dark magic tests physical/magic split **UPDATED**

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    Glutebrah
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    dark magic tests physical/magic split **UPDATED**

    Post by Glutebrah on Sat Dec 15, 2012 5:08 pm

    this test was not to test damage but to test % of physical to magic damage.

    two characters, a 50int, 16str and a 16int, 50str were used.

    We tested it against the Havel shield 100% phys and 90% magic reduction. and the Crystal Ring Shield, 70% phys and 90% magic. this way the difference in numbers would be strictly physical damage.

    the naked show was just the control number so we can measure percentages.

    here are the results

    **Updated Results** ok so i realized i forgot to take the Dragon ring off which hindered the percentages some, so i retested the 50 int, 16 str this time with no Ring, and i included the Oocile catalyst. the results are added in.

    50int, 16 str, w/ dragon ring
    TCC:

    Naked - 541
    Crystal Ring shield - 70
    Havel's - 46

    Manus:
    Naked - 519
    CRS - 70
    Havel's - 42

    **NEW**
    50int, 16str, NO ring
    TCC

    Naked - 418
    CRS - 52
    Havel - 33

    Manus
    Naked - 403
    CRS - 53
    havel - 33

    Oolacile
    naked - 236
    CRS - 39
    havel - 19

    50 str, 16 int
    Oolacile:

    Naked - 273
    CRS - 41
    havel's - 20

    Manus:
    naked - 274
    CRS - 50
    Havel's - 11

    So in conclusion high str + manus catalyst is how you get high physical damage, as 50 str and manus catalyst had the highest % of damage go through the Crystal Ring shield (also took more stamina) and had the weakest going through Havel's

    when the Int is High the physical damage between TCC and Manus was barely noticeable. And while there is physical damage in those spells
    it is mostly magic as you can tell.

    **UPDATED Conclusion*** 50 str 16 int does more damage then 50 int 16str if the magic adjust is the same (Oocile Catalyst), but you can see the weaker one gets more through on havels shield, so that means it has a higher Magic base. so 50str just doesn't add physical damage it converts some damage to physical.

    Thanks to Bewolf for his help.


    Last edited by Glutebrah on Sun Dec 16, 2012 2:08 am; edited 2 times in total


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    Re: dark magic tests physical/magic split **UPDATED**

    Post by Ghadis_God on Sat Dec 15, 2012 5:15 pm

    Awesome findings Glute, I'm guessing the most powerful Dark Magic will be with the Manus cat at 50 INT and STR?


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    Re: dark magic tests physical/magic split **UPDATED**

    Post by RANT on Sat Dec 15, 2012 5:17 pm

    awesome +1


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    Re: dark magic tests physical/magic split **UPDATED**

    Post by Glutebrah on Sat Dec 15, 2012 5:18 pm

    Ghadis_God wrote:Awesome findings Glute, I'm guessing the most powerful Dark Magic will be with the Manus cat at 50 INT and STR?

    yea that was already common knowledge though, if you want damage Int is the number 1 stat as you can see. but this was basically to see what caused the magic to do high physical damage compared to magic damage.

    the higher the str with manus is the more the spell gets turned physical


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    Re: dark magic tests physical/magic split **UPDATED**

    Post by BLA1NE on Sat Dec 15, 2012 6:27 pm

    I just did some quick algebra based on your numbers:

    TCC, 50 Int & 16 Str

    Physical Damage: 80
    Magical Damage: 460
    %Physical to Magical: 15, 85

    There are always hidden decimals here and there in calculations in Dark Souls, so a total damage of 540 obtained algebraically based on the damage through shields, compared to your 541, is excellent. So the percentages are good.

    Manus, 50 Int & 16 Str

    Physical Damage: 93
    Magical Damage: 420
    %Physical to Magical: 18, 82

    This time my calculations gave me a predicted total damage of 513, compared to your 519... not ideally close. I don't know how reliable that makes those percentages...

    Oolacile, 16 Int & 50 Str

    Physical Damage: 70
    Magical Damage: 200
    %Physical to Magical: 26, 74

    Big physical damage on the Oolacile catalyst! I got 270 total damage compared to your 273--not too far off. However...

    Manus, 50 Str & 16 Int

    Physical Damage: 130
    Magical Damage: 110
    %Physical to Magical: 54, 46

    Huge physical damage percent on the Manus catalyst with high Str and low Int. But my calculations gave me a predicted total of 240, whereas you got 274 damage--that's way too big a difference to trust these numbers... I'm not sure how it happened, maybe I calculated wrong, but I can't find the mistake. Here's how I calculated:

    Spoiler:
    0.1y = 11 (Havel's shield blocks 100% physical damage, so we only need to calculate magical damage. 100% magical - 90% blocked = 0.1 magical damage -- 0.1y. 0.1y = 11 Damage)
    y = 110 (0.1y = 11, therefore 0.1y x 10 = 11 x 10, y = 110. The magical damage is 110)

    0.3x + 0.1y = 50 (Damage through the CRS was 50, it is the sum of the physical damage and magical damage that got through, which are 30% and 10%, respectively)
    x = 130 (0.3x + 11 = 50, 0.3x = 39, x = 130)

    Maybe I made a mistake when calculating Manus, but I can't see it. I did it the same as the others...


    Last edited by BLA1NE on Sat Dec 15, 2012 6:39 pm; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : made formatting more user-friendly)


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    Re: dark magic tests physical/magic split **UPDATED**

    Post by BLA1NE on Sat Dec 15, 2012 6:34 pm

    I wonder if going 50 Str & 50 Int with the Manus catalyst would just give us the sum of the physical damage from the 50 Str and the magical damage from the 50 Int, so 130 + 420 = 550?

    According to Rosie's research, 50 Int & Str with Manus does 566 damage... but that's on Hollow soldiers, which might have slightly less defense than a naked player--also my physical damage number might be low, since that came from the equation that way way off!

    But it's pretty close. Seems we could relatively accurately calculate expected damage for this spell, based on your Int, Str, and catalyst.


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    Re: dark magic tests physical/magic split **UPDATED**

    Post by BLA1NE on Sat Dec 15, 2012 6:44 pm

    Sorry for the third post in a row! Just wanted to say I'd be very interested to see damage for Oolacile at 16 Str. Just to see if the Magical damage remains constant while the Physical damage changes. That would make it possible to conclude that physical and magical damage are not related to one another, but calculated completely separately, each based on your Str, Int, and catalyst.

    +1 by the way! I really like your methodology.


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    Re: dark magic tests physical/magic split **UPDATED**

    Post by Emergence on Sat Dec 15, 2012 7:30 pm

    This is great research Glute, I'm glad you got it going. It really opens up Dark Magic for a very versatile approach. This is really the first magic that has dual scaling like that, and I'm glad to see some early confirmation that the percentage ratios change based on the stat spread. It's now opened up Dark Magic for some really cool research on it's thresholds, and how that spread can be applied. A high str low int toon now has what amounts to a really powerful physical projectile. At that point you can almost say the Manus isn't even a magic catalyst, and instead view it more like a gun!


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    Re: dark magic tests physical/magic split **UPDATED**

    Post by befowler on Mon Dec 17, 2012 11:52 am

    After we did the tests I took my 50 str 16 int char for a PvP spin and can confirm that DM is quite powerful keyed to high str, it guard breaks particularly well and at present few people expect an obvious str build to suddenly break out manus + DB. 16 int gives you some nice utility spells too, like hidden body (stops pursuers) and great magic weapon.

    Gold star to glute for his testing, and for keeping me safe from all the invaders. It's funny how many have issues when their opponent doesn't need to worry about mobs either.


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    Re: dark magic tests physical/magic split **UPDATED**

    Post by lordgodofhell on Wed Dec 19, 2012 11:32 am

    Hey Glute +1 man great stuff!

    Emergence court ordered a merging of info so I will just leave this here

    Dark Magic Test

    On the topic of Dark Magic, Black Flame appears to have 8.93% physical damage factored into it as well. I'm doing some more tests on it later today to verify the AR of the physical.


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