First New Game Plus, level up?

Last night I broke my Min/Maxed sl74 battlemage build to up my strength to 16 to play around with Moonlight Greatsword etc. I have about 200k souls just sitting around with nothing to do from farming random things and playing around in the cat covenant.  

As I've decided to go ahead with my first New Game Plus, should I go ahead and level up somewhat, or will I be OK at SL74?  I don't want to try it out, then find 74 is waaay too low as I loose all my souls before firelink.  Suggestions?

Sidenote: What covenant should I keep?  SunBros for more PVE help and something to do with Gywn's Soul (I have no faith stat) or Cat for something to do when I'm bored, or what?

PS- Should I buy and complete the DLC first?

NG+ isn't THAT much harder, especially early on. If you have fully upgraded gear it should be a cakewalk initially. Just note that things do a lot more damage so don't wade into 3+ hollows or something and you'll be fine.

At 16 str, you can cheese almost the entire game with an upgraded eagle shield + appropriate armor for an area anyway (for example wear lightning-resistant stuff against O&S and blocking a butt slam does like 20% of your health lol). People have beaten this game NG +6 at SL 1, so 74 is far from "way too low" .

On most of my MP builds I went into NG+ just for the souls. Bosses give a ton there and you can fast-swap on serpent ring and/or avarice and rake in even more. Really the only hard fights in NG+ are O&S and 4kings - the latter because it's hard to do enough damage in time (SL 1 builds tend to use red tearstone there)...however most +15 scaled weapons are still plenty and power within makes it pretty trivial.

Eagle shield + pyros makes all NG+ a walkover if you use maxed pyro flame + PW + great combustions . Centipede and quelag aren't hard enough to matter, and nothing else is fire immune.

I'm less familiar with expansion content though. Some of that might be a little harder; for example I know you can't just permablock kalameet, only some of his attacks.

Thanks, that's really helpful. I'll stop worrying about level then. Is there any reason to go with any covenant in particular? I like the Cat for my PVP, but that should be pretty easy to get back to in a new game since Andre sells the crest and it's a short run from firelink. Should I go SunBros so that I can get the last miracle this playthrough, and then never have to switch covenants again?

Covenants are your choice. I don't think you can use sunlight spear unless you are currently a sunbro, so it would be hard to invade with it. Same goes for darkmoon blade and the bountiful/whatever sunlight spells. Sunlight blade is a solid choice for darkwraiths/forest hunters if looking to buff, as is crystal magic weapon .

IMO for that kind of thing just pick whatever you feel like doing, as you say going back to catbro is pretty easy.

Ya, I wanted to stay with SunBro so that I could get the spear and finish the Maiden Trophy right away. But I think I'll stick with Cat, and just bring along enough sunlight medals to join the sunbros, get the required rank, and convert the soul, then go back to cat.

Oh. If you want the achievement in that case you might as well sunbro. At your level it might be hard to get action though. Maybe New Londo? 74 is high for Anor Londo players looking for help in regular NG.

I'm not sure how the summoning action is in NG+ for fights like gargs.

That's a good point? What SL are other people around NG+, for the purposes of Co-op? I made this SL76 build with a PVP focus, but I suppose that could bite me hard when I need help with the Gargoyles.

lol Gargoyles are a cakewalk with a lvl 74 mage. If u need help with them you can always summon sunbro and lautrec

.... I just got to NG+ at level 69 for the first time myself, and I gotta say..... it's going to be very hard to find random co-op. NG+ has been surprisingly easy, provided the player continues leveling up and doesn't stay low level for a challenge. I'm not, like, "good" at Dark Souls, but I've beaten all the bosses up to and including O+S solo on the first or second try. The tutorial boss I one-shotted with a plunging attack. If that gives you any idea.

Anyway, haven't seen any summon signs while running human. Lots of pvp action, though. If you are playing on PC, I'd happily co-op with you so you can get your sunlight medals.... but I suspect you are playing on another system.

well SL doesn't say too much, what matters in my opinion is that a) your main damage scaling stat is at max before the cut (for a mage that would be 50 INT) and b) that you have enough endurance and vita to survive without the need for the Ring of favour and Protection. To be able to use the Dark Wood Grain Ring and run at a good speed, for my mage (17 equip load) that be endurance level @28 which yields in 68 end. Put rest in vita and dex for faster casting and you'll rush through NG+ without any troubles.

I am now on my 5th playthrough with my second char, my SL was @94 when I began NG+ with my mage. NG is the easiest of all playthroughs hence that's the place where I do every area and fight every boss. On NG+ and especially NG++ I just rush to the bosses for souls, the occasional farming here and there. NG is for getting ready to do that with ease, I don't get why people want to start a NG+ as quickly as possible. Take everything in the game has to offer on NG, level your char as far as possible, max out your armor and weapons, get all embers, kindle all bonfires because later on NG+(++...) you wont be able to enjoy it as stress free as on NG.

As for covenants I prefere the Way of Light, simply because I hate being invaded when I'm PvE'ing in human form. If I'm in the mood for some PvP action (which usually happens only once per playthrough^^) I switch to the forest hunters and get summoned about a minute after I've put on the ring. Kill (or be killed), wait a minute, repeat.

About the DLC: it's hard as hell, I'd say Artorias and Manus are about the hardest bosses in the game, Manus has the highest HP. Even on NG I had to use the TCC and Power Within to kill Manus, though that's probably also because my reaction is getting slower the older I get. Chances are big that you'll skip them entirely after your 100th fail on NG+ if you didn't prepare your char well enough in NG.

That being said: that's only my opinion and the way I like to play DS. It's a hard enough challenge how it is and I don't see why I have to make it harder for myself than necessary

In watching videos of people fighting artorias he doesn't seem that bad, not to mention he looks like one of those bosses a sturdy greatshield can just laugh at.

TheMeInTeam wrote:In watching videos of people fighting artorias he doesn't seem that bad, not to mention he looks like one of those bosses a sturdy greatshield can just laugh at.

That's likely true. A Black Knight Shield +5 was my saving grace when I didn't manage a dodge. Problem with DLC bosses is that they don't seem to be particularly weak against any elements and have a ton of HP. And you can't cheese Artorias - no hiding in safe spots or getting him stuck in terrain. It's a skill fight, and a +15 weapon with appropriate stats is a good idea.

If OP wants to try the DLC, I'd recommend doing it in NG first. Also would be a good place to find Co-op, even at a higher SL.

You can block one of his blows, that'll drain your whole stamina and the second blow usually follows within half a second and your dead. Artorias is all about evading, I don't believe you can block more than 1-2 blows, especially after he charged up. It took me like 20-30 tries to get all his moves and know which one I can evade in which moment and which I can block (there's only one move I can savely block but that drained my whole stamina bar), another 20-30 tries until I finally got him for the first time. Though that was on NG++ with a somewhat screwed up Pyromancer. On NG my mage grilled him on the 3rd try.

My tactic for Artorias: pack as much power as you have (Power within, Crown and Ring and TCC for mage) and kill him as quickly as you can. As I said my reaction isn't always the best and there's only a tiny split-second where you can savely roll away. Do it too early and he follows you (even when he's in Air), too late and you're almost dead. I watched some videos too of people evading succesfully 20-30 of his attacks until they finished him, but as easy at it might look in the video, that takes some awesome skill (which I lack appearantly ).

EDIT: the OP said he's playing a mage and all my experience with Artorias is only with Pyro and Mage - dunno how a Havel player would stand against him, though I don't think it'd be easy, certainly not on NG++.

Despite all that, if you're thinking about getting the DLC, get it It's well worth the money, 4 very challenging bosses, somewhat useful spells, a new world to explore and if you're into PvP, arenas to fight in (though I never did that yet). It's what drew me back into DS after 2 years of absence

There is a big, big difference between blocking with a medium shield and blocking with something like Havel's, GSOA, or Eagle +15. Black knight shield is closer in stability to a heater than it is to Eagle +15.

With GSOA and 40 stamina you can literally not bother to dodge super smough's hammer shovel charge.  You can block it, and not take damage aside from lightning chip.  I doubt Artorias packs materially more poise break than a 3 hit combo from smough charge.

The thing about elemental damage is true though.  Emarrel was talking about it.  You can probably still do something with PURE pyro + pyro boosts or pure magic (as opposed to split damage from elementals), but physical is probably best.

My Pyro has an Eagle with +15 and stamina at 40, I couldn't take it for long and not at all when he was charged. But really, it's only about 19€ for 20+ additional hours of play time - just get it and try it yourself And I think there's a reason why there are no videos showing someone constantly blocking him, though maybe I just didn't search enough.

TheMeInTeam wrote:There is a big, big difference between blocking with a medium shield and blocking with something like Havel's, GSOA, or Eagle +15.  Black knight shield is closer in stability to a heater than it is to Eagle +15.

With GSOA and 40 stamina you can literally not bother to dodge super smough's hammer shovel charge.  You can block it, and not take damage aside from lightning chip.  I doubt Artorias packs materially more poise break than a 3 hit combo from smough charge.

Well yeah, that's what I was trying to imply. If my medium shield with 74 stability can take a hit here and there it stands to reason a greatshield would be effective. (Black Knight Shield's not the best for the job, anyway. But it's what I had.) Would not want to try tanking one of those fully charged leaping attacks if I could help it, tho. Even of it didn't result in insta-death it'd probably hurt pretty bad. And it hits from above too... I think it might be able to hit you and miss the shield completely. But I never tried so..... I dunno *shrug*.

But anyway! What were we talking about?! OP, go play DLC and don't worry about leveling up! Yeah!

PyroElleh wrote:
But anyway! What were we talking about?!  OP, go play DLC and don't worry about leveling up! Yeah!

Thanks everyone, I'll do it!