The old gods migration (Spoilers if you haven't played DkS1)

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    Chaos Spectre
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    The old gods migration (Spoilers if you haven't played DkS1)

    Post by Chaos Spectre on Tue Sep 24, 2013 8:13 pm

    Hello everyone, I have returned to the forums, and am here to state a theory.

    Many of us theorize that this game is set in the past. The lack of pyromancy and the existence of dragons is a large giveaway of these theories. This could possibly be taking place during the dragon wars.

    This means that the flame exists, but chaos does not yet. However, I feel that the flame has a reach that we will learn about in this game. 

    In Lordran, there were no cold zones besides the Painted World. Everything was generally warm and habitable by basically anything. I feel as if the flame was the reason things were like this. Its power, its heat, expanded across the land. All that it touched was controllable by the gods. 

    Now, when the flame started to fade, the gods started to leave. We know for a fact that Gwynevere and her husband left Lordran, and that others left as well. Based on a tweet from Miyazaki, I believe we will be seeing them in this new land. "Before the darkness. What would make the gods leave?"


    But this leaves me in a confused state. As far as I know, the dragons were defeated before the flames began to fade. Clearly it wasn't very long after the dragons were slain that the flames began to fade, seeing as how some survived, but I was sure that the gods left because of the corruption of the flame to chaos. But due to the lack of pyromancy and the high amount of dragons, clearly something else happened. 


    So what do people think made them leave, and do you think we will see them in DkS2?


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    Re: The old gods migration (Spoilers if you haven't played DkS1)

    Post by ViralEnsign_ on Tue Sep 24, 2013 9:44 pm

    CHAOS YOU ARE BACK?!


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    Re: The old gods migration (Spoilers if you haven't played DkS1)

    Post by SlothAlmighty on Tue Sep 24, 2013 10:01 pm

    drakes are abundant dragons not so much.  they only showed one true dragon and one or two dragon skeletons.
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    Re: The old gods migration (Spoilers if you haven't played DkS1)

    Post by Chaos Spectre on Tue Sep 24, 2013 10:36 pm

    @Viral
    Yes I am. I figure its time for me to make an appearance again and start up some flames. I've missed this community and I've missed Dark Souls. I have the chance to play Demon's Souls now too, so I will be much more knowledgable soonish. 

    @Sloth
    Valid point. Still there are some dragons, and that makes me wonder if maybe they are one of many. 

    Speaking of drakes, what makes a drake a drake? In most lore I've read, a drake is a dragon without wings. My ex went nuts over that when she saw them.


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    Re: The old gods migration (Spoilers if you haven't played DkS1)

    Post by SlothAlmighty on Wed Sep 25, 2013 10:07 pm

    Drakes as I understand it have back legs, but not front legs (wings for front limbs)

    Dragons have 4 limbs plus wings.

    I could be wrong though.  I'm not well versed on the lore side.  I think maybe they were the product of seaths experiments or something like that.
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    Re: The old gods migration (Spoilers if you haven't played DkS1)

    Post by CaligoIllioneus on Fri Sep 27, 2013 5:02 am

    Wyverns are the ones supposed to only have back legs. Dark Souls calls wyverns drakes as if they were interchangeable terms (Hellkite, Valley of Drakes) I don't know if this is a translation issue or if in the world of Dark Souls wyverns and drakes are one and the same.

    As for dragons, remember the "dragon wars" were not the extermination of every dragon, it was just the extermination of the Everlasting Dragons (and even then we know of one that survived) other dragons like Kalameet or the Gaping Dragon exist way after that.

    As for the gods leaving, it's still early to create a theory that isn't rampant speculation, but well let's see...

    the undead missions of the Way of the White probably started already, going by the undead wearing Paladin Armor. Also there are enemies that look like hollowed soldiers of a kingdom so the curse of the undead seems to be in full force. At the same time pyromancy does not seem to exist.

    Faith now have access to what looks like dark magic, which may be a connection to occult conspiracy against the gods.

    This may help us speculate about the time period the game is set in.
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    Re: The old gods migration (Spoilers if you haven't played DkS1)

    Post by Serious_Much on Fri Sep 27, 2013 8:10 am

    For me the whole naming dragon types on legs they have doesn't really work, as just like in Dark Souls or any other fantasy setting, you could easily make a dragon with two legs and call it a dragon, or 4 legs and call it wyvern/drake/whatever other distinction. So in my opinion it doesn't matter too much about naming stuff. I'd love to make a funky dragon and call it the wild flipdoppidoodah

    I think personally they're going to introduce us to some of the deities and gods we have heard about, but not actually met. Personally I'd like to meet Velka (presuming she is the kind of self pronounced 'god' that the lordran deities were) and the real gwynevere, that would be an interesting one.


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    Re: The old gods migration (Spoilers if you haven't played DkS1)

    Post by SlothAlmighty on Fri Sep 27, 2013 4:14 pm

    I think you are right about wyverns, Also the kellkite dragon that you get the drake sword from has 4 legs.  the drakes from valley of the drakes are described as 'small blue wyverns'

    It very well could be a translation issue or it could be that Drake is a generic term for wyverns and dragons.

    There is also the everlasting dragon as opposed the the hellkite dragon.  so it could be that the everlasting dragons were 'dragon gods' of sorts with regular dragons like kalameet and the hellkite and zombie dragon, etc being mortal versions.

    Being that this game seems to center around dragons, I think we will get new lore explaining it.
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    Re: The old gods migration (Spoilers if you haven't played DkS1)

    Post by CaligoIllioneus on Fri Sep 27, 2013 11:47 pm

    The Hellkite Dragon is in fact a wyvern as it only has two legs, not four.

    The Drake Sword's description calls it a drake.

    This is why I said it may be a translation issue (do dragons/wyverns/drakes even have a distinction in japanese?) or simply that in the world of Dark Souls drakes and wyverns are the same. It is not that important, anyways.

    What we do know about dragon lore in Dark Souls is the following:

    The Gaping Dragon is a "deformed descendant of the Everlasting Dragons". I believe this should also apply to Kalameet because it is in fact a dragon but it has some notable differences (only one eye, for example) and is not as resilient as an Everlasting Dragon should be (plus all the Everlasting Dragons we have seen looked exactly the same). Everlasting Dragons were basically invulnerable and unchanging and came from before the First Flame, it makes sense that the rest of the dragons we know are lesser descendants of them, post-Flame, and thus vulnerable and susceptible to changes brought by Disparity. For example, the Gaping Dragon's form was warped by its insatiable hunger and that's why he looks like that. He has six legs, so it doesn't seem like in the world of Dark Souls the number of legs is that important in identifying species of dragon.

    We also know drakes/wyverns are a dragon's distant kin, going by the description of the Drake Sword.

    There are basically 3 types of dragons in Dark Souls: Everlasting Dragons; lesser Dragons, which are descendants of Everlasting Dragons, and drakes/wyverns, who are in turn descendants of the lesser dragons.

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