Siegmeyer's "Death"

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    Grimstone

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    Siegmeyer's "Death"

    Post by Grimstone on Sat Feb 09, 2013 5:24 am

    I've been looking at the forums and haven't seen this possibility discussed before, but I noticed something strange about the last event. Throughout the game anyone that is killed either vanishes in a shower of souls, or their body crops up elsewhere in the game, but at the end of Siegmeyer's path his body is lying in the sand fully armored the way it was when he was alive. Sieglinde says she killed him when he went hollow, but the chosen undead kills quite a few hollows and their bodies always vanish afterwards.

    My theory is that Sieglinde did not kill her father, but simply told the chosen undead that she did with the intent of taking him somewhere else. She mentions that she had to kill him, that is how he became undead and we never find out why she killed him, but throughout her story she is searching for him and mentions a few times that she is worried he is causing trouble. But what is the trouble? All he causes the player are a few minor inconvinences, and barely that. She was following him to keep him out of trouble, and possibly kill him again if it was needed but at the last minute she couldn't do it. So she told the chosen undead he was dead and took him with her when she left. This could be disproven if his body remains after she leaves Ash Lake, though. Any thoughts on this?

    I also think that Siegmeyer became suicidal near the end of his path. He appears in one of the most dangerous areas in the game, and decides to bum rush four enemies that have a near instant kill attack. Then, if you successfully save him from the monsters he says he's just going to take a nap and that the ground will be his bed. The poisonous ground. Finally Sieglinde mentions that he was embarking on his final adventure, and makes it sound more like he has died or is going to die on purpose. It is possible he went and attacked the Everlasting Dragon and got killed since the dragon is immortal.

    Does anyone know if his body vanishes? Or other thoughts on the theory?
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    Re: Siegmeyer's "Death"

    Post by Myztyrio on Sat Feb 09, 2013 5:46 am

    This is very interesting, insightful, and I believe it may be true! :o

    +1 good sir, and welcome!


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    Re: Siegmeyer's "Death"

    Post by skarekrow13 on Mon Feb 11, 2013 12:37 pm

    I don't know if the body vanishes if you come back. It's been a long time since I completed that story arc.

    Anyway, the idea of him either committing suicide or (this is the one I think is true) embarking on what he believes is a suicide mission is likely accurate. There's definitely enough references to it.

    As for corpses remaining, we do see evidence of final death, with corpse and everything all over the game. Many NPCs will have a "final corpse" if their arc is completed. Some have a corpse even if you don't. Examples; Kirk, Lautrec, Jeremiah and Beatrice will eventually show off their "final corpse" if the arc is completed. Tarkus' corpse is there no matter the path.

    My conclusion has been that death is pretty convoluted in Lordran. Perhaps some characters were able to make it into Lordran without the Dark Sign and therefore play by normal death rules. Going back to earlier examples, Kirk and Jeremiah "die" since you have to kill them to finish their arc. Beatrice, Tarkus and Lautrec can "die" since they can be summoned (not that Tarkus is likely to die against the Golem). However, these deaths occur when the person is in phantom status. As we know, the use of summon signs bypasses normal death and acts more as banishment.

    So....my conclusion leads more toward the idea that not everyone has a Dark sign to respawn.

    However, Sieglinde's comments about killing Siegmeyer before would suggest that he does have the Dark sign. So the above examples only show that there's more than one type of death/result scenario. Other characters believed to have the Dark sign (such as Oscar) don't leave a corpse.

    In summary, it's likely to just look more tragic with her standing over him but there could be another reason. Death is convoluted in Lordran.

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    Re: Siegmeyer's "Death"

    Post by sunbro on Mon Feb 11, 2013 12:41 pm

    so maybe it's Sieg's corpse is in the graveyard where you pick up the Zwei


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    Re: Siegmeyer's "Death"

    Post by skarekrow13 on Mon Feb 11, 2013 1:01 pm

    That's a hell of a thought. Good thinking!

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    Re: Siegmeyer's "Death"

    Post by sunbro on Mon Feb 11, 2013 1:04 pm

    he has a big @55 tombstone !!!

    seems fit for a hero like Sieg


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    Re: Siegmeyer's "Death"

    Post by skarekrow13 on Mon Feb 11, 2013 1:24 pm

    Sieglinde doesn't mess around paying tribute to Daddy. Freud would likely have a field day with this.....

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    Re: Siegmeyer's "Death"

    Post by sunbro on Mon Feb 11, 2013 3:33 pm

    hey doesn't sieglinde carry a Claymore if so she died on the bride by the wyvrn


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    Re: Siegmeyer's "Death"

    Post by RANT on Mon Feb 11, 2013 3:34 pm

    im gonna go with all the different takes on every story in dark souls that people have are true ince miyazaki ssaid that he wanted to leave everything for specualtion and the player sshould make their own story which i love. there's no right or wrong, just your story.


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    Re: Siegmeyer's "Death"

    Post by RANT on Mon Feb 11, 2013 3:35 pm

    sunbro wrote:hey doesn't sieglinde carry a Claymore if so she died on the bride by the wyvrn

    its a bastard sword.


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    Re: Siegmeyer's "Death"

    Post by skarekrow13 on Mon Feb 11, 2013 3:42 pm

    Thanks for proving that I'm always right Rant! That sets my mind at ease winking


    But yeah, you're right. It sounds like sunbro and I choose to believe Siegmeyer has an awesome grave

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    Re: Siegmeyer's "Death"

    Post by sunbro on Mon Feb 11, 2013 4:14 pm

    indeed


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    Re: Siegmeyer's "Death"

    Post by Grimstone on Mon Feb 11, 2013 6:06 pm

    Yeah, I have to admit I simply like Siegmeyer enough to want him to be alive. And after I did the post i remembered all of the bodies left by people. Though i don't think it occurs for hollowed npc's I could be wrong. But I will assume I am right no matter what! he he he.

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    Re: Siegmeyer's "Death"

    Post by Grimstone on Mon Feb 11, 2013 6:07 pm

    Myztyrio wrote:This is very interesting, insightful, and I believe it may be true! :o

    +1 good sir, and welcome!

    And thanks for the welcome!
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    Re: Siegmeyer's "Death"

    Post by DissidentCitizen on Mon Feb 11, 2013 7:07 pm

    Good. Call.

    I'd like to imagine that's OnionBro's grave in the cemetery.


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    Re: Siegmeyer's "Death"

    Post by LunarFog on Tue Feb 12, 2013 2:12 pm

    RantFromRant wrote:
    sunbro wrote:hey doesn't sieglinde carry a Claymore if so she died on the bride by the wyvrn

    its a bastard sword.
    No it's not. You can buy the bastard sword from andre. The only way to get a claymore though, is the body on the bridge.

    ...Unless you were talking about the sword Sieglind carries. then that might be a Bastard sword.


    Last edited by LunarFog on Tue Feb 12, 2013 2:32 pm; edited 1 time in total

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    Re: Siegmeyer's "Death"

    Post by Acarnatia on Tue Feb 12, 2013 2:30 pm

    Seiglinde carries a bastard sword. No corpse in the game has a bastard sword; they can only be purchased from Andre. The sword on the bridge connecting the Undead Burg to the Undead Parish has a corpse with a Claymore.


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    Re: Siegmeyer's "Death"

    Post by Ghadis_God on Tue Feb 12, 2013 9:18 pm

    sunbro wrote:hey doesn't sieglinde carry a Claymore if so she died on the bride by the wyvrn
    I'm almost 100% certain that she wields the Bastard Sword instead of the Claymore. Also, you can see many different copies of the Zwei and other swords stuck in the ground around Sif's grave, they're not unique weapons even if you can only find one Zwei in the game world.


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    Re: Siegmeyer's "Death"

    Post by Sloth9230 on Tue Feb 12, 2013 9:33 pm

    All npc corpses come with their respective armor sets. I think Oscar not having a corpse is because we get his armor elsewhere. We can buy the onion armor, so there's no point in having Seigmeyer's corpse.




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    Re: Siegmeyer's "Death"

    Post by DoughGuy on Tue Feb 12, 2013 9:49 pm

    Siegemeyer's flesh is still human upon death. He's a human, not an undead. When he dieshe leaves a body because that's what people do when they die.


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    Re: Siegmeyer's "Death"

    Post by Sloth9230 on Tue Feb 12, 2013 9:59 pm

    DoughGuy wrote:Siegemeyer's flesh is still human upon death. He's a human, not an undead. When he dieshe leaves a body because that's what people do when they die.

    He's undead. His daughter says she's killed him before.


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    Re: Siegmeyer's "Death"

    Post by DoughGuy on Tue Feb 12, 2013 10:37 pm

    Yes, and she's a very trustworthy source winking


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