What's the best PvP strategy for a Dex build?

I'm looking at the pros and cons of dex builds, and on paper they seem inferior to everything else (no poise, no casting). With one exception: criticals. It seems like to use a Dex character you almost have to master the parry and get those crits. I don't really want to do the backstab dance...bit too tedious and boring for my tastes. What does everyone think? Is the parry the key to this build, or is there something else I should be doing?

I've been pvping all day @118 as a pure DEX build using an Iiato+15 Lifehunt Scythe+5 and even a Priscilla+5 and winning very consistently. Went from 23 humanity to 56 invading with red eye and being invaded.

I've got a 120 Dex I win with most of the time. + 5 Chaos Iaito R/H and pyro/+5 Chaos Great Scythe L/H. Havels hands and feet for some poise and Xantheous top + Crown of dusk. I only BS tanks, everyone else I just dance around chipping away at. I don't spam pyro, just where nececssary and use GS big L/H swing to keep bs'ers off my back.

I will never understand why people equate dex builds with no poise. You have room for more poise than strength builds because your weapon is much lighter.

Using some poise armor in pvp isn't for strength builds, its just smart.

Don't know why you wouldn't use a casting stat either, other than some asinine thematic reason you have enough damage points to raise a casting stat after agility is at 40. You wouldn't push dex past 40 anyway because of diminishing returns. What are pure dex builds spending soul levels on after that? Vitality? Not worth it past 40 either. Doesn't give enough health.

I have 76 poise with my DEX toon. Could get more if I changed wep/armor around but I really like this setup I have.

Okay, well seeing as you're presuming pure dex build ill just go with it, but even in that case it's easy to have maxed pyro flame and some spells only putting 6/9 levels into attunement.. pretty good investment.

But in terms of no poise? you can have more than STR builds. Lighter weapon=more room for armour.

dex are better at being fast and getting the odd hit in than going all out for a kill like STR builds.

the parry will help a lot, and maybe crits are better with dex builds, but you dont need them to be successful with them.

The speed of attack is what gives the edge and dex generally hybrid with magic is ideal, though you probably just tlaking about pure dex builds..

no poise? dex can have the best poise, since theyre weapons dont weight that much you can wear whatever armor you want. most of what i see is people with heavy armor ans katanas.

Since dex builds typically have a lower AR than strength, you need to be constantly moving around and dodging attacks, and attacking. Also, for most weapons, you should be aggressive, as your weapons are really fast moving - you need to keep the pressure up.

But, dex weapons can have the best AR/sec. A DMB enchanted Falcion is deadly - like a cursed Kilij from DeS. Getting caught in a combo = insta-death.

Serious_Much wrote:

The speed of attack is what gives the edge and dex generally hybrid with magic is ideal, .

And how, DMB buffed bandits knife has over 800 AR. You can 3 shot people with a dagger.

You can build however you want to, but keep in mind any points spent past 40 are less than ideal.

Eliteknight wrote:

Serious_Much wrote:

The speed of attack is what gives the edge and dex generally hybrid with magic is ideal, .

And how, DMB buffed bandits knife has over 800 AR. You can 3 shot people with a dagger.

You can build however you want to, but keep in mind any points spent past 40 are less than ideal.

If you stack Vitality with the RoFAP (+/- MoM), then the diminishing returns after 40 aren't bad, but they get really bad after 50.

The long and short of it is, if the question is "what is the best pvp strategy for a dex build?" the answer as far as I understand it as far as optimization goes is simply "roll a hybrid dex build" and the answer to the question of "is having a vast majority of my soul levels in dex gimping myself for pvp" is a pretty resounding "yes".

Skill and preferences are still more important, but all factors considered I'd stand by the above.

Thanks for all the well thought-out feedback...it's been very helpful. I was wondering where the extra points might go after dex hits 40, since 40 vit and end would only put the build in the 90's. I'd never really thought about creating a hybrid. Is the main reason for creating a hybrid basically for the buff sorceries/miracles?

For my Dex I put the extra points into Faith and Attunement. The Faith buffs (DMB, Sunlight) go well with your defensive miracles like WoG and Force.

Emergence wrote:For my Dex I put the extra points into Faith and Attunement. The Faith buffs (DMB, Sunlight) go well with your defensive miracles like WoG and Force.

This. 100%

speed is where its at with dex, cause the crits arent even that great with a dex dagger build, i cant play as any other style though, i love dex

Back Lot Basher wrote:Thanks for all the well thought-out feedback...it's been very helpful. I was wondering where the extra points might go after dex hits 40, since 40 vit and end would only put the build in the 90's. I'd never really thought about creating a hybrid. Is the main reason for creating a hybrid basically for the buff sorceries/miracles?

It's not the whole point, but buffing Dex weapons are better than buffing larger ones, as it only adds pure damage, you will get something that can do 75% of the damage of a demon's greataxe, but hit 3 times faster than it..

However, i just use hybrids because i prefer to have more in my arsenal than just melee, but it's not essential, just what you prefer.

That makes sense...and considering the number of times I seem to get backstabbed with some pretty shoddy game mechanics (coming out of a roll?), I'm thinking I'd like to have some spells or miracles just to keep people guessing.

have 1 force slot and wog slot if you go faith. after the first wog hits bluffing with force casts works really well (nearly identical cast animations) as it lets you condition them and allows you to learn how they respond to it so you can predict their movements and sneak in a bs/parry or actual wog cast. it also makes them really wary of getting close for as long as you have the talismine out. (to be fair i fight with my head, this might not fit your playstyle.)

How I would make my 120.


http://darksouls.itsthatguy.com/?c=UHlyb21hbmNlciwxMjAsMzksMTIsNDAsMjAsNDAsMTIsMzIsOA==


CMW Washing Pole Build.

LOLRagezzz wrote:How I would make my 120.


http://darksouls.itsthatguy.com/?c=UHlyb21hbmNlciwxMjAsMzksMTIsNDAsMjAsNDAsMTIsMzIsOA==


CMW Washing Pole Build.

dmb and slb are better so if your character is melee centric use faith. i'd only go dex int hybrid if i was a caster too.

I'd go w/ a pyro/dex hybrid. Dex up to at least 45 to maximize the speed of the spells, two pyro gloves on the left hand, one at base for power within, one ascended and +5 for hard hitting spells. In the right hand I'd go w/ a shotel and either a washing pole, uchi, or iatio, upgraded to +15. I'd use melee for when they get close and spells for when they are far away. If you get good at casting fireballs w/out locking you can get a whole lot of damage w/ that and then when they freak out switch to your katana. Very dangerous build in the right hands.

aceluby wrote:I'd go w/ a pyro/dex hybrid. Dex up to at least 45 to maximize the speed of the spells, two pyro gloves on the left hand, one at base for power within, one ascended and +5 for hard hitting spells. In the right hand I'd go w/ a shotel and either a washing pole, uchi, or iatio, upgraded to +15. I'd use melee for when they get close and spells for when they are far away. If you get good at casting fireballs w/out locking you can get a whole lot of damage w/ that and then when they freak out switch to your katana. Very dangerous build in the right hands.

This is terrifyingly similar to my original gameplan (recent thread here for more info) and I have a few questions.
- Even with 45 dex, can you explain the reasoning behind the +15 weapon? Even good scaling doesn't seem like it would beat the extra damage from a lightning/chaos +5 version of the same weapon. Perhaps I'm wrong. The +15 would make sense if using a weapon buff but this doesn't seem to incorporate that
- How significant is the difference as far as 40 and 45 dex for spell casting? I stopped at 40 but I'm about SL100 and could spare a few points (assuming I stick with this instead of going for ~30 faith and a weapon buff)
- What sort of stats are you looking at for SL120. Like I mentioned im at 40vit/40end/40dex with a few other random points and SL98. Where do I make up the difference, just more vit? Dex 45? etc.

So, if you went with a faith/dex hybrid, and put 40 into vit, end, and dex, how high would you want to get faith...enough for the WoG, say around 28 to 30?

Back Lot Basher wrote:So, if you went with a faith/dex hybrid, and put 40 into vit, end, and dex, how high would you want to get faith...enough for the WoG, say around 28 to 30?

mines 30 in endurance and 40 in faith. dwgr and rofap allow medium/heavy armor and light weapons or medium/light armor and heavy weapons. Add MoM and you have really high health too. I can eat a hornets ring+lightning claymore bs and survive.