pyro) stat allow you to use effects within each school of magic. So having max att doesn't let you create massive spells unless you have the stats to back it up. So using int as an example, having a base amount of int gives you enough effects to create a simple spell, at max int you have enough effects to create a spell using 10 effects. If you have stats in both int and fth you can mix effects from both schools of magic.

    The same spells would still exist because they can be separated into these categories. So for example to make CHSM you would:

    Carrier: Soul Mass (2 slots)
    Effect: Crystal Magic (3 slots)
    Modifier: Damage(x3) Homing (4 slots)
    9 slots total, requiring high att and high int

    Simple spells would be much cheaper to create. So force would be:

    Carrier: Force (1 slot)
    Effect: Knockback (1 slot)
    Modifier: None

    this would take two slots, taking little faith and little att.


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    Re: What change would you make to Magic...

    Post by ErrJon6661 on Mon Jan 23, 2012 7:49 pm

    Oh, and pyromancy kind of has a weapon buff, if you count power within.


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    Re: What change would you make to Magic...

    Post by Maneater_Mildred on Mon Jan 23, 2012 7:55 pm

    I would like to be able to hold spells.
    Ie. Tap r1 spell fires as normal, hold r1 and spell is cast but waits till you let go of r1 before it fires.
    And free aim if you are holding r1.


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    Re: What change would you make to Magic...

    Post by Dj-B-Man-Jr on Mon Jan 23, 2012 7:56 pm

    Serious_Much wrote:There is no way there would be extra things like that added in a patch though i suspect that there may be one added in when the DLC comes out! big grin (if the rumours are true that is)

    Oh boy i hope so! big grin http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l8JCX9E0bEI
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    Re: What change would you make to Magic...

    Post by SuperMint on Mon Jan 23, 2012 9:29 pm

    Mages definatly need a covenant! (I'm not even a mage but I can see miracles are the favorite son in this game)

    That's probably what the dragon cov should have been tbh. Instead of using a slightly different red soapstone to gather scaled that give you a slightly different version of fire surge and force, make it a seath cov. He's the grandfather of magic and the only one of the four lords who doesn't have a covenant associated with him. Not to mention he's PERFECT for one. He's researching immortality scales, that's his reason for needing them. For joining you get the dragon eye which invades a world of someone who has a dragon scale. When you earn 30 scales, you get the channeler's set ,AKA Seath's snatchers, and their trident. After you get to rank 1, you also have the option of offering the soul of Priscilla (only boss in the game with only 1 weapon) to get the white dragon breath spell. badda bing badda boom there's your useful mage covenant!

    Also, am I the only one dissapointed that the awesome souls spear is just a slightly bigger magic arrow? Make that sucker a huge blue energy lance of awesometasticness!

    and fire weapon buff = all of my money, and it better work on Gwyn's sword!
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    Re: What change would you make to Magic...

    Post by Scudman_Slayer on Mon Jan 23, 2012 9:30 pm

    hey this game is the revenge of the miracles because back on demon's souls the only miracle worth while was second chance

    the rest was sorceries

    so yeah dark souls decided to make miracles more useful


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    Re: What change would you make to Magic...

    Post by BLA1NE on Tue Jan 24, 2012 3:09 am

    Sorceries definitely should not take longer to cast. They're just fine the way they are, in my opinion. Any faster and they'd be too hard to dodge, but any slower and they'd be totally useless for PvP. As it is now, it takes skill to hit someone with spells in PvP (unless you have lag on your side, but that's not my case). It easy for my opponents to dodge my spells, but if I time them right and aim them perfectly, I can land crushing hits. If the casting were slower though, any casting would = instant backstab. I already have to constantly be on my guard for that, but a fraction of a second slower and it would be impossible to cast without getting backstabbed.

    Keep in mind that the further away your opponent is, the easier it is for him to dodge the spell. So you have to be close enough to stand a chance to hit him, but not too close that he'll bs you. If casting were slower, that would completely break the delicate casting range balance there is now.


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    Re: What change would you make to Magic...

    Post by Eliteknight on Tue Jan 24, 2012 5:19 am

    Scudman_Slayer wrote:hey this game is the revenge of the miracles because back on demon's souls the only miracle worth while was second chance

    Yhea, we went from no weapon buffs to having the best ones in the game. Wrath of the gods got buffed to the point its the best thing to attune for pvp.

    I'd say faith users are doing pretty well now. big grin


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    Re: What change would you make to Magic...

    Post by aceluby on Tue Jan 24, 2012 12:03 pm

    I think magic is pretty close to perfect as is. Spells are hard to hit, but they hit hard. Casting time is really good as well, easily dodgeable, but doesn't leave a caster too open for bs unless they do something stupid.

    I don't think the need a cov either. Logan is basically it, but allows the user to either join a co-op or PvP covenant if they'd like.


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    Re: What change would you make to Magic...

    Post by strangejoy on Tue Jan 24, 2012 12:20 pm

    I think it would have been nice to have one low damage or really short-range sorcery with a really quick casting time. In demon's souls, mages had combust, which was ultra-quick but really short ranged. This sort of spell would make a pure mage build more viable and interesting.


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    Re: What change would you make to Magic...

    Post by Dj-B-Man-Jr on Tue Jan 24, 2012 2:08 pm

    @strangejoy
    ever heard of combustion or great combustion?? tongue
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    Re: What change would you make to Magic...

    Post by strangejoy on Tue Jan 24, 2012 2:42 pm

    Dj-B-Man-Jr wrote:@strangejoy
    ever heard of combustion or great combustion?? tongue

    Lol, I figured that was coming. The problem is that you have to switch back and forth between a pyro glove and a catalyst, and the pyro glove gets nothing from Int. I'd like to be able to seamlessly cast a few quick spells to throw my opponent off their guard.
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    Re: What change would you make to Magic...

    Post by BLA1NE on Tue Jan 24, 2012 2:54 pm

    You don't need to switch if you're dual wielding them! winking Works awesome, by the way.
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    Re: What change would you make to Magic...

    Post by strangejoy on Tue Jan 24, 2012 2:57 pm

    BLA1NE wrote:You don't need to switch if you're dual wielding them! winking Works awesome, by the way.

    True enough. I prefer wielding a balder side sword or a rapier mainhand, but I guess I could always use GC as my melee equivalent, although I like a little backstabbing now and again. lol
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    Re: What change would you make to Magic...

    Post by aceluby on Tue Jan 24, 2012 2:58 pm

    BLA1NE wrote:You don't need to switch if you're dual wielding them! winking Works awesome, by the way.

    Until you get backstabbed 3 times in a row.... I tried this setup and that was the only drawback... lots and lots of backstabs.


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