Buffing for duels

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    How many buffs is ok?

    [ 7 ]
    23% [23%] 
    [ 4 ]
    13% [13%] 
    [ 5 ]
    17% [17%] 
    [ 2 ]
    7% [7%] 
    [ 8 ]
    27% [27%] 
    [ 4 ]
    13% [13%] 

    Total Votes: 30
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    SageOfToads123
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    Re: Buffing for duels

    Post by SageOfToads123 on Mon Sep 23, 2013 7:35 am

    It still makes me chuckle every time I see this player-base try to achieve a level of 'balance' in this game. But if you want to be technical, then you may as well restrict the strongest weapon buffs to the worst weapons (not weakest, as some weapons are able to spam easy and are rather poor in terms of base damage [i.e. the Scimitar]).


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    Re: Buffing for duels

    Post by Sneezer on Mon Sep 23, 2013 7:53 am

    SageOfToads123 wrote:It still makes me chuckle every time I see this player-base try to achieve a level of 'balance' in this game. But if you want to be technical, then you may as well restrict the strongest weapon buffs to the worst weapons (not weakest, as some weapons are able to spam easy and are rather poor in terms of base damage [i.e. the Scimitar]).
    It's not about "achieving a level of balance," it's about personal preference, limits, and choice in (random) one on one duels.
    People can buff all they want, but we don't have to let them to do it their leisure just because it's in the game.


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    Re: Buffing for duels

    Post by Maplepop on Mon Sep 23, 2013 8:24 am

    Buffs in a duel... No way man. 


    My idea of a good duel is a lengthy, epic battle with lots of twists and turns - IMO buffs can potentially negate alot of the fun that a good duel can provide...


    Each to their own I guess - But I just don't get it :/


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    Re: Buffing for duels

    Post by Forum Pirate on Mon Sep 23, 2013 8:30 am

    Maplepop wrote:Buffs in a duel... No way man. 


    My idea of a good duel is a lengthy, epic battle with lots of twists and turns - IMO buffs can potentially negate alot of the fun that a good duel can provide...


    Each to their own I guess - But I just don't get it :/
    you're in the wrong series. and the wrong company. There are so many ways to just end a duel with an inescapable combo or hyper mode attack that its not even funny. large club 1h roll r1 that hits twice for 900+, bs stunned guy for 900+, game, as an easy example tht doesn't require buffs, or even magic (though its hard as hell)


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    Re: Buffing for duels

    Post by Maplepop on Mon Sep 23, 2013 9:29 am

    I don't doubt that for a second pirate... I understand that with the right set-up a duel can quickly end with certain combinations akin to your example without buffs - that's not a problem with me. Indeed, bravo if you manage to pull such combos off which requires a certain amount of skill & flair!

    Resins are cool - but In my experience buff users (SLB/DMB/CMW) tend to just spam R1/BS fish looking for an easy kill. Some people 'hide' behind their buffs and tend to look kinda lost when the buff expires.

    I dunno, I just find it far more enjoyable fighting someone without a buff than with one.


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    Re: Buffing for duels

    Post by Forum Pirate on Mon Sep 23, 2013 9:54 am

    well yeah. the buff is on a 60 second timer. i have a huge advantage for a very limited time. its smart play to attack at pretty much every opportunity for that time, as even 1 hit will probably drop over 1/3rd of their hp, which is a huge advantage. after that just play it safe and poke tbem to death.

    your preference is your preference, but hunting for the "easy" kill for the time that its available is exactly what like half of play is about, buffs or no buffs. (the other half being denying the opponent those opportinities)


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    Re: Buffing for duels

    Post by SageOfToads123 on Mon Sep 23, 2013 10:59 am

    Sneezer wrote:
    SageOfToads123 wrote:It still makes me chuckle every time I see this player-base try to achieve a level of 'balance' in this game. But if you want to be technical, then you may as well restrict the strongest weapon buffs to the worst weapons (not weakest, as some weapons are able to spam easy and are rather poor in terms of base damage [i.e. the Scimitar]).
    It's not about "achieving a level of balance," it's about personal preference, limits, and choice in (random) one on one duels.
    People can buff all they want, but we don't have to let them to do it their leisure just because it's in the game.
    People restrict these types of things not because they like it or not, not for a challenge or a game mode, but to attempt to make the duel a bit more 'fun'. More balanced duel = more fun for everyone.
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    Re: Buffing for duels

    Post by ScottyDoesKnow on Mon Sep 23, 2013 11:22 am

    SageOfToads123 wrote:
    Sneezer wrote:
    SageOfToads123 wrote:It still makes me chuckle every time I see this player-base try to achieve a level of 'balance' in this game. But if you want to be technical, then you may as well restrict the strongest weapon buffs to the worst weapons (not weakest, as some weapons are able to spam easy and are rather poor in terms of base damage [i.e. the Scimitar]).
    It's not about "achieving a level of balance," it's about personal preference, limits, and choice in (random) one on one duels.
    People can buff all they want, but we don't have to let them to do it their leisure just because it's in the game.
    People restrict these types of things not because they like it or not, not for a challenge or a game mode, but to attempt to make the duel a bit more 'fun'. More balanced duel = more fun for everyone.
    What is your first post in response to? There's been no talk of restricting anything, I don't see how you could in random duels. I'm just asking how much people will let their opponent buff before attacking.
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    Re: Buffing for duels

    Post by Maplepop on Mon Sep 23, 2013 12:32 pm

    Forum Pirate wrote:well yeah. the buff is on a 60 second timer. i have a huge advantage for a very limited time. its smart play to attack at pretty much every opportunity for that time, as even 1 hit will probably drop over 1/3rd of their hp, which is a huge advantage. after that just play it safe and poke tbem to death.

    your preference is your preference, but hunting for the "easy" kill for the time that its available is exactly what like half of play is about, buffs or no buffs. (the other half being denying the opponent those opportinities)
    I'd imagine it's pretty rare for your opponents to last the full 1 minute though, no? Unless there making a conscious effort to avoid you...

    I PVP to have fun, improve my technique, try new things and if I win it's a bonus. If I was duelling with someone and I slaughtered them with a buffed weapon (whilst they were unbuffed), I'd take very little satisfaction in doing so.

    Don't get me wrong - There is definitely a place for buffs in PVP. Whether it be dealing with gank squads or the occasional random invasion (particularly if invading someone at a higher level). I just think they should stay away from honest duels...

    But hey, only my opinion of course... I guess I like to make things hard for myself happy


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    Re: Buffing for duels

    Post by Bassman Bob on Mon Sep 23, 2013 1:31 pm

    I'm fine with everything other than homing soulmass, pursuers, and twop. Other than those, everything goes.


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    Re: Buffing for duels

    Post by SageOfToads123 on Wed Sep 25, 2013 11:35 pm

    ScottyDoesKnow wrote:
    SageOfToads123 wrote:
    Sneezer wrote:
    SageOfToads123 wrote:It still makes me chuckle every time I see this player-base try to achieve a level of 'balance' in this game. But if you want to be technical, then you may as well restrict the strongest weapon buffs to the worst weapons (not weakest, as some weapons are able to spam easy and are rather poor in terms of base damage [i.e. the Scimitar]).
    It's not about "achieving a level of balance," it's about personal preference, limits, and choice in (random) one on one duels.
    People can buff all they want, but we don't have to let them to do it their leisure just because it's in the game.
    People restrict these types of things not because they like it or not, not for a challenge or a game mode, but to attempt to make the duel a bit more 'fun'. More balanced duel = more fun for everyone.
    What is your first post in response to? There's been no talk of restricting anything, I don't see how you could in random duels. I'm just asking how much people will let their opponent buff before attacking.
    I don't think you understand. Why are people talking about buffing in duels? Because of balance. That's the only reason. Maybe 'restrict' wasn't the right word here (I guess I overestimated some people here, to be frank)... My post isn't responding to anyone in particular either, but much rather to the people who voted against buffs.
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    Re: Buffing for duels

    Post by Forum Pirate on Thu Sep 26, 2013 1:04 am

    Maplepop wrote:
    Forum Pirate wrote:well yeah. the buff is on a 60 second timer. i have a huge advantage for a very limited time. its smart play to attack at pretty much every opportunity for that time, as even 1 hit will probably drop over 1/3rd of their hp, which is a huge advantage. after that just play it safe and poke tbem to death.

    your preference is your preference, but hunting for the "easy" kill for the time that its available is exactly what like half of play is about, buffs or no buffs. (the other half being denying the opponent those opportinities)
    I'd imagine it's pretty rare for your opponents to last the full 1 minute though, no? Unless there making a conscious effort to avoid you...

    I PVP to have fun, improve my technique, try new things and if I win it's a bonus. If I was duelling with someone and I slaughtered them with a buffed weapon (whilst they were unbuffed), I'd take very little satisfaction in doing so.

    Don't get me wrong - There is definitely a place for buffs in PVP. Whether it be dealing with gank squads or the occasional random invasion (particularly if invading someone at a higher level). I just think they should stay away from honest duels...

    But hey, only my opinion of course... I guess I like to make things hard for myself happy
    They are always making a consious effort to aviod you, and if they don't have a way to counter your buff then thats a flaw in their building/technique right there. No different than if they can't counter a claymore stunlock.


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    Re: Buffing for duels

    Post by ScottyDoesKnow on Thu Sep 26, 2013 11:51 am

    SageOfToads123 wrote:I don't think you understand. Why are people talking about buffing in duels? Because of balance. That's the only reason. Maybe 'restrict' wasn't the right word here (I guess I overestimated some people here, to be frank)... My post isn't responding to anyone in particular either, but much rather to the people who voted against buffs.
    I don't understand most of what you're saying.

    I think balance is a strange choice of words. It's more of a politeness thing. Whether the buff is great magic weapon or DMB doesn't really matter to me. But I feel like it's almost taking advantage of the duel situation to weapon buff/replenishment/homing soul mass in safety before you fight. Therefore there's a line somewhere in the middle, and I'm curious as to what that is for everyone.

    I also don't understand how your choice of words (restrict) is related to you overestimating people.
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    Re: Buffing for duels

    Post by Latitoast on Thu Sep 26, 2013 8:46 pm

    I don't let people DMB buff or SLB buff, but that's about it.

    You honestly expect me to stand there and let you apply a buff that allows a Falchion to deal about 1/3rd of my health on each strike? If they do get it off I get out a Silver Knight Spear and kite for days, I'll kite them even when the buff isn't on their weapon anymore, I really dislike that stuff.

    Resin is fine, Grass is fine, Power Within is fine since you drain your health. I usually attack HCSM castings, it's an opening for me to exploit, it's like someone getting mad for getting punished because they used a Zweihander R2


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    Re: Buffing for duels

    Post by reim0027 on Thu Sep 26, 2013 10:15 pm

    Are buffs in DkS really so different than in DeS? Just think of a buffed BBS build, or a cracked talisman buffed DBS. Those were completely accepted.


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    Re: Buffing for duels

    Post by SlintEastwood on Fri Sep 27, 2013 12:41 pm

    I don't see why grass shouldn't count. 

    Also, I'll generally let people use however many buffs they want. As far as HCSM and Pursuers go I refuse to let someone get those broken spells off without punishment, but they aren't buffs.
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    Re: Buffing for duels

    Post by SageOfToads123 on Fri Oct 04, 2013 11:06 am

    ScottyDoesKnow wrote:
    SageOfToads123 wrote:I don't think you understand. Why are people talking about buffing in duels? Because of balance. That's the only reason. Maybe 'restrict' wasn't the right word here (I guess I overestimated some people here, to be frank)... My post isn't responding to anyone in particular either, but much rather to the people who voted against buffs.
    I don't understand most of what you're saying.

    I think balance is a strange choice of words. It's more of a politeness thing. Whether the buff is great magic weapon or DMB doesn't really matter to me. But I feel like it's almost taking advantage of the duel situation to weapon buff/replenishment/homing soul mass in safety before you fight. Therefore there's a line somewhere in the middle, and I'm curious as to what that is for everyone.

    I also don't understand how your choice of words (restrict) is related to you overestimating people.
    I think I'll just leave this as it is. I don't want to get aggressive here.


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    Re: Buffing for duels

    Post by Rynn on Fri Oct 04, 2013 11:56 am

    Feel free to buff, but the fight begins the moment we bow. So if you're going to, bow first.

    Kinda how I ran my fight club. Once both people had bowed, the fight began, and i even during my club would attack people while they buffed if the mis-ordered things.

    Homing Soul Mass is only good without lockon.

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