Health vs Defense?

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    LunarFog
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    Health vs Defense?

    Post by LunarFog on Tue Dec 25, 2012 11:25 pm

    Which stat is more important between health and defense in both PvP and PvE?

    To be specific, which would be more impressive and useful between:

    670 defense and 1842 Health

    OR

    575 defense and 2127 health


    And in the case of having 670 defense, would the blue tear stone ring(the one that increase defense by 50% at less than 20% health) be actually...useful?

    That'd be over 1005 defense would it not?


    Last edited by LunarFog on Tue Dec 25, 2012 11:39 pm; edited 1 time in total

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    Re: Health vs Defense?

    Post by Jester's Tears on Tue Dec 25, 2012 11:26 pm

    1 Def
    1 HP
    +
    ROLLING SKILLS
    =
    Beats anything.


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    Re: Health vs Defense?

    Post by Sloth9230 on Tue Dec 25, 2012 11:35 pm

    TC/Manus Cat
    +
    Crown of the Dark Sun/Dusk
    +
    Bellowing Dragon Crest Ring
    +
    Dark Bead
    =
    Dead Jester
    =
    Me

    Humor aside, I'd actually like to know the answer to the question too.


    Last edited by Sloth9230 on Wed Dec 26, 2012 12:24 am; edited 3 times in total


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    Re: Health vs Defense?

    Post by Jester's Tears on Tue Dec 25, 2012 11:41 pm

    Sloth9230 wrote:TC/Manus Cat
    +
    Crown of the Dark Sun/Dusk
    +
    Bellowing Dragon Crest Ring
    +
    Dark Bead
    =
    Dead Jester




    Last edited by Jester's Tears on Wed Dec 26, 2012 3:09 pm; edited 1 time in total


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    Re: Health vs Defense?

    Post by Jansports on Tue Dec 25, 2012 11:43 pm

    I'd think health, past 400-450 defence values drop off HARD with diminishing returns. I think once you get over 450 physical defences health is better.
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    Re: Health vs Defense?

    Post by Jester's Tears on Tue Dec 25, 2012 11:51 pm

    Jansports wrote:I'd think health, past 400-450 defence values drop off HARD with diminishing returns. I think once you get over 450 physical defences health is better.

    300-350 Feels like a Standard for me. Once i get over 350, i become so happy...Until i get Raped by Gankers. Then the joy just FLOATS AWAY.


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    Re: Health vs Defense?

    Post by LunarFog on Wed Dec 26, 2012 12:01 am

    Jester's Tears wrote:
    Jansports wrote:I'd think health, past 400-450 defence values drop off HARD with diminishing returns. I think once you get over 450 physical defences health is better.

    300-350 Feels like a Standard for me. Once i get over 350, i become so happy...Until i get Raped by Gankers. Then the joy just FLOATS AWAY.

    Well I love builds that are uneven as possible. In this case, I'm either going to go for max health, or max defense.

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    Re: Health vs Defense?

    Post by Sloth9230 on Wed Dec 26, 2012 12:07 am

    Jester's Tears wrote:


    Can't see it.

    Yeah, I usually roll with 300-350 def. The first time I equipped the ring of FAP it made a huge difference. Now... not so much. Maybe I've just gotten sloppier?


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    Re: Health vs Defense?

    Post by BLA1NE on Wed Dec 26, 2012 1:03 am

    Jansports wrote:I'd think health, past 400-450 defence values drop off HARD with diminishing returns. I think once you get over 450 physical defences health is better.
    I'd have to look over the numbers again (or more numbers, preferably), but I didn't get the impression that defense really suffers from diminishing returns. I did say that AR is subject to increasing returns, but that doesn't automatically mean that the opposite is true for defense. Specifically, having ridiculous defense won't ridiculously diminish the damage of weapons with huge AR, but it will make the damage of weapons with low AR almost insignificant. If I remember correctly, doubling your defense didn't cut a large AR in half, but it more than cut a small AR by two thirds. So I'd say that having ridiculously high defense will be really effective, especially against weapons of low AR (most Dex weapons). And since that's what most people use... go for it!

    But, between:

    LunarFog wrote:670 defense and 1842 Health

    OR

    575 defense and 2127 health
    it's hard to say...

    How do you get 670 defense anyway?!


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    Re: Health vs Defense?

    Post by LunarFog on Wed Dec 26, 2012 1:34 am

    BLA1NE wrote:
    Jansports wrote:I'd think health, past 400-450 defence values drop off HARD with diminishing returns. I think once you get over 450 physical defences health is better.
    I'd have to look over the numbers again (or more numbers, preferably), but I didn't get the impression that defense really suffers from diminishing returns. I did say that AR is subject to increasing returns, but that doesn't automatically mean that the opposite is true for defense. Specifically, having ridiculous defense won't ridiculously diminish the damage of weapons with huge AR, but it will make the damage of weapons with low AR almost insignificant. If I remember correctly, doubling your defense didn't cut a large AR in half, but it more than cut a small AR by two thirds. So I'd say that having ridiculously high defense will be really effective, especially against weapons of low AR (most Dex weapons). And since that's what most people use... go for it!

    But, between:

    LunarFog wrote:670 defense and 1842 Health

    OR

    575 defense and 2127 health
    it's hard to say...

    How do you get 670 defense anyway?!

    My equipment is Giant's full set, havel's shield, dragon great sword, and dragon king great axe, and 99 humanity. Plus I'm on level 99. Oh yea. and Ring of Steel protection. In fact...I could probably get another weapon for my free left-hand weapon slot to increase my defense by another 20 points...

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    Re: Health vs Defense?

    Post by ChizFreak on Wed Dec 26, 2012 1:41 am

    LunarFog wrote:
    BLA1NE wrote:
    Jansports wrote:I'd think health, past 400-450 defence values drop off HARD with diminishing returns. I think once you get over 450 physical defences health is better.
    I'd have to look over the numbers again (or more numbers, preferably), but I didn't get the impression that defense really suffers from diminishing returns. I did say that AR is subject to increasing returns, but that doesn't automatically mean that the opposite is true for defense. Specifically, having ridiculous defense won't ridiculously diminish the damage of weapons with huge AR, but it will make the damage of weapons with low AR almost insignificant. If I remember correctly, doubling your defense didn't cut a large AR in half, but it more than cut a small AR by two thirds. So I'd say that having ridiculously high defense will be really effective, especially against weapons of low AR (most Dex weapons). And since that's what most people use... go for it!

    But, between:

    LunarFog wrote:670 defense and 1842 Health

    OR

    575 defense and 2127 health
    it's hard to say...

    How do you get 670 defense anyway?!

    My equipment is Giant's full set, havel's shield, dragon great sword, and dragon king great axe, and 99 humanity. Plus I'm on level 99. Oh yea. and Ring of Steel protection. In fact...I could probably get another weapon for my free left-hand weapon slot to increase my defense by another 20 points...

    Still not possible:

    http://mmdks.com/ka8

    That's the maximum. And Dragon weapons only increase special defenses (like magical) not physical defenses. You're lying, brah.

    Even if you wear the Blue Tearstone, you would get only around 750 defense maximum.


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    Re: Health vs Defense?

    Post by LunarFog on Wed Dec 26, 2012 2:01 am

    ChizFreak wrote:

    Alright then. I'm going to not dismiss you as a prick since I was unsure about it in the first place, but in the dark souls calculator, In the Physical Defense box, it says 505(175).

    I assumed the number in parentheses was extra defense that was added through things like humanity and weapons. If not, then what is it?

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    Re: Health vs Defense?

    Post by Uparkaam on Wed Dec 26, 2012 12:58 pm

    The (175) is the amount of defense you have when you're naked and without the ring of physical protection.


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    Re: Health vs Defense?

    Post by Jester's Tears on Wed Dec 26, 2012 3:10 pm

    Sloth9230 wrote:
    Jester's Tears wrote:


    Can't see it.

    Yeah, I usually roll with 300-350 def. The first time I equipped the ring of FAP it made a huge difference. Now... not so much. Maybe I've just gotten sloppier?

    Yes you can Well What is it


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    Re: Health vs Defense?

    Post by Sloth9230 on Wed Dec 26, 2012 3:44 pm

    It just shows a broken link on my side, and if I open it on another tab it just takes me to some page with what I suppose are supposed to be funny images... but I can't see them either.


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    Re: Health vs Defense?

    Post by Jester's Tears on Wed Dec 26, 2012 6:49 pm

    Sloth9230 wrote:It just shows a broken link on my side, and if I open it on another tab it just takes me to some page with what I suppose are supposed to be funny images... but I can't see them either.

    No No...I Edited the ORGINAL post.


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    Re: Health vs Defense?

    Post by Sloth9230 on Wed Dec 26, 2012 7:16 pm

    Ahhh, I see it now!


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