So I'm thinking of becoming overpowered.

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    Rynn
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    So I'm thinking of becoming overpowered.

    Post by Rynn on Tue Jul 10, 2012 11:52 pm

    http://tinyurl.com/7dwb85l

    I do not backstab fish. I'm one of those few surprising souls that actually uses my dagger to fight.
    So, thoughts?
    Here is some feedback you can actually give in return.
    I'm willing to change the armor, but I must keep at or above 77 poise.
    I will not equip a mask, I am well aware that every single one of the masks is better then what I have equipped in my head slot, however my helmet is somewhat just to poke fun at the players equipped with the same loadout, + a mask when I beat them.

    Suggestions?
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    Re: So I'm thinking of becoming overpowered.

    Post by WhatDoesThePendantDo? on Tue Jul 10, 2012 11:56 pm

    It's strong, but a Dagger ain't OP gear.

    Where's yo' BKGA?

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    Re: So I'm thinking of becoming overpowered.

    Post by Rynn on Tue Jul 10, 2012 11:58 pm

    The dagger is actually the most powerful weapon in the entire game.
    I ran the numbers in a thread a while ago, where I used the dagger on my Vitality Gouged char.

    That numbers are that a dagger buffed with DMB has more Damage Per Second then literally any weapon in the entire game, short of glitch weapons, like using DMB on a Black Knight Great Axe or such.

    EDIT: Furthermore: a dagger has such a fast attack animation that you can be stunned into holding your shield up forever. A dagger hits 1.5 times before the second fastest weapon type in the game (2 handed curved swords), and it's very difficult to blind parry.

    I have genuinely thought of doing a Pricilla's dagger build because of all of this before.


    Last edited by Rynn on Wed Jul 11, 2012 12:33 am; edited 1 time in total
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    Re: So I'm thinking of becoming overpowered.

    Post by WhatDoesThePendantDo? on Wed Jul 11, 2012 12:01 am

    More DPS than PGS?

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    Re: So I'm thinking of becoming overpowered.

    Post by roanispe on Wed Jul 11, 2012 12:06 am

    Dagger is a really neat weapon, the r2 is a surprisingly deadly thrust no matter how many hands you have on the thing. It can let you cover distance to make a pseudo-poke mistakes your opponent makes, but can't backstab punish. Unfortunately, I cannot tell you if the Leo Ring works with that. (It does work with a whole slew of weapons that it shouldn't really.) Buffing does make it deadly, but you'll find the range to be a bit underwhelming. To be honest, I suggest getting the Painting Guardian Sword over the Dagger.

    The weight for it can be provided from the Composite Bow, as I found out that it needs the Strength requirement met. You'll do a hilarious stagger animation, as I found out. I think the Bows need to be retested to see the if the claim that you don't to invest in Strength to see if it is true or not.

    I am disinclined to agree with the claim that daggers are overpowered because it's deadly DPS is gimped by the poor range considerably. If you wanted to simply use it as a vehicle for buffs, I'd lower the Dexterity to get more Endurance, and Attunement. This way, you could stack another Wrath of the Gods, or more buffs. The loss of casting speed won't be as a big a deal as you think, you won't be casting too much anyways. Other than that, be careful of someone who'll try to tank-parry your attacks, and to remember to kick. I believe you can score at a hit off it.


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    Re: So I'm thinking of becoming overpowered.

    Post by Rynn on Wed Jul 11, 2012 12:15 am

    roanispe wrote:Dagger is a really neat weapon, the r2 is a surprisingly deadly thrust no matter how many hands you have on the thing. It can let you cover distance to make a pseudo-poke mistakes your opponent makes, but can't backstab punish. Unfortunately, I cannot tell you if the Leo Ring works with that. (It does work with a whole slew of weapons that it shouldn't really.) Buffing does make it deadly, but you'll find the range to be a bit underwhelming. To be honest, I suggest getting the Painting Guardian Sword over the Dagger.

    The weight for it can be provided from the Composite Bow, as I found out that it needs the Strength requirement met. You'll do a hilarious stagger animation, as I found out. I think the Bows need to be retested to see the if the claim that you don't to invest in Strength to see if it is true or not.

    I am disinclined to agree with the claim that daggers are overpowered because it's deadly DPS is gimped by the poor range considerably. If you wanted to simply use it as a vehicle for buffs, I'd lower the Dexterity to get more Endurance, and Attunement. This way, you could stack another Wrath of the Gods, or more buffs. The loss of casting speed won't be as a big a deal as you think, you won't be casting too much anyways. Other than that, be careful of someone who'll try to tank-parry your attacks, and to remember to kick. I believe you can score at a hit off it.
    I didn't call daggers overpowered. I've done one of these builds before, with only 14 dex and 9 strength, minimum weapon requirements.
    Seeing as the build was very deadly even then, I feel using my dagger with more appropriate stats should result in doing even more dangerous volumes of damage per hit. I don't even consider dex for casting speed honestly, my pyro had 9 dex.

    Leo Ring works with the dagger, kicking an opponent, then using the R2 is a very easy way to score 450 damage hits with a dagger during a battle.

    I find the Painted Guardian sword to overall be a worse weapon. It has a lower range then a dagger, weighs more, attacks slower, and has minimal damage increase.
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    Re: So I'm thinking of becoming overpowered.

    Post by WyrmHero on Wed Jul 11, 2012 12:34 am

    I have a similar build, but Washing Pole with minimum stats and DMB with 50 faith. 2000 HP and 775 AR. Dagger is faster, I was once 4 shot by a DMB PGS, it's nasty.


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    Re: So I'm thinking of becoming overpowered.

    Post by Carphil on Wed Jul 11, 2012 12:38 am



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    Re: So I'm thinking of becoming overpowered.

    Post by WyrmHero on Wed Jul 11, 2012 1:01 am

    She wants 76 poise car, try this. You are better off starting as a cleric by the way, 1 extra point.

    http://mugenmonkey.com/darksouls/?c=2787007335878629


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    Re: So I'm thinking of becoming overpowered.

    Post by Carphil on Wed Jul 11, 2012 1:07 am

    WyrmHero wrote:She wants 76 poise car, try this. You are better off starting as a cleric by the way, 1 extra point.

    http://mugenmonkey.com/darksouls/?c=2787007335878629

    well thats it, thanks for fixing.


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    Re: So I'm thinking of becoming overpowered.

    Post by Rynn on Wed Jul 11, 2012 1:08 am

    Carphil wrote:this or this big grin
    I think you helped me find a build I can use actually. 67 poise is generally enough, and I can wolf ring if I need more.
    Modified your build a tad bit, I'll go give it a try on gankers.

    Anyone on X-box willing to help me gather up some gear for this?
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    Re: So I'm thinking of becoming overpowered.

    Post by Carphil on Wed Jul 11, 2012 1:37 am

    Rynn wrote:
    Carphil wrote:this or this big grin
    I think you helped me find a build I can use actually. 67 poise is generally enough, and I can wolf ring if I need more.
    Modified your build a tad bit, I'll go give it a try on gankers.

    Anyone on X-box willing to help me gather up some gear for this?

    Anytime, I'm thinking about doing the first build myself, then make him/her a forest hunter... ideas, ideas, ideas!


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    Re: So I'm thinking of becoming overpowered.

    Post by DamageCK on Wed Jul 11, 2012 1:49 am

    I think the biggest drawback is that people will assume you're going to spam BS, which in turn will compell them to spam BS. And are you sure it beats out a buffed PGS? That thing RIPS through people.


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    Re: So I'm thinking of becoming overpowered.

    Post by Rynn on Wed Jul 11, 2012 1:56 am

    DamageCK wrote:I think the biggest drawback is that people will assume you're going to spam BS, which in turn will compell them to spam BS. And are you sure it beats out a buffed PGS? That thing RIPS through people.
    I am positive.
    The thing with a dagger is spamming backstab doesn't work. Daggers swing so fast that I always hit you before you backstab me, within the timeframe neccesary to backstab cancel.
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    Re: So I'm thinking of becoming overpowered.

    Post by WyrmHero on Wed Jul 11, 2012 2:19 am

    I just confirmed that the dagger is freaking fast, way more than PGS. Fought against reim who has a similar build.


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    Re: So I'm thinking of becoming overpowered.

    Post by Carphil on Wed Jul 11, 2012 2:21 am

    well thats because the dagger is a dagger and the PGS is a curved sword. Does the dagger have the same speed as the Bandits knife(which inflicts bleed)?


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    Re: So I'm thinking of becoming overpowered.

    Post by WyrmHero on Wed Jul 11, 2012 2:23 am

    Reim says no.


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    Re: So I'm thinking of becoming overpowered.

    Post by Rynn on Wed Jul 11, 2012 2:23 am

    Bandits knife is notably slower then the dagger.
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    Re: So I'm thinking of becoming overpowered.

    Post by Carphil on Wed Jul 11, 2012 2:42 am

    I see, looks like the dagger wheights 0.5 (sorry I don't have idea how wheight works in English) and the Knife wheights 1.0

    Should not be so different but yes, indeed the dagger is faster. Now I'm thinking how interesting that the forest clan mage NPC can attack you multiple times and roll away before you hit him with a greatsword


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    Re: So I'm thinking of becoming overpowered.

    Post by Rynn on Wed Jul 11, 2012 2:44 am

    The mage NPC uses a shortsword.
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    Re: So I'm thinking of becoming overpowered.

    Post by Forum Pirate on Wed Jul 11, 2012 9:10 am

    Thats the thing, you don't have to roll away, either they roll away or you blast through 2500 hp in roughly 6 hits. 6 hits with the dagger is around 2 seconds. Unless they're in hypermode, there's no way they'll kill you before you kill them in a spam contest, if they are in hyper mode its probably first hit wins.


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    Re: So I'm thinking of becoming overpowered.

    Post by reim0027 on Wed Jul 11, 2012 9:21 am

    I just tried the dagger last night. It tears through everyone. I'm still learning the moves and strategies. The biggest limitations are turtling (although, you can dead angle with it), range, and poking weapons.

    2500 in 6 hits is a bit high. With a level 1 DMB, +15 dagger, 50 Faith, and 40 Dex, I did about 1400 in 6 hits. But, it will usually win in a R1 spam contest (you need high poise to do that).

    Also, I think it is hard to parry too (whereas the BK's R1 spam is easy to parry).


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    Re: So I'm thinking of becoming overpowered.

    Post by Rynn on Wed Jul 11, 2012 9:23 am

    Forum Pirate wrote:Thats the thing, you don't have to roll away, either they roll away or you blast through 2500 hp in roughly 6 hits. 6 hits with the dagger is around 2 seconds. Unless they're in hypermode, there's no way they'll kill you before you kill them in a spam contest, if they are in hyper mode its probably first hit wins.
    I know. I posted a deliciously evil build where I pointed out the precise damage thresh hold against a Giant's Mask user as being 2210 damage before they hit me a second time, stunning me. This of course is employing how the Weapons (UGS and GA/GH weapons) have large "counter" hit boxes, inflated your damage with counter hits. If someone wants to have an R1 spamming contest with you, you'll win. If they want to turtle... you'll probably win anyway too.
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    Re: So I'm thinking of becoming overpowered.

    Post by Rynn on Wed Jul 11, 2012 9:26 am

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    Re: So I'm thinking of becoming overpowered.

    Post by reim0027 on Wed Jul 11, 2012 9:32 am

    I'm not used to that low of endurance. But, I suppose 6 hits is all you really need, and that doesn't take up much endurance, does it?

    EDIT: BTW, you can save 1 stat point by using Cleric or Knight starting classes.


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