character build optimizer

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    somebody_else
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    character build optimizer

    Post by somebody_else on Wed Jan 25, 2012 3:31 pm

    well, i finally found time to continue work and finalized some things. had real hectic work time (didn't have the time to play either) so i had to put this on hold. and since work on web interface will be done by my friend who isn't DkS player, i'd really want to struck final before he starts working on it. this is also the reason why i haven't released this yet.

    now interface is supporting diminished warnings (that includes unnecessary str/dex on elemental, strict dualhanding and so on) and i completely redone selectors (i completely rewrote it 7 times actually) until i was happy with the way they work.

    random screenshot
    http://illiweb.com/fa/pbucket.gif
    http://illiweb.com/fa/pbucket.gif
    http://illiweb.com/fa/pbucket.gif

    now... the things i'd appreciate some thoughts on is this...

    one problem is concerned the way upgrades are shown. i'm working on showing weapons like this *** not in the screenshot, the screenshot shows basic selection, since this one is still in progress
    -Class 1
    |-Weapon 1 (base)
    ||-Upgrade type
    |||-Level 1
    |||-Level 2
    ||-Upgrade type
    |||-Level 1
    |||-Level 2
    |-Weapon 2 (base)
    ||-Upgrade type
    |||-Level 1
    |||-Level 2
    ||-Upgrade type
    |||-Level 1
    |||-Level 2
    -Class 2
    |-Weapon 1 (base)
    ||-Upgrade type
    |||-Level 1
    |||-Level 2
    ||-Upgrade type
    |||-Level 1
    |||-Level 2
    this produces really, really large list but still easy to find or browse. well, if anyone thinks he has some better way to represent this... speak up, this is why i'm asking this

    second thing about which i'm wondering are temporary browser values. showing str/dex/int/fth/hum temporary selection so one could look at weapon scalings and MagAdjusts during the selection even though his character doesn't have those values and not screw the settings he specified. i just can't decide if i'd like this feature or not... so please... again speak your mind. valuable or not?

    also missing from screenshots is spell selection (i disabled it since i don't really like how i did it). this will be featured later

    i'm not really fan of polls, i'd rather see constructive thoughts

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    Re: character build optimizer

    Post by PPG-3- on Wed Jan 25, 2012 3:48 pm

    wow it looks really good. love the amount of detail with everything.

    with regards to showing the upgrade weapon path, the way you've presented seems logical. Even if it will produce a long list it will still be easy to search through.

    the temp feature would be a nice to have but if its giving you trouble its definitely not neccessary.
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    Re: character build optimizer

    Post by somebody_else on Wed Jan 25, 2012 4:05 pm

    nah, not even nearly any trouble;)

    but, as you noticed i'm detail obsessed... i'm wondering if that would be detail too much or not. too many details screw with usability, while too low are lowering it.

    here it is how it would look like with provisional values editing (i'm just worrying i would do too much of everything)
    http://illiweb.com/fa/pbucket.gif

    and here is with spell selector (don't know why or what... but something is bothering me about it and that's why i removed it from screenshots)
    http://illiweb.com/fa/pbucket.gif

    so,... don't worry about ***more work***. this is my fun project and i want best execution possible no matter the work.

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    Re: character build optimizer

    Post by PPG-3- on Wed Jan 25, 2012 4:26 pm

    yeah that wished stats is a good idea. very good....so good i might have to refrain building a new character until you release that bad boy.
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    Re: character build optimizer

    Post by Baynay on Wed Jan 25, 2012 5:18 pm

    I'm looking forward to this calculator !
    I don't see many things to add here, hope we will be able to beta test it soon to have a better view happy


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    Re: character build optimizer

    Post by somebody_else on Wed Jan 25, 2012 8:44 pm

    well, just so my question is more descriptive. here is how detailed chooser looks (it is already done for the most part)

    http://illiweb.com/fa/pbucket.gif
    http://illiweb.com/fa/pbucket.gif

    so... does this seem better than (this one also requires 2 steps to select specific weapon)
    http://illiweb.com/fa/pbucket.gif

    ???

    p.s. Specified damage and bonus is not in screenshot yet

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    Re: character build optimizer

    Post by PPG-3- on Thu Jan 26, 2012 9:28 am

    not really sure what more you can add there.

    1 thought would be to group weapons by class as opposed to alphabetical order. but im not really sure if thats an improvement at all as most ppl might be able to find things faster by name anyways.

    the upgraded weapon section is exactly what people want to see and its presented very cleanly. well done.
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    Re: character build optimizer

    Post by Halicarnassis on Thu Jan 26, 2012 10:30 am

    This looks awesome. I think the more detail the better really. I dont mind clicking on a few buttons to get the right weapon etc. What abour armours - are you going to get all the data for +1-+15 and the twinkling? Thats ALOT of work!!!


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    Re: character build optimizer

    Post by somebody_else on Thu Jan 26, 2012 11:12 am

    Halicarnassis wrote:This looks awesome. I think the more detail the better really. I dont mind clicking on a few buttons to get the right weapon etc. What abour armours - are you going to get all the data for +1-+15 and the twinkling? Thats ALOT of work!!!

    yes, everything;) but, just to get taste of sheer data size. i think weapon xml files take about 3.5MB (9180 upgrade specs). but, it is much easier since i parsed them from game data. writing them by hand would probably drive me crazy.

    i know that few weapons are missing (cursed artorias and few specific like occult heater shield, nothing serious), those will either need to be done manually or hopefully contributed by people that want to see those.

    although, talking to my friend that will work on web part i'll probably have to limit weapons for web part to final upgrades in order to not spam items (downloading 10MB of specs would be hell). i.ll probably do some preferences here too for people that are just interested into maxed weapons not to spam them with useless options. 9180 is helluva lot of options if one is lazy.


    PPG-3- wrote:not really sure what more you can add there.

    1 thought would be to group weapons by class as opposed to alphabetical order. but im not really sure if thats an improvement at all as most ppl might be able to find things faster by name anyways.

    the upgraded weapon section is exactly what people want to see and its presented very cleanly. well done.

    you mean different grouping than this? now primary list is weapon classes (sorted alphabetically, big red font on screenshot) with all weapons that are in that class (sorted alphabetically, bold blue font on screenshot) containing upgrade paths (green italic) which contain upgrade levels (black)

    http://illiweb.com/fa/pbucket.gif
    http://illiweb.com/fa/pbucket.gif

    i'm always prepared to work on better option, just suggest;)

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    Re: character build optimizer

    Post by PPG-3- on Thu Jan 26, 2012 12:08 pm

    sorry i thought one of the screenshots i looked at just seemed to have all weapons sorted by alpha order. but those pics you showed cleared that up.
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    Re: character build optimizer

    Post by somebody_else on Fri Jan 27, 2012 7:11 pm

    ... so after lack of feedback on preferences i decided on implementing them all to see how they feel

    here is last type of browser which only shows maxed gear
    http://illiweb.com/fa/pbucket.gif

    but, since i really couldn't decide on which would be best i changed interface to allow switching them on the fly
    http://illiweb.com/fa/pbucket.gif
    also added support to load and save characters (but i plan on paste char support where you can copy/paste information like simple link and preset editor. i think this would work especially good between people communicating over the web. on posts link, other copy pastes it in bin and sees complete information)

    now, i only have to check armor file imports for sanity and implement bolts and arrows and there will be first beta release

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    Re: character build optimizer

    Post by User on Fri Jan 27, 2012 7:18 pm

    Once you are done, and when it works, you should hook it up to the Wikis. I am sure someone would love to use it, if not many. It would be very useful for people to experiment with 'planned' builds with accurate analysis'
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    Re: character build optimizer

    Post by somebody_else on Fri Jan 27, 2012 7:30 pm

    Acidic_Cook wrote:Once you are done, and when it works, you should hook it up to the Wikis. I am sure someone would love to use it, if not many. It would be very useful for people to experiment with 'planned' builds with accurate analysis'

    well, that's a plan that is already in progress. but, web work will start once i finish crossplatform (linux/win/osx) standalone application. friend that will work on it doesn't play DkS, he is just doing favor for me. so... i want to avoid the need for him to rewrite it as many times as i did. and this is why i need to communicate things like copy/paste with him before implementation.

    my vision of copy/paste goes like this...
    you paste char on forum and i either click that in browser to get on web app that set all values or simply copy link and paste into my app to do the same as web interface will definitely have to omit some features in order not to get cumbersome and slow.
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    Re: character build optimizer

    Post by somebody_else on Sat Jan 28, 2012 8:48 pm

    ok, i polished spell (grouped by type) selector
    http://illiweb.com/fa/pbucket.gif
    and ring selector
    http://illiweb.com/fa/pbucket.gif

    if anyone has opinion on icons (i kinda feel they should be smaller) speak up
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    Re: character build optimizer

    Post by Baynay on Sat Jan 28, 2012 10:08 pm

    Thinks it's great, size is fine happy


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