There's more to them54.833

    There's more to them

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    DoughGuy
    Duke's Archivist
    Duke's Archivist

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    There's more to them

    Post by DoughGuy on Tue Mar 27, 2012 6:59 am

    This thread is dedicated to finding out more about the NPC's you encounter in game, dead or alive. Preferably those less researched like Oscar or Iron Tarkus. So let us start.

    Because there is too much info to fit in 1 post, please see post 3 for sections not in the OP.

    Oscar:
    Very little is said of Oscar. Too many people see him as just the guy who gives you estus. But he's actually very important. Let's start with what the game gives you. He rescues you from the asylum, and only you. He's undead. According to his armour (the elite knight set)

    Armor of a nameless knight, perhaps an elite knight of Astora, based on the fire-warding heraldic symbol on it's blue surcoat.
    Although he was loath to give up on his Undead mission, he perished at the Undead Asylum, and went Hollow
    And his shield
    "Shield of a nameless knight, likely a high-ranking knight of Astora."
    "One of the enchanted blue shields. The Crest Shield greatly reduces magic damage."

    So we know he was a high ranking knight of astora. We know he was on a mission to the undead land of Lordran and we know he knew of the prophecy. What does this mean?
    It means Oscar attempted to ring the bells before you. I believe he succeeded in ringing the first bell (you can see it in the trailer here - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PsrNWNc2VCA) but failed to ring the second and the second bell.

    Note in the video from the link you can see Oscar opening the door in the painted world that provides the shortcut back to the bonfire. From this we can say he did manage to ring the second bell, killing Quelaag (see the seperate world theory below) and made it through Sen's. He was an ally of Tarkus so it is likely the two of them conquered Sen's together (Note Possbily not true. In a second video on the link it shows someone who looks a lot like Oscar fighting the Golem alone. It also shows Oscar moving through Sen's, triggering many of the traps. However I cannot tell whether this is simply gameplay material or not). We know tarkus died outside the painted world but whether he made it in or not is still debatable. However Oscar did make it inside.

    The only object inside the painted world that would be of enough reward to risk entering is the occult ember. In trying to take down Gwyn and the othr lords an occult weapon would be of great help. However he was unable to retrieve it. I believe he then exited the painted world and attempted to continue his quest.

    Now O&S. Whether Oscar made it past this point wil be difficult to determine. Whether the bosses can respawn or whether O&S are just animated statues is unknown. However if they had to be killed to get the lordvessel and could not be avoided this marks the end of Oscars quest. This is most likely the point at which he fails. New evidence in the form of his messages left in lordran proves otherwise. (See here -http://soulswiki.forumsrpg.com/t2497-knight-of-astora-hidden-signs). Oscar made it past O&S. Thus he either didnt kill them or they are animated statues that could be remade. Now here's the new thing that Skare brough to my attention Oscar's world is a different world to ours. This means when he kills a boss in his world that same boss can be alive in our world. However his world is close to ours and intersects often allowing him to free us from the asylum, for his body to appear in the garden and for us to see his signs. So we know that he killed O&S and made it to Gwynevere. He acquired a lordvessel and placed it at the kiln. This lordvesssel may be the one you can see behind you at the kiln. The nine smaller "cups" may also be realted to Oscar's quest - (Loses credibility due to the seperate worlds theory).

    It is clear that Oscar made it to the centipede demon and into the crystal cave, as he has left messages in both. He also at least entered the beginning of the tomb of giants (likely before that pinwheel stole the rite of kindling). This evidence shows he attempted to kill the lords to collect the lord souls. To add to this he laso made it as far as the abyss but could not enter as he did not have the covenant of artorias (he did however know he needed it). So here are the points in each area I believe he admitted defeat and moved on.

    New Londo - Just before the fog gate. Could not find/acquire the covenant.
    Lost izalith - Centipede Demon room.
    Crystal cave - I believe here he made it all the way to Seath but could not defeat the dragon. He found the final path to the primordial crystal and the only thing in his way were the man eater shells which he would easily be able to dispatch. He either lacked the knowledge that destroying the crystal would make Seath vulnerable or in his world the crystal was much larger and could not be easily broken.
    Tomb of giants - Tricky. I dont think he made it far here. I think the darkness proved too much of an obstacle and he barely penetrated it before realising he could not make it into the tomb without light. Unlike us he could not find a portable source of last he could use.
    After failing to kill any of thr 4 lords he finally admitted he was not the chosen undead.

    Thus he went all the way back to the undead asylum to free another undead, one who could finish what he couldn't. He obviously planned to help you on your quest but a metal ball to the face stopped that he was mortally injured before he could meet up with you. How is a mystery as the room he is in is sealed apart from the hole the door makes. Thanks to McTwisterson for pointing out there is a hole in the roof above Oscar. It appears he feel off the roof and broke his back/legs in the fall. Yukon pointed out he stands up to kill himself, it is more likely he was dying of internal bleeding or the like. He is also on top of the rubble, not under it making it unlikely the colapse of the passageway had anything to do with his injury. Despite hollowing and dying in the asylum you eventually find his armour in the darkroot forest. How? I believe he did not share the same time as you. After you kill his hollowed form he goes back to his own time, travelling Lordran as a Hollow until he finally met his final end in the forest.

    Something must be said about Oscar's mental fortitude here. Using Acidic's theory of cynicalism the fact that he failed to complete his quest without becoming hollow is shows great mental resilience. Especially to travel all the way from anor londo to the asylum without losing sight of his goals.

    Iron Tarkus:
    Possibly the best knight to have followed Berenike and definetily the strongest. One of the very few to make it to anor londo. We can guess that he was aiming to enter the painted world of ariamis. However we don't know if he made it in or not. (I plan to very soon enter Priscilla's area and talk to her wielding all of the equipment you find on Tarkus's body. I will report if she reacts differently - She did not). What was his motive for this? Was he attempting to avenge the gods? Was he an occultist trying to win back the dark ember? His armours high resistance to fire also says something about his character but I don't know what yet - Still puzzles me.

    Well we know that he was working with Oscar in lordran. It is likely he entered the painted world with Oscar in his attempt to find the occult ember. However in their escape from the world tarkus was injured by her scythe and unable to make it too far out, most likely he bled out not long after his escape. For a more detailed view of this read Oscar's section.

    Knight King Rendel/Ricard:
    I'm not saying these two are the same person. however at the moment that is still a strong possibility. Every othre NPC you here of eventually turns up as a person/hollow/dead yet Rendel does not and you never here anything else of Ricard. The signs point to them being the same person. The fact Rendel's ring and ricard are found in the same area also points to this. The fact Rendel also failed in Sen's leads to the question of where his body lies. His ring says - "This ring belonged to the Knight King Rendal. It grants its wearer protection by boosting
    defence against physical attacks. Of the many legends surrounding the Knight King Rendal,
    one of the more well-known speaks of his standing down a giant drake and slashing it to pieces."
    while Ricard's rapier says "A rapier with intricate decorations. Chosen weapon of the famous Undead Prince Ricard.
    Ricard's exploits are told in a monomyth."
    "He was born into royalty, but wandered the lands in a fateful
    ill-conceived journey. He became Undead and disappeared up North."

    Slashing a drake to death with a rapier is very hard though providing evidence against the two being one. Despite apparently being from seperate lands (Astora and Balder) it is theorised that Balder was a subland of Astora turning this evidence from against them being the same to them being the same.


    Lautrec:
    Lautrec, chosen by Fina, hunter of darkmoons and friend of a sealer. We knoe he has some sort of link to the firekeepers, being found near the corpse of one and killing a second. We also know he does not exist in your world. He wields twin shotels showing that he is an extremely skilled fighter
    Curved sword with sharply curved blade."
    "Created by Arstor, Earl of Carim. Requires great skill to wield, but evades shield defense to sneak in damage."
    and also confirms is he from Carim. Of note is that Shiva sells shotels, and that would have belonged to someone Shiva hunted or was hunted by. He also wears a red tearstone ring
    "The rare gem called tearstone has the uncanny ability to sense imminent death.
    This red tearstone from Carim boosts the attack of its wearer when in danger."
    further emphasising his offensive nature. He is a hunter, an attacker, not a defensive man.

    Now when you find him he is locked up and cannot escape, requiring a mystery key to open. How did he get captured? The only possible answer I can find is the channeller locked him up for Seath, obviously seeing the magics woven about him by Fina as something that would be of interest. However the mystery key is quite boring and seems to have little relevance. Now you can either free him or he frees himself. The fact he escapes himself suggests that he has not been in the cell for long. Upon being freed he gives you a sunlight medal, an item of the sunbro's. Now neither of his later companions are sunbro's suggesting that he killed another sunbro to get it. However he does help you out in 2 fights which Solaire can also help you. He and Solaire may have worked together at some point, Lautrec finding no use for the medal he got simply gives it to you.

    Now for his companions. When you invade him after he kills Anastacia he has a sealer and a nameless knight with him. The sealer is the third of the three who guarded new londo. However they abandoned Ingward to follow Lautrec. The knight I have not been able to identify and would be glad of any assistance. In dark londo they are hunting DM's, the warriors of Gwyndolin. This suggests a hatred between Gwundolin and Fina. Lautrec's dialogue is also interesting as he talks about a moth flitting towards a flame and thinking you were smarter than to invade him.

    All this leads to a very confusing motive when you look at his motives. He works for Fina a goddess, who would lose her power if the first flame went out. However he kills at least one firekeeper, a protector of the flame, and hunts down those who punish people who defy the gods, suggesting he is against the gods. By his armour we know that
    Helm/Armor/Gauntlets/Leggings- Apparel of Lautrec the Embraced, representing the goddess Fina's love.
    Helm/Gauntlets/Leggings- During his solitude, he forsook everything, for he believed in the goddess's love for him. he has forsaken everything but his love for Fina so he would do nothing against her. This then brings into question Fina's motives and who she really is.

    Rickert of Vinheim:
    Rickert is trapped in a cell in the area befor ethe new londo ruins. The best blacksmith in Vinheim and, if I remember his words correctly, he knew ol' big hat before he went hollow. Now Vinheim is a long way away from Lordran so the question must be asked why was he locked up all the way out here for his crime? It makes more sense for him to be locked up in the asylum than locked up in new londo. Therefore he must not have been locked up by whatever keeps the law in Vinheim but by either himself or big hat. This would also explain his lack of desire to leave his cell. If it is personal imprisonment/ imprisonment by a friend it would carry both the weight of the crime and the be a test of his own personal honour to stay in the cell. thus it is entirely possible he was locked up after New Londo was flooded,
    rather than before as commonly believed.

    Reviewing Rickert's dialogues it appears he does not like Logan that much. His voice sounds like he is sneering when he talks about Logan. He may consider him one of those "Uppity scholars" he appears to dislike. Thus it is much more likely he has locked himself up rather than Logan locking him up. On the small chance Logan locked him up he may not want to escape because he can't. If Logan used magic to lock him up it would be beyond his or the players power to break and he doesnt want time wasted trying to break out.

    Eingyi:
    A exiled pyromancer from the great swamp. His origins are one
    of the easiest to trace as muc his explained in game. I'll start by
    putting the quotes from his pyromancies here -
    Toxic Mist
    "Unique pyromancy crafted by Eingyi, considered a heretic even at the Great Swamp. Create intense poison mist.

    Why was Eingyi driven from the Great Swamp? One only need cast this
    pyromancy, a perverse diversion from the art of fire, to find out."
    [i]Poison Mist

    [/i]"Unique pyromancy crafted by Eingyi, considered a heretic even at the Great Swamp. Create poison mist.

    Eingyi became an egg-bearing Undead who serves a deformed young girl who speaks an untelligible tongue."

    His exile is less likely because of what his pyromacies do, and more likely because in order to create them he "perverted" the power of fire. His meddling with the flame branded him a heretic and he was forced to flee. Evidently he found blighttown similar to the great swamp, and in addition his poison and toxic pyromancies fit right in with the preferred weapons of the current inhabitants. However at some point he came into contact with the "great blight pus". Whether he came into contact before he reached blighttown and was forced to stop there because he was too weak or whther he contracted it there is unknown. What is known is that he found the white lady in the swamp. The white lady cried for him and then removed the blight pus from eignyi and swallowed it herself despite Quelaag's warnings. Her kindness towards him was too much and he became egg-burdened in order to better serve the white lady. The blight pus then mutated the white lady, preventing her from moving. It may also be the reason she cannot be understood.

    Shiva of the East (Thanks to Tolvo for this one):
    Shiva, one of the Clan Leaders of the Forest Hunters. An NPC who is loved by some for his trading, while others merely ignore his presence and kill his body guard for a certain gift of the Woods. This man is quite an experienced warrior, if a new player were to start combat with him they'd find that he can easily break shields and uses a wide variety of tactics in battle. There is a reason he is such an acomplished hunter after all. While trying to appear quite friendly there are hints of a darker side to Shiva. While he protects the forest and grave of Artorias he is also a scavenger. He mentions that the items he sells he claims in battle. Notice, he carries mostly exotic weapons of the east. Weapons that should be in the hands of people of his land, suspicious isn't it? After talking with him first and joining the covenant he will move to Blight town where he will sell his wares. Interesting choice of location, far from the woods and in such a dangerous territory. However, he is not ill prepared as his armor actually protects well against poisonous threats. His armor mentions, "Distinctive armor made in an Eastern Land.
    Exquisitely crafted, this armor offers excellent defense, particularly versus slash attacks,
    which are one of the main threats in battles in the East." Now while one might simply pass off this armor as being worn by Shiva to show off his origin, is it not possible he is not wanted in the east? He appears to claim wares from fallen eastern warriors, and wears armor that is well suited to protect him against their advances in combat. Fishy isn't it? As well he has managed to claim demonic weapons, which wouldn't be too far from his place in Blight Town. Yet, Shiva can attain these items even before the death of the Chaos Witch guarding the first bell. This Captain of the brigade deals in eastern weapons which are Katanas, however a question is why is a weapon, the Chaos Blade, born of Quelaag's soul an eastern weapon? Interesting enough that he would want a bodyguard and be mistrusted by Alvina, his "master." In regards to his companion, another easterner. This man carries, the Dark Wood Grain Ring, "This special ring crafted in an Eastern land is made of gold, but with a wood grain crest on its surface. Agents of subterfuge in this faraway land are particulary fond of the dark gold wood grain, which greatly alters its wearer's rolling action." Alvina had mentioned her distrust of Shiva, and the word Subterfuge should be a large clue. "Deceit used in order to achieve one's goal."-Subterfuge. That is one definition of the word, now then. A man who is possibly killing supposed kinsmen, having relations in blight town and amongst the Chaos faction, along with travelling between the
    forest and demon ruins. Something is going on with Shiva, he has plans that are very well hidden. In either case, this man is certainly not to be trusted, a cunning and deceitful Patches if there ever was one.

    It is also interesting to note that there is the garb of an eastern assasin (the shadow set) as well as the weapon of one (the iaito) in blighttown. Posiibly belonging to assasins sent after Shiva. Shiva also sells the weapons of those he has defeated, which include the weapons of an assasin. Why he would have these unless he killed an assasin coming after him?

    skarekrow13 wrote:
    Rather than summarize a longer post,
    Skarekrow decided to add this from Viral's thread directly into this one
    that the Server reminded him of these swords:
    Kora
    This one
    Or a curved version of this

    The Kora is the most interesting one as it was commonly used for either beheadings or rituals. I'll let your imaginations wander but what type of rituals use a sword that was designed for decapitating someone?

    Also, these are all from India and Nepal. While most of the time "east" is meant to refer to China or Japan, India certainly fits the bill nicely. Claw weapons were widely used in this region. Shiva's has three bladeswhich would be unusual but the handle is manufactured similar o a katar.

    Maybe "east" is meant to reflect a much broader area than we thought......

    Skarekrow then added that Shiva's armor has design elements in common with Indian armor as well in these links: this........and this
    Another interesting theory arises if we ignore the text dumps as a source of evidence. Perhaps Shiva was in Blighttown looking for the server. The server is an occult weapon used in ancint rites. Skare has found swords much like the server that were used in rituals that involved beheadings. Further the snake on the server is often a sign of betrayal in biblical texts and there is already evidence pointing to Shiva being a traitor. Linking the server to the chaos blade if the server is upgraded along the chaos path the desscription changes to "heretical energies". This is a much more prominent link to shiva as it is possible his betrayal consisted of heretical methods or teachings. He can also be linked to certain gods of death.

    Domhnall of Zena:
    My second favourite character in the game. A mysterious man who collects armour of those you beat in battle and appears to know the secrets of Lordran. Like Alvina I suspect this man has far greater power than he lets on. His armour shows that he has been awarded many times and earnt many titles such as the wise, the glorious, vanquisher and explorer. On a closer inspection it appers many of the medals on his chest are repeated. This weakens the idea that they are indeed medals and makes it moe likely that they are things he has collected. They also bare resemblence to th cions you find in game. But why is such a man playing the role of a simple merchant in lordran? Not once does he talk about himself or his land. Only when attacking him does he claim he is a peaceful man (odd for someone wearing gauntlets of the vanquisher, and when you kill him he mourns for the loss of his collection. A collection he happily sells to you.)

    Now in new game plus he sells you Lord Gwyns set. Now how did he get his hands on that? My most promising theory now is that Domhnall can manipulate the distorted fabric of lordran and go to different times and different worlds. Thats why he is in lordran, for here he can most
    easily collect his wares. Now for his locations in game. The end of the depths is an odd place to be. He would have little to know trade from anyone so why set up shop here? Then he moves onto the bridge at firelink, another hard to get too spot. However when he talks to you after you buy from him he speaks about seeing you again son and making another fine trade. He does not appear to want to hide, he appears to truly want to trade with people.

    There is also his connection to Seath. Dom sells crystal weaponry, weapons that can only be made with the crystal ember, an ember found in Seath's domain hidden away by a wall of golden light. He sells the crystal greatsword, a weapon that appears to have been grown from crystal, not ascended to a crystal weapon from a normal sword. This weapon only appears in one place in the game, in the hands of the crystal NPC who attacks you on your way to Seath. His ability to bypass the seal of Gwyn lends further evidence to my theory he can distort space and time to get to places others cannot acess.

    Griggs (Thanks to ENB and his research on the Vinheim school for the evidence in this one):
    Griggs is a young sorceror roaming Lordran in search of Logan. He was initially working with Logan but became seperated with Logan in the burg and got himself locked up. While he may seem like an innocent there is the possibility he has a much darker story. Griggs wears the black sorceror set which says -
    "Outfit worn by the secret sorcerers at Vinheim Dragon School.
    They secretly work with sound-based spells, and never reveal themselves."
    This is basically confirmation Griggs is, at the very least a Vinheim sorceror spook. So why would logan be working with a spook? Logan was banished from Vinheim 100 years ago for his "heretical" workings. Most likely scenario is that Griggs was spying on Logan, making sure his research did not go too far. Logan caught onto this and managed to lose Griggs in the burg so he could continue without being spied on.

    Now looking at Grigg's drops. He drops hush -
    "Sorcery developed by a certain surreptitious sorceror at Vinheim Dragon School. Masks all noises of caster.
    Effectively, Vinheim is controlled by the Dragon School, and it is no wonder that the town has its share of dark secrets."
    and the slumbering dragoncrest ring -
    "This ring was secretly worn by a surreptitious sorcerer at Vinheim Dragon School.
    The ring is engraved with an everlasting dragon in silent slumber, and masks all sound emitting from its wearer."
    he does not drop fall control but still -
    "Sorcery developed by a certain surreptitious sorcerer at Vinheim Dragon School. Reduce damage and noise from fall.
    This sorcery, along with Hush, explains the extravagant cost of hiring Vinheim spooks."
    Obviously hush and fall control were invented by Griggs. Inventing a spell would also been easy feat. Also he has invented two spells that are basically the bread and butter of the spooks branch. His spells may have even inspired Vinheim to add a specialised spook division. Therefore it is likely Griggs is much more senior, if only in the spooks branch of the school, than he first appears. This means the school deemed Logans work important enough to send one of their best and brightest spooks after Logan to spy on him. At the very least.

    Its also possible Griggs is acting as a go between for the Vinheim school and Logan. Because of his methods the school cannot afford to be associated with Logan, but they still want the spells he creates. To this end they send off one of their best spooks to follow Logan and return a copy of any spells he creates to the school. The proof here is in the description of the crsytal magic weapon spell -
    "Sorcery which improves upon Magic weapon. High magic augmentation : right weapon.
    At Vinheim Dragon School, only magic swordsmen on special orders are
    allowed to learn this spell which grants powerful augmentation to
    various weapons."

    The Vinheim school alrady has access to one of Logans crystal spells. A spell he did not develop UNTIL he made it into the archives. So Griggs managed to get a copy of the spell and send it back to the school. How he acquired it I am not sure. But he did manage to get it out of Lordran.

    Laurentius (Thanks to everyone for helping this one):
    Laurentius is a simple pyromancy user. A loner in his homeland (An odd note is that
    he has the face of someone from the east, not the great swamp. This brings a new development as we now know that even in the east pyromancy is considered primitive. The east may even be one of the advanced cultures he talks of) he travels to Lordran when he turns undead to “attune himself with the ancient arts”. However this is somewhat of a lie. The ancient arts are that flame sorceries, used by the witch and her daughters before the first flame was extinguished. These arts are now lost to man and gods alike. But he shows no interest in the izalith catalyst (belonging to one of the 7 sisters) nor the demon catalyst (belonging t the last master of the flame sorceries). Instead he shows great interest in the chaos pyromancies and the ascended pyromancy glove.

    Despite the instructions you give him to get to Quelana/the White lady he does not manage to make it to them. He instead goes hollow NEAR Quelana. Presumably he found the spot you were pointing him to then went hollow desperately trying to find her. This is due to the fact he does no have the require level of pyromancy needed to see her. His flame is not strong enough. He may also have been prevented from reaching the White lady by the barbarians throwing
    boulders at him. Another reason that he goes hollow.

    Now why was he in the depths originally? If he was originally searching for the ancient arts he may have been looking for power within. If a spell was hidden for hundreds of years that would make it ancient. Of course he could have already been down there searching for Quelana and just got kidnapped.

    Bishop havel the Rock (Again thanks to Tolvo for this one):
    Havel is an old member of Gwyn's military and possibly the strongest human in existence, if he is human that is. Over the years Havel grew a great love for the idea of martial skills, strength, endurance, and heavy armor. Due to this he grew to loath the vile magic of Seath the scaleless, and with his time even created miracles using unknown properties to combat magic. With this knowledge he passed it down to his warriors giving them the ability to easily combat magical foes without having to worry about their powerful sorceries tearing them
    apart. In regards to Havels prowess physically one need only look at his gear. The full Rock suit of armor, his massive shield, and tooth of an Everlasting Dragon. Something of note, Havel doesn't actually wear Havel's ring. That was a ring made for his soldiers so they could wear
    his armor, but the real Havel managed to carry all of this load with merely the muscles in his body, and still he can manage to run if need be. It goes without saying that while he does tend to rely on physical power, he has some interesting ties to miracles being the only known possible human to have created such magic. As well, he indeed fought in the war against the dragons and was quite successful. The question becomes though as to why he was eventually locked away. While it may seem it was too keep him out of trouble as a hollow, it almost seems a bit too convinient. Why that tower, why is the key held in the hands of that dead blacksmith? Maybe one should look to what is guarding that key, but a creature under the command of his rival, Seath. His title Bishop also gives him at least some sort of religious importance. Meaning more than likely he is related to the way of white, who are known for their clerics. Even more so a relation is that one of their clerics, Reah, can teach the miracles to others meaning it is at least
    taught within their church. It would also appear either he or a follower has left the scroll within the Ash Lake for an unknown reason. Odd that the spell of a man who slew dragons is found closest to the only known dragon outside of Seath. A place where the clams are also found that inhabit Seath's domain. Is it to be hidden away so that none could challenge him as Havel did? A powerful warrior capable of besting Everlasting dragons, a man of miracles working to fight magic, and a being of some relation to the church. Indeed too little is known of this giant of a man, given his influential status and lack of information.

    Dusk of Oolacile:
    Dusk is the princess of the destroyed kingdom Oolacile, a peaceful land famous for its gentle sorceries. The Ivory catalyst has been designed so that anyone who can cast a spell can cast it effectively. However at her birth Dusk was gifted the Crown of Dusk and the Dusk crown ring. The dusk crown ring increases the amount of castable sorceries at the expense of hp. While the bonus of the ring works well with our current understanding of Oolacile the negative effet does not. The usre of the ring is sacrificing their health for sorcery. They are using their life energy to cast additional spells, a technique regarded in most games and movies as evil.

    The crown of dusk is also suspcicious. The spells of Oolacile do no damage ... ever. They repair weapons, hide people and weapons, disguise people and create light. So why would Dusk receive a crown that boosts damage when no sorceries of her land do damage? Even the only miracle attributed to the land of Oolacile, tranquil walk of peace, does no damage.\

    Now how did Dusk end up in the Golem? To answer this fully there is a lot to understand, a bit of it speculation, but its almost certainly correct. What you see as Darkroot Garden is actually the ruins of Oolacile. Centuries past Seath destroyed the land because they were developing sorceries without his aid. Jealous he kidnapped their princess and killed everyone else, razing the kingdom to dust. He then placed Dusk in a golem to protect her while he researched her spells so he could unlock the secrets of them.

    Maneater Mildred (Another big thanks to Tolvo):
    A possible natural born denizen of the Great Swamp, cannibal Mildred has sort of a mysterious air about her that some are drawn to. While it is simple in that she is hunting for wandering souls to kill and feed upon their flesh it is also of interest that she is similar to the
    butchers in the depths. As well one guards Laurientus of the Great Swamp, a man who fears being eaten by some female. The Spider Witch andthe Gaping dragon are possibilities, yet these hollow men have no relations to them. Therefore it is likely the butchers are keepingg him for Mildred to eat. While they share the weapon and clothing of Mildred.It's possible she leads them, or that they are merely together in a clan killing together and feeding upon the meat of humans and possibly dogs or rats if food is scarce.

    Something of interest is that she is actually immune to the poisonous water of the swamp, even Queelana herself isn't immune. She also moves at full speed showing she has spent awhile learning how to move quickly in the swamp. It is possible she has escaped the state of becoming hollow via her feeding on living souls entering the swamp of blight town. As she feeds on those entering from the valley of drakes her kills are fresher than her compatriots thus providing more humanity. She seems to care little for modesty and instead only seeks to kill and feed rather than worry about her appearance. Her appearance also suggests her skill as a fighter. Her lack of protection signifies she doesnt get injured often, and when she does her natural resistance eliminates infection.

    What is still unknown is why she helps you kill Quelaag after she is defeated. She may see Quelaag as a threat to her food source or she might see Quelaag as a monster that even she cannot ignore.

    Xanthous King Jeremiah (Thanks to Skare for this one):
    At first glance, the word "Xanthous" suggests a possible place or origin for our King. However, the word Xanthous means "Yellow" or "Yellowish" which strongly suggests he was well known for his unique armor set. The armor is coincidentally also said to be of unknown origin. The armor's color is said to be so bright it "still stings the eyes." Parts as described as tattered. The word "still" and the tattered nature suggest he's old (and is described as legendary). The brightness of the armor reflect a likely desire to divert attention. By stinging eyes it is intended for his audience(s) to look away. The wrappings suggest he might be ashamed of his appearance, by wrapping his face away from the world. Both of these pieces suggest a possible deformity. Acidic has posted much about him being an egghead which could explain the wrappings. Acidic......you could be right. However, an alternative theory presents itself upon further examination. Jeremiah's name is known and, as mentioned above, is legendary. So, while WE do not know where he came from, presumably others do. Particularly as he is know for being an exile. Surely those who exiled him know where he came from. The armor's origin is specifically stated to be unknown, which may imply it was made after his exile. Perhaps our Bullfrog of a King is ashamed of his exile, and hopes to hide his face and attract attention away from his former self. Adding to this is the wrappings statement that it is "clearly far too big." A possible nod to an enlarged head but also a suggestion that it is an intended variation from the expectedsize (normal head) potentially as yet another distractor. Evidence to
    this occurs when we wear the wrappings without an egghead and they perform identically to the King's use.

    A problem with this is that he is known as the Xanthous King, indicating he likely came to be
    King after receiving the armor. However, his name may reflect a later claim that he made, as his legendary status is tied to his being an "exile." It appears his legend is tied to something after the exile. Like Conan before him, did he go on to conquer another land? Was he called this out of irony? Like my covenant namesake Little John.

    Jeremiah's weapon implies two possible character traits. The use of a whip, primarily good for unarmored opponents suggests a likely use for punishment purposes or "motivational" tactics, like the guys in the Temple of Doom, getting the kids to work harder. The thorns/barbs etc.
    on the whip add that he was particularly cruel. The enemies of the painted world are bloated and toxic and use fire. The easy connection is to the eggheads by Quelana. I would imagine that a chaos connections exists, however, there are notable differences. The eggheads, also
    develop bloated backs and spawn parasites when killed. The bloated warriors are afflicted with toxin rather than parasites and grow only from the head. Priscilla describes the inhabitants as "peaceful" in the Painted World, yet we find them not so nice to us. Perhaps Jeremiah
    and his whip have "motivated" them out of their peaceful ways. His use of chaos may be a trick he learned from them.....or....perhaps one he brought with him. Did King Jeremiah seek to become the King of the Painted World? He appears near cages which presumably bring new
    inhabitants. Is he there to meet them with open whip, to draft them into service? We come upon a hiding bloated hollow. Cowering, perhaps, he is as peaceful as Priscilla suggests. Priscilla also practices the peaceful ways, meaning she believes it to be a peaceful land. Is this an escapee who has gotten away from the tyranny of the Yellow King? His final gift to us suggests that their pyromancy is a learned gift that can be passed along, not an inherent one from the bloat itself. Did the Yellow King bring fire to the Painted World, a land where all evidence (doll, terrain, weather, Priscilla) indicates cold reigns supreme?

    Finally, Jeremiah's corpse is unique in it's position. He sits, behind Priscilla, waiting in eternity. Why is he there? The position suggests his end was not a violent one, meaning Priscilla did not kill him. If we can extend our experience, he could have walked off the edge and left at any time. Yet he didn't. I have two theories, one of which I believe has been stated. He sought to make Priscilla his queen and his love went unrequited. Similarly, he may have intended to challenge her for power and could not, but was spared to wait out his last days. A combination of the two theories is possible too (did not want to harm her after he met her). They both appear to be outcasts and he may have felt great empathy toward her. This could also be extended into the reason he seeks to create an army in the Painted World, to protect her.

    Andre (Another thanks to Tolvo):
    Andre is a large man whom which is old and wise. It is never stated exactly how long he has worked his craft but it has been long enough to be visibly shown on his bodies. While his legs are somewhat stubby and fat, his arms and chest are well toned and muscular from hammering away at metals and lifting heavy gear. Many scars cover his body possibly from the craft, possibly from a past life. He is aged enough that his hair has turned white, as well unlike many others his eyes are exceptionally wide. Bent is his nose, a typical mark of a fighter whom
    which has had it broken in many fights. His martial skill is unquestionable, for if he finds himself in combat he tosses aside any weapon near to him and instead holding up his fists. This may seem foolish, if not for his powerful wrestling akin tactics and strikes that hit harder than the fists of any in game without special weapons. Technically in this regard he might actually be the strongest NPC in the game, as he can easily kill a player if they are not fully prepared for
    the fight. He has an unknown relation to the church, as he handles embers that are exclusively involved with it, operates within an old church, and seems to show beliefs of a sort. He also takes the most embers of any blacksmith, and can upgrade weapons along the mosts paths
    making him possibly the most skilled blacksmith found in game. If defeated he drops a small amount of souls, but a decent amount of humanity, three to be precise. As one may notice he has very little trust in anything that can betray you. In fact upon dying he references his disdain for backstabbing, and back-stabbers. It would appear he has a high set of morals, despite selling weapons and armor of war. Oddly enough, there are a few characters in game that claim to be of Astora. Andre included. Yet, the others have similar accents, however Andre speaks like none of them. He doesn't appear to have any similarities to them really, it is possible though that he is a mere commoner of Astora, while the others are knights, and one a maiden.
    Still, it's interesting his location, near to a demon which he seems to pay no mind to. As well Andre shows really no worry about any of the many dangers around him, outside of the chosen undead's safety. He's also quite knowledgeable of the area for a man who seems to stay in one
    place. However that might just be due to him hearing from travellers who travel about and use his services. Odd though that he would know of the Grave of Artorias, have the Crest of Artorias, then claim that any who enter the forest never return. I wonder how he gained this crest then and knows anything of the forest if no information has come out of it to him. He also has somewhat an unhealthy fascination with weapons. Upon showing any embers to Andre he will seem incredibly eager just to create anything with it, though he who loves his job lives truly.
    Another thing of interest, Andre appears to craft many weapons and shields of knights from various lands. Mostly Balder, Berinike, and Astora. An interesting, powerful, and mysterious blacksmith indeed Andre is. Much of his past seems to be hidden away, as well he might be
    lying about both his name and land. Still, nothing concrete is known so what little can be found about Andre has been stated outside of extreme speculation.

    Nito, first of the dead:
    Nito, one of the four lords, a being with his own lord soul, overseeing death and disease. Let's start with his origins. There are currently 2 main theories of how Nito was born. The first is that Velka, or whoever the first firekeeper is, created Nito to be the God of Death. The other is that the lord soul literally created him, drawing the bodies together and granting it a sentience. Now in the artbook there are 2 side by side pictures of Nito. One with blue eyes and a skeleton in the middle and a second with a red glow in the ventre and lacking the central
    skeleton. What this tells us is although Nito is a collectivemass of skeletons there is a central skeleton that can be truly classified as Nito while the erst is for protection. Therefore I consider it more likely that Nito was this single skeleton touched by the lord soul, given "life" and formed his body around himself. I will present more proof of this further in.

    Now onto his motivations. Nito is odd in that he is the leas active force in Lordran. WhileSeath is out conquering and the BoC is spreading demons around Nito is quite happy to it down in his tomb and let events transpire. Viral theorized Nito wished to create an age of the dead owever I do not think that is entirely true. There are 2 possible goals that nito has and they are tied to either of his beginnings.

    If Nito was created by Velka it is possible he is much like an puppet, that he only works when given orders. If so it means he will remain buried in lordran until his creator returns to give him a new goal to work for. This explain his lax attitude to the pinwheel stealing the rite and the lack of retribution for kiling him if you're in his covenant.

    Now if Nito created himself/the lord soul created him it is now different. Nito may not have a true sentience. The proof for this is in his servants. The minor necromancers animate small skeletons, driving them to kill the player then reviving them when they die. The pinwheels are theorized to control the giant skeletons. They cannot revive them but they irder them around. In the same way the lord soul/the central skeleton acts as the necromancer for Nito's body,
    animating and controlling it.
    Tolvo wrote:Who's to say what is done with the Lordvessel if you link the flame? What if his servants could get it back and revive him through that, or if he already lives on in them, sort of like how the dark soul lives on through humanity. Nito might be one smart cookie, having basically a situation in which no matter what he doesn't lose anything more than a mass of bodies.

    It could also be as you said, he just doesn't care about his own existence. Maybe he understands only a cause, but not identity. In that regard Nito might not actually be totally sentient, which is so bizarre it kind of fits if you ask me.

    In this case it is more likely that Nito is working towards his own agenda. Based off the infinitely spawning baby skeletons it can be seen that Nito wants to propogate the dead, creating millions. In this case its possible he was creating an age of the dead.

    Ingward and the Sealers:
    There were originally 3 sealers. Ingward, who still stands vigil, Yulva, who left to use her healing spells in Blighttown and a third unnamed sealer who now fights with Lautrec. Firstly it is likely these sealer are all undead themselves or belong to the same race as the solver knights do. They were alive when New Londo was flooded centuries ago and still live today, a feat no human could pul off. However a second idea arises. All 3 sealers were accomplished healers. It possible they created a rejuvanation spell before they left to stand guard and have been continuously casting it to keep themselves alive.
    For their motives Yulva
    "Sorcery of the red-robed Yulva, one of the Sealers of New Londo. Reduce bleeding and poison build-up, and undo various poisonous effects.
    One of the New Londo's unique healing sorceries. Perhaps she abandoned her Sealer duty to take her healing arts back to Blighttown."
    Obviously one who wished to do good for the world Yulva wished to try and cure Blighttown of the disease that ravaged its inhabitants. However her sealer uniform and her main spell are found on a body and in a chest along a tree root above the swamp. The location makes sense,
    she obviously hid herself up there so she wouldnt be attacked by those inhabitants too far gone for help. The sorcrey was in the chest for storage. Basically the area she is found is what passes for a posh doctors office in blighttown. Who killer remains unknown. However the positioning of her body, slumped against the wall indicates a non violent death. It is likely she caught one of the numerous diseases that ravage the place and either could not heal it or did not notice it
    in time to heal it.
    Ingward is the only sealer who retains his duty. He continues his vigil while his 2 companions fled. He is very knowledgable of the area he guards too, informing you you need Artorias's ring to fight the kings. Of note is he also talks about learning from Artorias, as if he still lives and is a friend to the sealers. This has repercussions. It means either New Londo was flooded and Ingward went on vigil before Artorias changed sides or that Ingward knew Artorias after he fell to the dark and was still friends with him! I'm inclined to believe the first as the second goes against everything that Ingward continues his vigil for. He also recognises you have the lordvessel and actually knows what you mean to do. This alone shows the prophecy of the chosen undead was around all the way back before new londo was flooded!
    Now onto the last sealer, the one who annoys me the most. The one who fights with Lautrec. There is literally no lore on this guy in game. Unfortunately at the time of writing the only pic I have is here - http://s1061.photobucket.com/albums/t464/SuitonSaiRyuda/NPCs%20of%20Lordran/?action=view¤t=LautrecsSorcerer.jpg (props to TheTruth for it) where you cannot see his face properly. However even if I could discern his origions it does not help us much (though I suspect he is from carim). His helping of Lautrec hints that he is friends with the man or at least other followers of Fina but ther is nothing to confirm that.

    Crossbreed Priscilla, the Painted Queen (thanks to Skare and Fed for the help):
    skarekrow13 wrote:Ok....rant engage:



    Let's start with her soul.....

    "Soul of Priscilla the Crossbreed, trapped inside the painted world of Ariamis.

    Special beings have special souls. Use the soul of this crossbreed
    bastard child and antithesis to all life to acquire a huge amount of
    souls, or to create a unique weapon."


    The first think that jumps out is the word "trapped." I don't buy "imprisoned" since I am sticking to my "drawn in" theory but perhaps the loss of the doll indicates that she can no longer travel back and forth. Next words of note are "crossbreed" and "bastard" child. This suggests that she is not an experiment in the strict sense (test tubes, Frankenstein rig etc.) but could be an experiment of what happens when two species mingle. The use of crossbreed reinforces the idea of her parents being different species. The word "bastard" implies that she has two parents but they weren't married. The alternative term is "illegitimate" and most often refers to a child that occurred as the result of an affair. I hadn't noticed the term "antithesis of all life" prior to today but it fits nicely with the rest of the discussion. This could mean a couple of things. The obvious is an existence dedicated to ending life. Another interpretation could be that she is contrasted to "intended life" and in this case it reinforces her "abomination" label.

    However, I'll come back to it after discussing her weapons for what I think is a third meaning.

    Priscilla's dagger:

    "This sword, one of the rare dragon weapons, came from the tail of Priscilla, the Dragon Crossbreed in the painted world of Ariamis."

    "Possessing the power of lifehunt, it dances about when wielded, in a fashion reminiscent of the white-robed painting guardians."

    And her Scythe:

    Scythe born from the soul of Priscilla, the stark white crossbreed trapped inside the painted world of Ariamis.

    Even the Gods feared Priscilla's lifehunt ability, and in the hands of a mortal, its power will turn upon its wielder.

    Both weapons have similar features and point to the possible real nature of the word "antithesis." Lifehunt I believe is often mistaken for the "bleed" effect on the victim. This seems to be confirmed by Priscilla's Scythe and it's ability to turn on a mortal as it inflicts bleed on us as well. The dagger contains the power of lifehunt as well, and the only similarity in effect between the two is bleed damage. I believe that this is merely the mechanism to show in game what the weapon should actually do to you. A paradox exists with this weapon and the dagger.
    The scythe states that the God's fear the power of Lifehunt, yet the dagger is armed with occult energy, what the gods supposedly are weak against. Yet the dagger does not mention gods fearing the power of lifehunt. What could this mean? The bleed and occult damage are fine and dandy but lifehunt is a different power. One to be truly feared. Yes, the bleed damage can destroy an opponent (Asylum, Firesage, etc.) and the occult can be nice as well. However, the bleed effect is not easily triggered on the Gods, and the dagger's increase in occult damage isn't
    sufficient to outperform "regular" weapons. So what do the gods really fear......

    Losing their soul. Not death. Their soul......completely obliterated. No rebirth....no passing go to collect $200.....game over man. This is the true lifehunt ability and the "antithesis of all life." Not the "ending" of life but the disintegration of it's core. The scythe provides the best glimpse of this. It states that the power will turn on a mortal. The bleed kills us and obviously game mechanics don't allow for permanent Chosen Undead death or even respawning mob perma death. The scythe only provides a glimpse into this theory though. The real sinister evidence is in the dagger. Note in the description of the attack form that the dagger dances. Not "the user attacks in a dancing manner." The dagger controls the attacks, not the wielder. A dagger that is living and possibly sentient and potentially malevolent. This is lifehunt. The weapon takes control. In your hands it controls the attacks and hunts for the life (souls) of others. It stands to reason the scythe is the more powerful weapon, with a higher lifehunt. The control this weapon
    exerts on you is obviously not benign. As it seeks to end the lives of others, it seeks yours as well. It makes sense then that both weapons require high dexterity to unlock their full potential. It would take a feat of agility to keep up with a weapon that dances of its own accord.

    Federally......You could be onto something that they're merely responding to a threat in this world. I only have two pieces of evidence against that and they're far from flawless. The first of the two pieces is Priscilla herself. She doesn't attack on sight. If she's confident enough to talk to you first rather than a sneak attack from the fog gate it stands to reason she could have the rest stand down. Also, she might be able to communicate telepathically. I don't believe her lips move while talking, and I have confirmed that several important NPC's do a talking animation (Quelana is enchanting to watch speak). So she could ask you to be peaceful as soon as you step in. It could also be that when you reach her negotiations are a last resort. The second evidence piece is the bloated hollow who is hiding and doesn't attack you. His location is pretty far off the main path so he should have a reaction when you find him if he was hiding from you. Also, he has a window and appears to be sorrowful. Is he looking out and weeping at what happened to the world? Finally with this guy, he drops a pyro spell which I theorized before could mean that pyro is not native to the world/bloated hollows as it demonstrates a clear passing of the torch (ha ha get it?) of this skill. Pyromancy does seem contradictory with the rest of the world. It could still be though that he thought he had a hell of a hiding spot and is too terrified to attack you.

    Federally wrote:She talks to you because she is merciful. She does not fear you, she is Priscilla the Half Breed with powers even the gods fear! She is not threatened by a mere undead, so she decides to give you the chance to escape her Lifehunt ability, and permanent death based on your post, by giving you the opportunity to leave peacefully. She simply has the wisdom to realize the others may have misunderstood your intentions so she gives you the chance to use the only exit, incase you were simply trapped and wanted to leave.

    Also um I was under the impression Prisc was Seath's daughter and this was common knowledge. Did I just get this idea in my head somehow or am I missing something? It seems to me Seeth (Seath?) procreated, through means unknown, with an undead or maybe a god during his experiments. Since she has a boss soul I would think maybe both parents need to have special souls too so a normal undead or human wouldn't work. Guess I'm just rambling
    now.

    skarekrow13 wrote:The common theory is she's Seath's and Gwynevere's daughter. Fed....that makes a lot of sense too. Like I said, I don't know if I agree but your guess is as good as mine for sure. The telepathy possibility is really my biggest hang up because you're right. She shouldn't fear us at all. Until we teach her otherwise. Not that I've killed her three times or anything. My hang up is that she seems to plead for the inhabitants of the world and not just herself. If she can think at us strongly enough across the world I would believe she'd reason with us before we slaughter everyone. I feel she either thinks the hostile inhabitants don't have a place either and are refusing to leave or she's not wholly aware of what's going on. Again, this theory is a big assumption on my part since it necessitates that she can communicate with her mind, has the desire to do so, etc. And this post is really just to continue discussion since we're having a great one at the moment.

    Hellooo, that's not a bad theory and haven't done anything on the goings on of the Painted World beside Pris, Jeremiah and Ariamis stuff. I know there's a lot of thought out there resulting
    from the Occult ember, Velka stuff etc that I haven't delved into. It could be that there's a warped Nito element in her. In my theory though I would differentiate between Nito's power and Lifehunt. Nito has power of death, which seems like the antithesis of life. However, the
    game is built on the concepts of reincarnation and ressurection which mean that death is actually just a section of life not the opposite. Nito's good buddies are a good example of this as he brings them back from the dead, meaning his power is to partially restore life or at least animus. He does know a few ways to kill (miasma in the opening, hand to hand, sword dance) but Nito is fairly well linked to death as rebirth. Priscilla could be too, since my ideas are definitely not fact but it seems that death and life aren't opposites in this game.

    The above is information on Priscilla, her soul, her past and her power. Since that is so well covered I will try to focus more on her motivations and what she has done. Firstly I will examine Priscilla's connections to Seath and the occultists. Seath is virtually the only candidate to be her father. No other dragon is in a position to be it so it is all but confirmed he is her father. Her mother is more contentious, with people split between Gwynevere and Velka. The main evidence for Gwynevere is due to her size. She is the only person big enough to be the mother. However that is only an illusion and it is far more likely, using the statues as evidence Gwynevere was much smaller thus removing her as a candidate. In opposition Velka's size is unknown but she is linked to Priscilla through varipous statues (the evidence is presented elsewhere so I wont try to dig it up). So we now have her parents locked down. Their influence is notable. Seath appears to have driven the gods from anor londo but how? He has his crystal hollows and channelers but they are outside of the city and are unlikely to stand up to the sentinels and knights. Priscilla on the other hand is within the city, hidden with many occult weapons. She has an army of hollows within the city that could all have been armed with occult weapons courtesy of the blacksmith. At Seath's request she could easily have taken the gods by surprise, attacking from within and driven them away. Her lifehunt power would certainly be
    enough to scare the gods away rather than face her in combat and risk eternal death. Now her relation ship with the Exile King (sorry if I steal anything you said Skare). It is likely that like Priscilla he was shunned by the world and forced to flee to the painted world. The position of his corpse suggests he had a close relationship with Priscilla. He spent his last moments with her. It could also be that he attempted to flee the painted world before he died to find a healer. After all Lautrec has a sealer with him, both from Carim, and the sealers are closely associated with Velka. But then there is the fact he does not appear on your way to Prisc but rather in an optional area, one which resembles an execution spot and hides another pyromancy. So rather than Priscilla's protector he appears to be an executioner. The surges certainly would be effective execution techniques to be used on prisoners as they flee their cells. But enough of the pyromancer.

    What of Prisilla's powers? Her invisibility is interesting. Even the sorcerors of Oolacile could only bend light around your shape, not turn you completely invisible. Yet even then there are no connections to Oolacile. Except for Seath. Seath is the most likely culprit for Oolacile's destruction. He uses the ruins as a hiding place for many of his valuable items but most importantly he holds Dusk. Dusk was a princess with a crown that boosted the power of sorceries. Using her knowledge with her crown and her ring Seath could have easily bred the
    magic of Oolacile into his daughter. This could have resulted in her power surpassing what normal mortals could do. Ther is also a second theory. The doll says she was "drawn into" the painting. Skare has pointed out Ariamis may have literally drawn her into the painting. So
    what if this isnt magical invisibility? What if she literally becomes part of the painting for a time? Her footprints do not disprove this, rather they act as proof. The footprints represent her moving while part of the painting. This is a disturbance in its fabric and results in the footprints.

    Changelog:
    Added Rickert
    Added Eignyi
    Added Tolvo's Shiva
    Added more on Shiva
    Added more on Oscar
    Error Checkig and re-organising
    Added Domhnall's draft
    Got that video working
    Added note of Oscars mental resilience
    Added Griggs
    It's Rickert not Rickett. Added more on Rickert.
    Added mor on Griggs
    Added Laurentius
    Added Tolvo's Havel
    Updated Oscar based on new evidence
    Added Dusk
    Added Maneater Mildred
    Fixed up Dom and Tarkus
    Updated Oscar based on separate worlds theory
    Added Skare's King Jeremiah
    Redid Lautrec
    Added Andre
    Added Nito
    Did a bunch of formatting
    Added new info on Shiva
    Added Ingward and the Sealers
    Added Crossbreed Priscilla
    Figured out how Oscar died
    Added Logan


    Last edited by DoughGuy on Mon Dec 10, 2012 10:55 pm; edited 35 times in total

    JY4answer
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    Re: There's more to them

    Post by JY4answer on Tue Mar 27, 2012 8:35 am

    Just a quick mention on the Elite Knight set we pick up in Darkroot Garden. I don't think it has to be the same set Oscar was wearing. Afterall, Prince Ricard wore the set too. Its possible other elite knights of Astora have fallen there.

    DoughGuy
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    Re: There's more to them

    Post by DoughGuy on Tue Mar 27, 2012 8:38 am

    The reason I said it was Oscar's is that the description of the set you pick up is very possesive. "Armour of a nameless knight" "Although he was". It makes more sense for it to be someone elses but the description implies possesion.
    Seeker Logan (Thanks to Tolvo for his help):
    DoughGuy wrote:[8:42:18 PM] Tolvo: If Crystals are
    focused souls that act as conduits for sorcery.
    [8:42:28 PM] Tolvo: Where do these souls come from?
    [8:42:50 PM] Tolvo: As they seem to have no relation to the souls of hollows and others.
    [8:43:04 PM] Tolvo: Are sorceries, instead of energy of others, energy of one's own soul?
    [8:43:12 PM] Tolvo: Which asks, shouldn't sorcerers have the largest souls of any?
    [8:43:19 PM] Tolvo: What is manipulated, what is soul energy?
    [8:43:35 PM] Tolvo: How does Logan experiment with this energy?
    [8:43:38 PM] Tolvo: What is the cost of using it?
    [8:45:19 PM] Tolvo: As well, why would Logan use a Scimitar?
    [8:45:21 PM] Adam "The DoughGuy": Why did magical theory 201 die?
    [8:45:29 PM] Tolvo: Because I wasn't around.
    [8:51:02 PM] Adam "The DoughGuy": You can link his scimitar to the wanderer set I think
    [8:51:54 PM] Adam "The DoughGuy": Logan is a seeker, he;s just a wanderer with a goal
    [8:52:35 PM] Tolvo: Here is a good qeustion, why would Logan want to be like Seath?
    [8:52:55 PM] Adam "The DoughGuy": Ah, immortality and powerful sorcery
    [8:53:07 PM] Adam "The DoughGuy": Infinite time to reserach more sorcery
    [8:53:08 PM] Tolvo: Is that something a scholar would want?
    [8:53:13 PM] Tolvo: Power?
    [8:53:25 PM] Adam "The DoughGuy": Is he really just a scholar?
    [8:53:35 PM] Tolvo: Logan's intentions don't seem as simple as originally thought.
    [8:53:52 PM] Tolvo: A Scholar would not focus entirely on offensive magic.
    [8:54:03 PM] Tolvo: Note, everything Logan creates is offensive, or has combat uses.
    [8:54:17 PM] Adam "The DoughGuy": lol just let me find the quote I just saw
    [8:54:37 PM] Tolvo: "That's a nice fanny Logan has."
    [8:54:44 PM] Adam "The DoughGuy": "The Vinhelm school may be a military trainer of sorts"
    [8:55:09 PM] Adam "The DoughGuy": He was expellled from the order yet Griggs folllows him around.
    [8:55:51 PM] Tolvo: Here is a good question also.
    [8:55:56 PM] Adam "The DoughGuy": Heres a question, is he still "working" for the dragon school?
    [8:55:58 PM] Tolvo: Why couldn't Logan get through Sen's?
    [8:56:08 PM] Adam "The DoughGuy": ^Why couldnt griggs?
    [8:56:19 PM] Adam "The DoughGuy": He had all of Logans spells, yet he also failed
    [8:56:30 PM] Adam "The DoughGuy": What stops a mage in Sens?
    [8:56:32 PM] Tolvo: It's odd.
    [8:56:51 PM] Tolvo: Considering Griggs specializes in stealth magic.
    [8:56:58 PM] Tolvo: Meaning he would have a higher chance of surviving anything.
    [8:57:16 PM] Tolvo: As well every enemy in Sen's can easily be defeated by spells.
    [8:57:22 PM] Tolvo: Not to mention why did they end up in cages?
    [8:57:30 PM] Adam "The DoughGuy": Seath
    [8:57:41 PM] Adam "The DoughGuy": The man serpents must be under him
    [8:57:48 PM] Tolvo: What would Seath want fromo them.
    [8:57:53 PM] Adam "The DoughGuy": Obviously Logan thought there was something in Sens that could help him
    [8:57:56 PM] Tolvo: Unless the idea is to experiment with the Crystals.
    [8:58:13 PM] Tolvo: Meaning, Sorcerers make for better test subjects for Seath.
    [8:58:16 PM] Tolvo: For Crystals.
    [8:58:23 PM] Tolvo: While physical creations work better on faith users.
    [8:58:32 PM] Adam "The DoughGuy": Could their souls be more "malleable" into crystals?
    [8:58:35 PM] Adam "The DoughGuy": Due to their exposure?
    [8:58:44 PM] Tolvo: Or maybe it is that their souls are stronger.
    [8:58:48 PM] Tolvo: So there is just more to work with.
    [8:59:07 PM] Tolvo: Maybe Logan wanted to be a test subject? By then he wouldn't have escaped.
    [8:59:44 PM] Adam "The DoughGuy": Yes, perhaps he made it to the golden fog but couldnt get thorugh
    [8:59:53 PM] Adam "The DoughGuy": so he got captured in the hopes he would be taken to Seath
    [9:00:08 PM] Tolvo: As well he faced Seath and lost.
    [9:00:12 PM] Tolvo: Which is interesting to note.
    [9:00:18 PM] Tolvo: Another NPC actually fought one of the bosses.
    [9:00:41 PM] Tolvo: Why would he want to kill Seath?
    [9:01:47PM] Adam "The DoughGuy": To take the crystal from him? To prevent him interfering with his own research? To find out his secrets? For the MLGS? Because he tried to bargain with Seath and failed?
    [9:02:08 PM] Tolvo: Logan had access to Seath's archives.
    [9:02:24 PM] Tolvo: He had access to his prison and other areas.
    [9:02:28 PM] Tolvo: He had all the resources he wanted.
    [9:02:41 PM] Adam "The DoughGuy": Did he? You only see him in the archives after his defeat.
    [9:02:44 PM] Tolvo: And killing Seath would mean destroying the primordial crystal, thus shattering the hope of immortality.
    [9:03:20PM] Adam "The DoughGuy": Perhaps he went straight to Seath. try to get in on his research? rather than starting from scratch
    [9:03:42 PM] Tolvo: So a failed confrontation.
    [9:03:48 PM] Tolvo: Yet Logan knew he was immortal.
    [9:03:55 PM] Tolvo: But he still tried to wound him in defense.
    [9:04:06 PM] Tolvo: Though I suppose that can go with testing the matter of Seath's body.
    [9:04:13 PM] Tolvo: It all just seems so, pecuiliar.
    [9:04:26 PM] Tolvo: Killing Seath and Shattering the Crystal doesn't seem to be a problem to him.
    [9:05:40 PM] Adam "The DoughGuy": And once again we find there is so much more to a NPC
    Tolvo wrote:Big Hat Logan
    The aged and ever exploring scientist and researcher, of relation to the Dragon School of Sorcery. A master of bending souls and experimenting with them, he is known for the creation of the Soul Spear, and Homing Soul Mass Spells. Odd that Beatrice, a witch of old would know the spell of Logan considering they would have lived hundreds of years apart from one another. It is known he is over a hundred years old, acting as a scholar while undead. However,
    the never do explain a maximum meaningit is possible his pioneering of the Homing Soul Mass could have been centuries ago, or that an issue with time in the land allowed for a cross over. Either way he appears to be a man searching for greater knowledge, often being captured in his pursuits similar to his apprentice Griggs. Curious that Griggs seems to focus more on stealth based sorceries of the Spooks of Vinheim, along with that Logan appears to show a bit of personal care for Griggs. It gives off the appearance of a caring master sparing his servant of the risks of his endeavors, however it might seem more so that he is worried about Griggs reporting his work to the Dragon School. Though even then it could all be coincidence and Logan still has some ties to the old school. At some point he managed to fight with Seath the Scaleless and studied him during he bought before being defeated and captured. It would seem there are a few possible ideas Logan was after, Immortality, Understanding, and Power. Immortality as his focus on Seath's seeming immortality. Understanding as his constant mention of wishing to know the extents of sorcery. Power as everything he teaches and learns focused on power rather than anything indirect. Logan also showed great interest in becoming a dragon, more than likely following one of the three earlier mentioned ideas. While some believe it to be so at the end he does not turn hollow, rather he has lost his mind instead and appears to be fully human wielding a scimitar.

    I thought I'd help you out a bit Dough, this isn't complete but you can add more to it of course and touch it up. I just thought I might give a bit support.

    Logan is an interesting fellow. Unlike many NPCs in Lordran his goals and movements are easily known and followed. He begins trapped in Sen’s, moves to firelink and finishes in the archives, all places easily accessible by walking. He searches for the regal archives and the
    knowledge stored within. What isn’t clear at this point are his motives, and there are quite a few surprises.

    For example his starting point in Sen’s. Locked up in an area easily bested by a relatively new fighter, the chosen undead. How did a master of sorcery get trapped? Well the link is in the serpent guards. We know Logan wanted to reach Seath and learn from him, what if he got himself captured on purpose? If he was captured by the snake men they may take him to Seath themselves, thus fulfilling his goals. Of course this didn’t turn out; he simply gets stuck in the cage until he is rescued.

    At firelink he offers to share his sorceries and interacts a bit with Griggs. I have already covered
    Griggs’s possible involvement with Logan as has Tolvo above so I will not repeat myself.

    Now it’s very interesting that the next place you find Logan is locked up again in the regal archives. How did he get locked up? And more importantly why? His motives cannot be the same as before, he has found Seath. Well you, the chosen undead, are locked up after fighting and losing to Seath, who heals his wounds instantly. When you talk to Logan he shows knowledge that Seath heals very fast. Well a big surprise, Logan actually fought Seath. He obviously came to Seath hoping that he would help him in his search, or at least allow him to search through the archives. Instead Seath attacked him. Logan fought back with his magic, obviously injuring Seath but the dragon healed himself. From this Logan discovered the primordial crystal, and helps you. After escaping he remains in the archives, now able to access all of it.

    Now onto Logan and his magics. He’s a very suspicious fellow, getting kicked out of the dragon school. Escpecially after the sort of work he has done inventing things like homing soulmass and soul spear. Griggs mentions at one point that Logan was banished from the school for his heretical ways. If we look at the description of homing soulmass -
    "Sorcery developed by Big Hat Logan:
    Homing soulmass. Life originates in the soul; no wonder the soulmass draws toward it. This sorcery is a window into seeker Logan's methods."


    J
    ust from reading the description you can infer Logan was obviously very closely studying the soul, perhaps too closely. Like Da Vinci he may have taken to studying on actual humans, unlike Da Vinci the specific mention of life in the description would mean Logan’s subjects were still alive (I would like to connect him to the Earl of Carim). At this point with his research heretical but his results effective he was banished yet supervised, so any more spells could be added to the Vinheim archives.

    Rogue Witch Beatrice, contains minor spoilers, thanks to ThatPerson for this one:
    She is a mage who didn't study in the
    Vinhelm Dragon school, so she learned all her sorceries from her elders,
    and even inherited their Catalyst. Which is odd, considering she knows
    the spells Soul Spear and Homing Soul Mass, which was made by Seeker
    Logan. She also was one of three who braves the Abyss, the other two
    being You and Artorias. In one of the pictures she was in, she was seen
    casting Dark Magic, and is summoned in Darkwood Garden, which is
    Oolacile in the present era and New Londo. Also, since she is in
    Lordran, she probably is an undead. I'm assuming that she went through
    the Chasm of the Abyss first. But unlike you or Artorias, she didn't
    need a Covenant with the beasts of the Abyss. So either she learned
    herself how to Abysswalk or her elders taught her (which is unlikely,
    unless they were all in Lordran at one point). Perhaps she was the one
    who developed the Dark Sorceries, to fight the Four Kings with, even
    though she lost and perished.


    Last edited by DoughGuy on Thu Oct 04, 2012 8:44 pm; edited 3 times in total


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    Re: There's more to them

    Post by DoughGuy on Wed Mar 28, 2012 7:35 am

    New Development - I went into Priscilla's lair with all of tarkus's gear equipped however she did not say anything different. No clues there.


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    Re: There's more to them

    Post by Yukon on Wed Mar 28, 2012 10:05 am

    The link you provided in oscars bit is 404'ing. sad

    Great compilation here though.


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    Re: There's more to them

    Post by Tolvo on Wed Mar 28, 2012 1:59 pm

    By the way on Oscar, after completing the Seek Guidance Everywhere playthrough I've found messages from him all over. At first I believed they were just guides by the developers, but some messages are unique and actually tell you nothing about the game. One always came to mind is next to the depths bonfire there is a message from him saying, "I can't take this..."

    By the way a bit of speculation, relations between the east and blight town. The Iaito, Shadow Garb, in Btown. Shiva as well finds himself down there selling weapons and items. The Chaos Blade born of Q's soul, a katana. Just a bit of speculation between relations there. I'll be adding more of my findings in time.

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    Re: There's more to them

    Post by DoughGuy on Wed Mar 28, 2012 7:39 pm

    Yes the messages he leaves are something I still have to add to Oscar's info. I'll also see hwta I can do about that link not working. The east-blighttown connection is good. Have to look into that when i do one on Shova. Or if you want Tolvo you can wirte it and I'll add it to the main post.

    Edit: SO the link still works when its in my bookmarks but not on the page.


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    Re: There's more to them

    Post by Tolvo on Wed Mar 28, 2012 8:03 pm

    By the way if the messages on the ground are to be given merit, he would have gotten the lordvessel, because he has messages in the Demon's Ruins, and Crystal Cave. New Londo as well, but you don't need the vessel to get there.

    I'll see what I can pull together about Shiva and get back to you.

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    Re: There's more to them

    Post by DoughGuy on Wed Mar 28, 2012 8:19 pm

    Could you tell me the one in the crystal cave. I've looked at Acidic's thread on this (I know that you are the one who found them though) and there is no mention of the crystal cave. The problem with him having the lordvessel is thatQuelaag is stil alive. So either he managed to ge tthere before Quelaag, in which case his time is long long ago (look at all the eggs) or he got past her without fighting her (could account for Quelaag's hatred for humans).


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    Re: There's more to them

    Post by Tolvo on Wed Mar 28, 2012 8:27 pm

    I didn't find one in the Crystal Caves myself, but supposedly near the first bridge you have to cross there is one near the start, I'm just going off of what the wiki says on that one though. For the Demon's Ruins the Centipede room, as well there is right before the hidden path to the Chaos Cov that has a message from him. That has puzzled me as well, I've always wondered if it was possible for the bosses to come back to life. After all, others got through Sen's Fortress after all before you.

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    Re: There's more to them

    Post by DoughGuy on Wed Mar 28, 2012 8:37 pm

    However i can see Sen's making sense. It's possible theres like 50 golems waiting in a storage area (one of those places we can see but not reach) and they just wheel out a new one after the last ones death. Quelaag though ... She's one of the seven sisters of chaos.


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    Re: There's more to them

    Post by skarekrow13 on Wed Mar 28, 2012 8:41 pm

    Something blocked him in his world perhaps and he found a way into our world/time.


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    Re: There's more to them

    Post by Tolvo on Wed Mar 28, 2012 8:42 pm

    Hmm, multiple Iron Golems isn't far fetched, it is just a golem after all. Sure dragon bone was used to make it, but they fought a war against the dragons. It's not unreasonable for them to be able to make a bunch of them. My question then is why would they have all of these golems just here?

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    Re: There's more to them

    Post by DoughGuy on Fri Mar 30, 2012 5:42 am

    Rickett of Vinheim
    Spoiler:
    Rickett is trapped in a cell in the area befor ethe new londo ruins. The best blacksmith in Vinheim and, if I remember his words correctly, he knew ol' big hat befor ehe went hollow. Now Vinheim is a long way away from Lordran so the question must be asked why was he locked up all the way out here for his crime? It makes more sense for him to be locked up in the asylum than locked up in new londo. Therefore he must not have been locked up by whatever keeps the law in Vinheim but by either himself or big hat. This would also explain his lack of desire to leave his cell. If it is personal imprisonment/ imprisonment by a friend it would carry both the weight of the crime and the be a test of his own personal honour to stay in the cell. thus it is entirely possible he was locked up after New Londo was flooded, rather than before as commonly believed.


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    Re: There's more to them

    Post by DoughGuy on Fri Mar 30, 2012 5:53 am

    Eingyi
    Spoiler:
    A exiled pyromancer from the great swamp. His origins are one of the easiest to trace as muc his explained in game. I'll start by putting the quotes from his pyromancies here -
    Toxic Mist
    "Unique pyromancy crafted by Eingyi, considered a heretic even at the Great Swamp. Create intense poison mist.
    Why was Eingyi driven from the Great Swamp? One only need cast this
    pyromancy, a perverse diversion from the art of fire, to find out."
    [i]Poison Mist

    [/i]"Unique pyromancy crafted by Eingyi, considered a heretic even at the Great Swamp. Create poison mist.
    Eingyi became an egg-bearing Undead who serves a deformed young girl who speaks an untelligible tongue."

    His cexile is less likely because of what his pyromacies do, and more likely because in order to create them he "perverted" the power of fire. His meddling with the flame branded him a heretic and he was forced to flee. Evidently he found blighttown similar to the great swamp, and in addition his poison and toxic pyromacies fit right in with the preferred weapons of the current inhabitants. However at some point he came into contact with the "great blight pus". Whether he came into contact before he reached blighttown and was forced to stop there because he was too weak or whther he contracted it there is unknown. What is known is that he found the white lady in the swamp. The white lady cried for him and then removed the blight pus from eignyi and swallowed it herself despite Quelaag's warnings. Her kindness towards him was too much and he became egg-burdened in order to better serve the white lady. The blight pus then mutated the white lady, preventing her from moving. It may also be the reason she cannot be understood.


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    Re: There's more to them

    Post by DoughGuy on Fri Mar 30, 2012 5:56 am

    So I've done two more NPC's. I've also added their descriptions to the first post.


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    Re: There's more to them

    Post by WyrmHero on Fri Mar 30, 2012 6:04 am

    I think Oscar couldn't defeat Lord Gwyn, in his time. Remember what Solaire says about heroes phasing in and out, because of Lodran's time distortion. Also one of his dialogue's line says that "Perhaps you can keep the torch lit" This means Frampt told him the revelation of linking the fire. But also after acquiring the Lordvessel Frampt is extremely exited and says "It is you, it is really you, after a thousand years". Pretty contradictory.


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    Re: There's more to them

    Post by DoughGuy on Fri Mar 30, 2012 6:23 am

    But why would he say "keep the torch lit" if Gwyn is already keeping it lit. As long as Gwyn lives the first flame will stay lit. I've never really understood why you need to replace Gwyn anyway. It could be interpreted as keeping hope lit. As long as one undead knows of the prophecy they can keep trying to fufill it/break more undead out of the asylum to atttempt the prophecy. You know, like passing on the torch of succession etc. On the 1000 year thing who knows what time Oscar existed in. Its possible 1000 years have passed since Oscar attempted it.


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    Re: There's more to them

    Post by Tolvo on Fri Mar 30, 2012 6:26 am

    Almost done with Shiva.

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    Re: There's more to them

    Post by Tolvo on Fri Mar 30, 2012 6:37 am

    Shiva of the East

    Spoiler:
    Shiva, one of the Clan Leaders of the Forest Hunters. An NPC who is loved by some for his trading, while others merely ignore his presence and kill his body guard for a certain gift of the Woods. This man is quite an experienced warrior, if a new player were to start combat with him they'd find that he can easily break shields and uses a wide variety of tactics in battle. There is a reason he is such an acomplished hunter after all. While trying to appear quite friendly there are hints of a darker side to Shiva. While he protects the forest and grave of Artorias he is also a scavenger. He mentions that the items he sells he claims in battle. Notice, he carries mostly exotic weapons of the east. Weapons that should be in the hands of people of his land, suspicious isn't it? After talking with him first and joining the covenant he will move to Blight town where he will sell his wares. Interesting choice of location, far from the woods and in such a dangerous territory. However, he is not ill prepared as his armor actually protects well against poisonous threats. His armor mentions, "Distinctive armor made in an Eastern Land.
    Exquisitely crafted, this armor offers excellent defense, particularly versus slash attacks, which are one of the main threats in battles in the East." Now while one might simply pass off this armor as being worn by Shiva to show off his origin, is it not possible he is not wanted in the east? He appears to claim wares from fallen eastern warriors, and wears armor that is well suited to protect him against their advances in combat. Fishy isn't it? As well he has managed to claim demonic weapons, which wouldn't be too far from his place in Blight Town. Yet, Shiva can attain these items even before the death of the Chaos Witch guarding the first bell. This Captain of the brigade deals in eastern weapons which are Katanas, however a question is why is a weapon, the Chaos Blade, born of Quelaag's soul an eastern weapon? Interesting enough that he would want a bodyguard and be mistrusted by Alvina, his "master." In regards to his companion, another easterner. This man carries, the Dark Wood Grain Ring, "This special ring crafted in an Eastern land is made of gold, but with a wood grain crest
    on its surface. Agents of subterfuge in this faraway land are particulary fond of the
    dark gold wood grain, which greatly alters its wearer's rolling action." Alvina had mentioned her distrust of Shiva, and the word Subterfuge should be a large clue. "Deceit used in order to achieve one's goal."-Subterfuge. That is one definition of the word, now then. A man who is possibly killing supposed kinsmen, having relations in blight town and amongst the Chaos faction, along with travelling between the forest and demon ruins. Something is going on with Shiva, he has plans that are very well hidden. In either case, this man is certainly not to be trusted, a cunning and deceitful Patches if there ever was one.

    EDIT: I hope I didn't make it too long and made it well enough.

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    Re: There's more to them

    Post by DoughGuy on Fri Mar 30, 2012 6:44 am

    Thanks for that Tolvo. Preferably in time all the descriptions will become a significant length so the length of yours is fine.


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    Re: There's more to them

    Post by Tolvo on Fri Mar 30, 2012 6:45 am

    Funny thing is I can actually add more speculation, but I was just hoping to not make things far too long...It does always strike me as odd that he sells a weapon from Carim.

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    Re: There's more to them

    Post by DoughGuy on Fri Mar 30, 2012 6:48 am

    You know I think the multiude of eastern themed weapons and armour in blighttown could be linked to Shiva. What if all of the bodies holding these wer assasins sent to track down Shiva and kill him? Exaplins the Iato and the shadow set.


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    Re: There's more to them

    Post by Tolvo on Fri Mar 30, 2012 6:53 am

    "Black cloth clothing worn by spooks from an Eastern land.
    Designed so as not to hinder their unique form of martial arts.
    While they sacrifice defense for the sake of greater mobility,
    they do offer resistance to bleeding and poison among other things, perhaps due to the nature of espionage."

    Most suspicious indeed, "A weapon formed by three sharped claws.
    Attacks cause bleeding, and the wounds inflicted are not easily mended. Preferred weapon of the spooks of an Eastern land."

    Shiva you claim all of your wares in battle? Then why do you sell the weapons of assassins of the east, like your friend.

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    Re: There's more to them

    Post by DoughGuy on Fri Mar 30, 2012 6:58 am

    If you don't mind Ill add this bit of speculation to your Shiva post.


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