Stat Number Breakpoints

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    reim0027
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    Stat Number Breakpoints

    Post by reim0027 on Sat Jun 09, 2012 9:33 pm

    I can't remember if I've made a post on this or not. But, I want to list some stat cutoff points. Points where going above gives you virtually nothing.

    Vitality: 50
    Spoiler:
    *Anything above is not worth the points, unless you have some to spare (50 = 1,500, 99 = 1900).
    *Exception is when you are using the MoM and/or the RoFaP.

    Attunement: 16 / 23
    Spoiler:
    * up to 16, 1 slot per 2 points.
    * after 23, it starts to diminish further, and not worth it unless you really need/want the spells (or if you are a high SL player).
    End: 40
    Spoiler:
    *Stamina is capped here. Anything above won't increase stamina.
    *Exception is item burden. Basically, if you go above 40, go only as far as you need for your equipment.

    Str: 27 / 40
    Spoiler:
    *Don't go above 40, unless you need it to wield a weapon (Smough's Hammer for example). Ever.
    *The diminishing returns after 40 are so horrible, it isn't even worth mentioning. For example. GC has about 639 at 40 str, and about 692 at 99 str.
    *27 = 2 handed. When you equip a +15 weapon with 2H, the AR increases by 1.5. So, 27 Str with 2H = 40 Str with 1H. It is also the same AR as 2H (diminishing returns again). If you plan on 2H your weapon, never go above 27 (again, unless your weapon requires it).

    Dex: 40 / 45
    Spoiler:
    *45 for max casting speed (spells, pyros, and miracles)
    *For weapon strength, there is never a reason to go above 40. Uchi at 40 dex is about 420. Uchi at 99 dex is about 454.

    Resistance: Never increase.

    Int: 40 / catalyst dependent / 50
    Spoiler:

    *40 is for the MLGS and Moonlight Horn and other unique weapons (with Int scaling). Anything above is met with severely diminishing returns. We're talking about 8 increase in AR between 40 and 50.
    *44 is where to stop for spells. It is the CSS requirement. The only other spell is White Dragon Breath, which is essentially a waste of time.
    *50 is for the TCC and buffing. Enchanted weapons scale up to 50 too (but their damage output is not as good as +15 and can't be buffed)
    *There is no reason to go above 50. Ever. Not worth the points.
    *Catalyst selection can be found here. Use this to further refine your Int cutoff. You need to know what spells you want (to find your minimum magic) and what buffs you want (buffs = 50 if at all possible)

    Faith: 30 / 50
    Spoiler:
    *30 is for the Canvas Talisman (both spells and buffs).
    *50 is for the Darkmoon Talisman (both spells and buffs).
    *Anything between 30 and 50 is not worth the stat points for the small increase in AR.

    For higher level builds, Vit, Att, and End are the only things that should be increased above these numbers. I would bet any well put together 120 build would rival any 225 build. The weapons aren't any stronger. The only difference is versatility and some vitality.

    My $0.02, IME. Any thoughts or disagreements?


    Last edited by reim0027 on Sun Jun 10, 2012 2:56 am; edited 6 times in total


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    Re: Stat Number Breakpoints

    Post by Yukon on Sat Jun 09, 2012 9:35 pm

    This is really helpful reim +1! I think this info is on the wiki as well since awhile back, but its good to have here, no doubt.


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    Re: Stat Number Breakpoints

    Post by dancash1808 on Sat Jun 09, 2012 9:39 pm

    may want to add in that 40 is ideal for MLGS for int.
    and weapon buffs being significant for 30 faith.


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    Re: Stat Number Breakpoints

    Post by reim0027 on Sat Jun 09, 2012 9:48 pm

    Good points. Updated.


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    Re: Stat Number Breakpoints

    Post by Phoenix Rising on Sat Jun 09, 2012 9:58 pm

    Very informative post reim!! cheers


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    Re: Stat Number Breakpoints

    Post by DoughGuy on Sat Jun 09, 2012 10:13 pm

    http://darksoulswiki.wikispaces.com/Magic+Adjustment
    According to that 45 int is when you should stop increasing for Logans.


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    Re: Stat Number Breakpoints

    Post by reim0027 on Sat Jun 09, 2012 10:45 pm

    Logan's continues to increase by 6 points for every stat. But, at 32, TCC is more powerful. 31 is the number for 5 HCSM, IIRC. So, for that spell, you want a minimum of 31 int. At 32 Int, you can use the TCC.

    I'll redescribe it. Thanks.


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    Re: Stat Number Breakpoints

    Post by billy_bayonet on Sat Jun 09, 2012 10:49 pm

    why no love for resistance......


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    Re: Stat Number Breakpoints

    Post by reim0027 on Sat Jun 09, 2012 10:54 pm

    Because Resistance is Futile.


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    Re: Stat Number Breakpoints

    Post by billy_bayonet on Sat Jun 09, 2012 10:56 pm

    you are the borg


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    Re: Stat Number Breakpoints

    Post by Emergence on Sat Jun 09, 2012 11:37 pm

    reim0027 wrote:Because Resistance is Futile.

    Perfect.


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    Re: Stat Number Breakpoints

    Post by Serious_Much on Sat Jun 09, 2012 11:54 pm

    reim0027 wrote:Because Resistance is Futile.

    and who said 90's culture references were dead! :roll:


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    Re: Stat Number Breakpoints

    Post by WyrmHero on Sun Jun 10, 2012 12:17 am

    Logan's Catalyst stops scaling good at 44 Int. A mage should stop at 44 Int for CSS. Going for 50 Int is only for White Dragon Breath, as TCC has horrible scaling (280 assist at 44 Int vs 293 assist at 50 Int).

    Enchanted weapons AR continue to increase up to 50 Int/Faith. Moonlight Horn, Grant, DSS and other unique enchanted weapons stop increasing AR at 40 Int/Faith. Getting to 40 Faith for increasing spell assist is a huge waste of points because Canvas Talisman increases 2 assist per stat.


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    Re: Stat Number Breakpoints

    Post by reim0027 on Sun Jun 10, 2012 12:32 am

    Thanks, W. I've added your info.


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    Re: Stat Number Breakpoints

    Post by BLA1NE on Sun Jun 10, 2012 1:08 am

    Good initiative Reim, everyone should have an idea where to cap their stats. How many of us went past 40 Dex or 50 Int only to realize they'd seriously wasted their levels?!

    - Logan's is optimal at 45. For just 1 more level after 44, it's worth it.

    - I don't think equip weight ever has diminishing returns. So even though stamina is capped at 40 End, if you need more equip weight, there's no real break-point after that.

    - Attunment is really dependent on the build. For a Mage, 8 slots can easily be justified, and at 34 Att are a very good stat investment. To go for 9 or 10 slots you must really need them, because those cost 16 points just for the 2 of them. But 8, so 34 Att, and anything bellow, depending how many you want for your build, I consider worthwhile.


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    Re: Stat Number Breakpoints

    Post by reim0027 on Sun Jun 10, 2012 1:51 am

    Good points, for a pure mage, then Att becomes really important. For the rest of the players, after 23, it usually becomes unnecessary and wastes too many stats, IMO.

    I agree about equip weight. So, I figure out the weapons I want, and fine tune End to give me the stamina I need and the equipment weight (to the exact point).


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    Re: Stat Number Breakpoints

    Post by BLA1NE on Sun Jun 10, 2012 2:00 am

    Oh, you don't want to be using Logan's at 31 Int. Logan's is only good at Int 41-45. 27-40 is Sorcerer's/ Beatrice's/ Izalith (they're all the same), 10-26 is Oolacile. Don't go above 45 if you plan on using Logan's, but you can go to 50 if you plan on using TCC (which is the best from 32-99, but don't go above 50).

    Check my page on it, Dough linked it.


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    Re: Stat Number Breakpoints

    Post by reim0027 on Sun Jun 10, 2012 2:50 am

    I was looking for that page. I'll link it in the first post.

    EDIT: updated Int with Catalyst selection link. I'm so used to getting to 50 Int for the CMW buff, the rest of the Catalysts are confusing, I usually only use the TCC.


    Last edited by reim0027 on Sun Jun 10, 2012 2:59 am; edited 1 time in total


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    Re: Stat Number Breakpoints

    Post by DamageCK on Sun Jun 10, 2012 2:52 am

    Good stuff, Reim.


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    Re: Stat Number Breakpoints

    Post by JoeBroski09 on Sun Jun 10, 2012 4:06 am

    BLA1NE wrote:- Attunment is really dependent on the build. For a Mage, 8 slots can easily be justified, and at 34 Att are a very good stat investment. To go for 9 or 10 slots you must really need them, because those cost 16 points just for the 2 of them. But 8, so 34 Att, and anything bellow, depending how many you want for your build, I consider worthwhile.
    I must REALLY feel like doing math.

    If the average player starts at 10 Att, and 34 is where you want to cap, this is a very good idea. Why? Because they put 24 stats into attunment for the 8 slots. That's 3 levels per slot. Not too shabby.


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    Re: Stat Number Breakpoints

    Post by reim0027 on Sun Jun 10, 2012 4:30 am

    But, do they need the 8 slots, or just 5? For spell casters, then it is a good deal. For the majority of melee/pyros, then 34 seems a bit too high.


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    Re: Stat Number Breakpoints

    Post by dancash1808 on Sun Jun 10, 2012 8:19 am

    ^ agreed, I mean I stick to 10 or 12 attune on most of my builds, then again I'm not much of a mage.


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    Re: Stat Number Breakpoints

    Post by lextune on Sun Jun 10, 2012 10:08 am

    I don't understand why you call white dragon breath "essentially a waste of time" ....?

    ....other than that, a great post.


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    Re: Stat Number Breakpoints

    Post by dancash1808 on Sun Jun 10, 2012 10:55 am

    In terms of PvP that is correct. PvE not so much (assuming your not an expert with it xD some guys are great...)

    also If I got some of the data typed up into a spreadsheet like hp to vit ect would that be useful to anyone (would be taking the values from the calc)
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    Re: Stat Number Breakpoints

    Post by reim0027 on Sun Jun 10, 2012 3:27 pm

    Yeah, dancash is correct. In PvP, it is extremely difficult to pull off. It sure is powerful, but rarely connects. Unless you are really skilled as a mage PvPer, IMO, it is not worth the extra stat points.

    dan - that spredsheet is probably too detailed for this post - but it would be valuable elsewhere. I wanted to give specific pvp breakpoints, concrete numbers to shoot for (and not needlessly go over), for people who aren't experienced in making builds.


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