XBox Users: Is it really this bad?

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    XBox Users: Is it really this bad?

    Post by Domhnall on Sun Feb 19, 2012 12:38 am

    Take a minute to read this guy's two cents from FROM's (lol) forums. I was considering getting Dark Souls for my step-dad, last time I was at their house he was still playing Torchlight. But after reading this, I feel like it might be more of a curse than a blessing. Just wanted to hear some XBox user's opinions on the matter, just wondering if it's really as bad as this guy says, or if he is exagerating. I'm a diehard PS3 user, so I might consider getting him a PS3 with it, but he loves his XBox. PS3+Dark Souls would be a cool bundle. A custom Dark Souls PS3 would also be awesome...anyway, here's the link, let me know what you think.

    http://www.preparetodie.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=18&t=38391


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    Re: XBox Users: Is it really this bad?

    Post by Whknight on Sun Feb 19, 2012 12:48 am

    Sadly, he has a decent point, but the BB/griefer also plays into PS3 as well. The only huge difference is that those with a modded Xbox can hack their game and make it really unenjoyable, I haven't seen one but I don't pvp at all really.

    I really don't summon much but last time I tried to trade took several tries after getting summoning failed. I was also taking awhile to be invaded, the fog would go up and I'd sit and wait and many times no one invaded.

    I'm starting to wonder what FROM is up to, I remember AC4A being heavly balanced with several patches when things got to over used and complained about.


    Last edited by Whknight on Sun Feb 19, 2012 1:41 am; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : Replaced strongly, also expanded and thought more on it.)


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    Re: XBox Users: Is it really this bad?

    Post by Domhnall on Sun Feb 19, 2012 12:56 am

    Hmm that does suck. I really want to get him the game, but I want him to have the same awesome experiences that I have had on the PS3 version, but most of those involve multiplayer and jolly co-op. I guess I could always rent it and use my buddy's Xbox to try it out. But man, I haven't rented a game in so long...I don't think there's any blockbusters left in my town o.o


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    Re: XBox Users: Is it really this bad?

    Post by Forum Pirate on Sun Feb 19, 2012 1:02 am

    hes justified in being angry about the modders but thats the xbox not the game, both systems have griefers, latency issues are irritating but fairly easily compensated for (usually) and the "armored gymnasts" are limited to smaller weapons or have lower health which are disadvantageous when dealing with any weapon with range. in short, his points are valid but his unwillingness to play stems from either an inability to learn the system or (imo) unreasonable expectations for the pvp of a game not intended to be pvp centric.


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    Re: XBox Users: Is it really this bad?

    Post by LordRevan on Sun Feb 19, 2012 1:07 am

    I would not say its that bad sure there is BB/Griefers, but they are on both. I've only ever encountered one infinite health glitcher, that was in Anor Londo and I've played for awhile. The online communtiy is definately not a ghost town I dont know what its like on PS3 probably more I'd assumme. But I find people all the time on Xbox. However he's correct with... Summoning Failed.... Summoning Failed... Summons usually don't summon on the first go but they do summon. Anyway it would be a bit better on PS3 since it has a larger community but its definately not as bad as he says on Xbox, and since he already has an xbox myself I'd go for that.


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    Re: XBox Users: Is it really this bad?

    Post by bloodpixel on Sun Feb 19, 2012 1:31 am

    All eclipsed by PC, he says.
    Douchebag.
    OT: The summoning failed happened a lot, true but I can't really speak for the PS3 version. Also I have yet to meet a griefer or health glitcher.


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    Re: XBox Users: Is it really this bad?

    Post by fearandwhiskey on Sun Feb 19, 2012 1:48 am

    I have the game for both systems. I find that there are generally more people to summon on PS than xbox, but I can usually find someone to summon. I don't see any difference in the number of griefers between systems. I just started a new game on PS and was invaded and killed at sl 3 by a lightning halberd in the burg--that's not an xbox exclusive. happy

    If you think he'd enjoy the game, I wouldn't hesitate to buy it for him.


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    Re: XBox Users: Is it really this bad?

    Post by SlakeMoth on Sun Feb 19, 2012 5:39 am

    I play on PS3 but a lot of what this guy says makes sense to me. In fact I've submitted a question to From Software, via Game Central, who I hope will forward it, on this very subject.

    Briefly, I've asked them whether they agree with my opinion, which is that the emphasis on PvP in Dark Souls has unbalanced the game and, if so, do they intend to fix it in any further games set in the Demon/Dark Souls universe, either by making 'humanity' more easily available in the PvE game or by preventing invasions in areas where players have to go online to summon help with bosses.

    No doubt this will not be popular with those people who think that it's fun to invade when a player is going for a boss but I think something has to be done because Dark Souls has become so infested, there is no other word for it, with 'griefers' that I actually don't bother becoming human or play online much anymore. Think about it, you gear yourself up to fight a boss you've fought before. You equip what you think is appropriate for that particular boss's attack patterns, which more often than not is not very effective for a PvP bout, off you go, online & human because you hope to summon help and the inevitable happens, some ***** invades. Needs to be fixed and soon because if it isn't, I for one will not be buying anymore Souls games.
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    Re: XBox Users: Is it really this bad?

    Post by DxV04 on Sun Feb 19, 2012 6:28 am

    At Doomhal:

    This was my reply to that guy.

    In short he is exaggerating and whining.
    I say he is whining because he wants the complete removal of key game mechanics. Instead of looking for the middle ground or compromise. There is a group of people like this in both consoles not just the xbox. If he would have bought the game on the PS3 he would be making the same complaints that he is now with the exception of file modders.

    Speak for yourself please! You are generalizing wayyyy too much. I always play human because I like the uncertainty of being invaded. I don't care if its an OP vader. I like the challenge.
    I know a lot of people that play in human form on the XBOX, but it is people like you that for some reason are not happy that you then spread these exaggerations which cause less people to be online on XBOX.
    Tell me what game out there is perfect? There isn't one! So DkS is no different.

    OP greifers in low levels occur just as much or more so in the PS3. Lag and everything else is about the same. There are summoning problems in the PS3 just like in xbox.

    Only 2 things are different. The amount of players and the fact that file modifiers are not found on the PS3 yet.

    So naturally if there are more players you are more likely to find someone with a decent enough connection to play with.

    File modders are sooo few that you might be lucky to find one. I have only ran into 2 of them since the game came out. Not a big deal. The other day in the dark souls wiki a guy beat one of them because people that add 60000 hit points to their toon do not know how to PvP. He bled the guy to death.

    So please, I am very serious when I say this. Stop scaring people into buying and playing DkS on XBOX. That makes it harder for us who love the game to find people to play with. If you are not happy with the game on XBOX go play it on the PS3, and then come back asking for nerf this and nerf that.

    I can tell by your request to remove BS and DWGR that you are the typical whiner that can't adjust in PvP. I hardly die from back stabs unless I am going 1 vs 3.

    I am sorry but just like you don't like DkS I don't like people who whine.

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    Re: XBox Users: Is it really this bad?

    Post by Serious_Much on Sun Feb 19, 2012 8:30 am

    "only people I ever find it worth summoning are the NPCs, because summoning a PC also requires the stars to align, and they never mentioned that anywhere on the box." In particular I thought this line was good silly

    it started as a charade of a complaint of what we all know are issues with the game, but sadly he has noone to blame but his own internet for bad connectivity (I have same issue, I don't whine about it)-sounds like a meme silly

    by the end it just became a rant of how unplayable the game is and how it is incomplete and badly made.

    Idiot needs to go play skyrim.

    Edit: just made a post on the topic, let's see how he reacts to a little poking shall we twisted

    also realised that you have to have your comment approved to get it posted, lame. Gonna take ages for him to get annoyed by me sad


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    Re: XBox Users: Is it really this bad?

    Post by Flubious on Sun Feb 19, 2012 11:28 am

    The whiny exaggeration is strong in this one. The only real point made is with the infinite health glitch and I encounter that very infrequently. I'd say my Darkwraith has invaded 50 players in the last few weeks. Zero stat modders. Additionally, any one of my toons gets invaded all the time. I've encountered a stat modder 4 times in total throughout the entire time I've played Dark Souls. Of these 4 times, 3 of them were in the same day by the same player. When I knocked his ***** *** off a cliff, I never saw him again.


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    Re: XBox Users: Is it really this bad?

    Post by stale on Sun Feb 19, 2012 12:52 pm

    You guys have no sense of fun. The entire game is designed for "griefing." It's called "invasion" for a reason! And the whole spirit of the game is dark, menacing and frustrating -- it's supposed to be that way! It's even part of the advertizing campaign.

    I don't mean this sarcastically. What disappoints me is that people want PvP to be some kind of delicate, balanced "let's play fair" kind of thing which is entirely missing the point. It wouldn't be called "invasion" otherwise, and the covenant you join to do the invasions wouldn't be at the bottom of an abyss talking to an evil snake-thing with rabbit ears. Seriously. It'd be some nice angel woman (Gwynevere) who asks you to play with sportsmanship and the game would have the sunny-day atmosphere of a golfing tournament with nice happy music playing and birds chirping and everybody would shake hands. Enough with the bowing before matches! You're supposed to fight dirty.

    Every time I see someone bow I strike.

    Now as for the cheaters, I agree that sucks. I don't know if that's something the developer & gamemakers can fix. It seems like a hardware issue (ability to edit saves).

    I would think it affects lots of games.
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    Re: XBox Users: Is it really this bad?

    Post by Forum Pirate on Sun Feb 19, 2012 1:07 pm

    you understand that you're in the wrong place for that attitude? and fyi i bow to bait people like you into charging then pivot bs you when you get close. at worst i counter bs and take no damage, at best you immediately die because a hornets ring/demon greataxe bs is fatal a great deal of the time.


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    Re: XBox Users: Is it really this bad?

    Post by lextune on Sun Feb 19, 2012 3:26 pm

    Total nonsense.

    I have logged an almost embarrassing amount of hours on this game (at LEAST 500), and I have always been able to summon someone when I wanted too. Sure, sometimes it took five or six tries spread out over 15 minutes, but what of it.

    Also, while I have seen a fair number of griefers, (pretty much irrelevant after Anor though snyway), I have never seen a health glitcher. The guy was just either insanely unlucky, or ran into the same one glitcher, or is just flat out lying.

    As for backstabs, I am really starting to see them as a Forest and Kiln "problem".

    My level 75 DW that lives in the Demon Ruins made about 50 or 60 invasions yesterday and I made exactly zero backstabs and was only backstabbed once or twice.


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    Re: XBox Users: Is it really this bad?

    Post by Yarxov on Sun Feb 19, 2012 4:35 pm

    stale wrote:[Anti-honor and fairness argument]
    I like that big red bar you have next to your post, where did you get it?

    At OT, I would never get rid of this game, no matter how bad PvP is, (im still in shock from when my dad sold his Collectors edition of Dragon Age Origins, to Gamestop.... for Modern warfare 2!) I play with less than 1000 health, so most Backstabs kill or nearly kill me, all I do is try to not get lagstabbed, observing their movements to find where I am in their game instead of mine. I see griefers all the time, (ps3) Lightning Claymores, Giants armor, Lightning Uchis, wotG spammers, the worst ones are those who lagstab you then spam WotG when you start standing back up. Arrogantly boasting on your dieing corpse with "Well what is it!"

    But its part of the game now, all you can do is adapt (which is a main point of Dark Souls).


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    Re: XBox Users: Is it really this bad?

    Post by stale on Mon Feb 20, 2012 5:14 am

    Yarxov wrote:
    stale wrote:[Anti-honor and fairness argument]
    I like that big red bar you have next to your post, where did you get it?

    (shrug) I dunno, but it's undeserved. I'm just talking about the spirit of the game. It's dark. It's called Dark Souls. You join a gang called Dark Wraiths. You used CRACKED red orbs to INVADE? Hello? Invade? You know what invading is? What about killing? You're killing your opponent too when you invade. With a big knife. It's mean. It is! It's a very mean thing to do. You don't need to bow before you do it. It's not honorable whether you bow or not. The bowing just rubs it in.

    Also the "lag stab" is technical - any kind of backstabbing, which is a feature designed by animators and programmers at FROM - is legitimate, and the person doing it can't be forcing lag onto the player. That has to do with the networks, the player's connection speeds, etc. I see the same lag regardless of the action on screen. (Such as when spells are cast).
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    Re: XBox Users: Is it really this bad?

    Post by stale on Mon Feb 20, 2012 5:19 am

    I mean, do you really think you would appear as a glowing red GHOST if you were meant to play nice?

    Think about it! Glowing red ghosts don't bow! They murder! They're there to invade!

    That's the whole point.
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    Re: XBox Users: Is it really this bad?

    Post by Darkson on Mon Feb 20, 2012 5:42 am

    herpy derpy derp
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    Re: XBox Users: Is it really this bad?

    Post by Po1ymorph on Mon Feb 20, 2012 11:42 am

    I would take what this guy says with a pinch a salt. There's plenty of summoning action on the Xbox, especially at peak play times ie: in the evening. You get "summon fails" but you get plenty of success' as well.

    Sure you get griefer's, I cannot imagine PS3 being any different in this regard than the Xbox, someone correct me on this if I am wrong. But all they do is make you use more Humanity. But as long as you know you can drop your own summon sign and get Humanity helping other's than that will not be a problem.

    As for the balance issues, there the same on either system. And are only a concern if you want to spend hours on end PVP'ing.

    I have not encounted anyone one with infinite health or anything like that, what that says for how common or not that is, I do not know. There are plenty of BBGlithcer's, but in all honesty a new player coming to Dark Souls at this point would more than likely still get his *** kicked when invaded early in the game, weather it was by a glitcher or not.

    Dark Souls good points are far greater than it's bad points. Most of it's more significant issue's only come into focus when you spend alot of time PVP'ing.

    To say you would have a uniquely different experience on a PS3 than a Xbox is I think I think grossly misguided. Get you step-dad Dark Souls if you think it is his type of game, and you can simply give him a heads up with regards to online play.



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    Re: XBox Users: Is it really this bad?

    Post by DxV04 on Mon Feb 20, 2012 11:45 am

    Good post Po1ymorph!

    yea what is worst is that guy at prepare to die starts off by saying that he had a wonderful time playing dark souls after putting in 200 to 300 hours. Then he goes on to put the game down. What a fool!
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    Re: XBox Users: Is it really this bad?

    Post by Back Lot Basher on Mon Feb 20, 2012 1:23 pm

    I bought this game for both systems because, well, because I just really love the game and want to play with as many people as I can. I tallied the gameplay times from all my characters, and it's just a shade over 650 hours. I love the online aspects, even if they are a bit damaged in places. I mostly play on the Xbox version now, mostly because I have a couple of good friends who are nearly as addicted as I am. We deal with the griefers by traveling in a pack. If I want to have some decent PvP, I will do it alone in the regular spots. But those tools that invade to victimize people are not going to get an easy go when they try our game, because we're almost always a trio.

    I have seen one person using the infinite health glitch, and it was as bad as they say. If this becomes rampant, it WILL break the game. He was unable to be defeated. We pounded him into oblivion with everything you can imagine, and he just kept coming back. But so far it was just the once.

    Summoning random people can be hit or miss. I've had the summon work on the first try, while others can fail a half dozen times. I've put in over 200 hours of multiplayer with my two friends, and I can tell you that we have developed a method of summoning which works virtually every time. It takes a little patience to get your game synced up, but once it works, you're good for the night. Here's the steps we use, and if you follow them, I can tell you they will work 99% of the time. I first posted this on the Xbox Live forums:

    1. Never "spam" your sign. Have your friend put it down, then summon. Keep
    waiting until you get the "summoning failed" message. When this happens, the
    sign should appear again within 20-30 seconds. Then you hit it again. It can
    take 3 or 4 tries to work. Even though it's tempting to just put the sign down
    again when your friend doesn't see it, don't. ONLY PUT IT BACK DOWN IF IT FAILS
    TO REAPPEAR WITHIN A MINUTE OR SO. We used to try repeatedly putting the sign
    down, but this only created lengthy delays in getting your two worlds to sync
    up. We simply assumed that putting the sign down again resets something in the
    process.

    2. Once you summon a friend once, something in the game seems
    to sync your two gamertags for the rest of the night. We always find that if
    you can tolerate a bit of work getting the first summon to work, after that, you
    will be able to summon your friend in new areas almost instantly. Sign
    generally appears right away, and you don't get any summon failures.

    3.
    Once two players sync up with a successful summon, the ease of linking also
    seems to carry over to different characters. I had played a few areas with a
    friend who was using a tank/warrior, and then he switched, loading up his
    caster. The smooth summoning continued even though he switched.

    4.
    There are a few areas in the game where, although it looks like you can put down
    a sign, they rarely, if ever, appear. The first section of Dukes is one (the
    area you clear just before your first doomed fight with Seath). We tried many,
    many times in this area, and signs never appear. In the New Londo Ruins, we
    also noticed that if someone has not drained the ruins, signs don't seem to show
    up. One night, two of us who had already drained the ruins put down signs. The
    third friend, who had not, couldn't see them (and this was after we had already
    done a few successful summons that night). Yet for my friend and I who had
    drained the ruins, we could each see one another's signs no problem. We tested
    this numerous times, and the result was always the same.

    5. If you have
    not beaten an area, and you're trying to put down a sign for a friend, it's
    easier in hollow form. The reason is, even when your sign is down, you can
    still get interference from attempted invasions. Your sign will vanish, the
    option to drop it again will gray out, and your bonfire will become
    inaccessible. There's nothing in the game stopping you from being summoned in
    these circumstances, but it can be trickier for the reasons I gave.
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    Re: XBox Users: Is it really this bad?

    Post by Yarxov on Mon Feb 20, 2012 1:34 pm

    **** Back lot basher, I just sent my post, thinking I wouldn't need to approve, then closed the tab ;_;
    damn well here we go again:

    [Quote=stale] (shrug) I dunno, but it's undeserved. I'm just talking about the spirit
    of the game. It's dark. It's called Dark Souls. You join a gang called
    Dark Wraiths. You used CRACKED red orbs to INVADE? Hello? Invade? You
    know what invading is? What about killing? You're killing your opponent
    too when you invade. With a big knife. It's mean. It is! It's a very
    mean thing to do. You don't need to bow before you do it. It's not
    honorable whether you bow or not. The bowing just rubs it in.

    Also
    the "lag stab" is technical - any kind of backstabbing, which is a
    feature designed by animators and programmers at FROM - is legitimate,
    and the person doing it can't be forcing lag onto the player. That has
    to do with the networks, the player's connection speeds, etc. I see the
    same lag regardless of the action on screen. (Such as when spells are
    cast).[/quote]

    I agree invasion shouldn't be a fancy well mannered duel, It is an invasion after all like you said. I have my issues with people who just sit back and farm those who actually need the humanity, that is where I place my etiquette. Just not being an a**hole.
    Lag spells are worse in my opinion, they have the potential to screw you over from a distance, so dodging them with lag is difficult and more dangerous than lag stabs since with those you can still kite your enemy and see where you are on their screen.


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    Re: XBox Users: Is it really this bad?

    Post by Forum Pirate on Mon Feb 20, 2012 2:29 pm

    stale wrote:I mean, do you really think you would appear as a glowing red GHOST if you were meant to play nice?

    Think about it! Glowing red ghosts don't bow! They murder! They're there to invade!

    That's the whole point.
    My lady Velka has seen your sins and my lord Gwendolyn condemns you to death. Hope you never see me because i know every dirty trick in the book and will use all of them if it brings people like you to justice.


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