Problem: Magic Weapon Damage

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    Tortuga

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    Problem: Magic Weapon Damage

    Post by Tortuga on Fri Mar 09, 2012 3:45 pm

    I turned my Uchi +5 into a Magic Uchi the other day, and when I tested it out on a basic hollow in the New Londo Ruins, it's damage was actually *lower* in practice than before. Stat scaling and the like could not possibly make this difference, and I'm ~SL40 anyhow. I compete with a roomie for Dark Souls time so I can't empirically test this junk out at-length, but I would dearly love to know if anybody else has noticed this type of problem. I doubt that Fire or Lightning weapons have this strange problem, but it does make me worry about all the tiers of magic, as well as divine and occult.

    So: does the weapon stat readout not tell the whole story, or is there something simple I missed?
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    Re: Problem: Magic Weapon Damage

    Post by sparkly-twinkly-lizard on Fri Mar 09, 2012 4:08 pm

    are you an int build? cause thats the only build that really benefits from magic weapons cause it adds int scaling, also some beasties are more resisitant to magic damage than physical so... more tests required.


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    Tortuga

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    Re: Problem: Magic Weapon Damage

    Post by Tortuga on Fri Mar 09, 2012 10:55 pm

    This is the gist of my issue: the information screen for a weapon will display the physical, magic, fire, and lightning attributes. The physical damage seems accurate; all that is truly required is the stat threshold to wield the weapon. When ascended to magic, the added magic value implies the damage will be nearly double what it was before (most of what the physical value used to be, plus just as much new magic damage). However, this is not so in practice.

    Here's another quick example I did today: Black Bow of Pharis.
    the Magic version (+0) did 40 dmg headshots on a hollow spearweilder outside Andrei's. I then reverted it back to a Black Bow of Pharis +5 and the headshots did 100 damage. These enemies have no magic resistances to speak of, really. My INT value would matter if I were looking to edge-out over another type of upgrade, sure, but this is just plain weakening a weapon when it should strictly improve it regardless of stats.

    So let me ask this: if the magic value on a magic weapon is not the pure damage it adds (plus the additional amount the scaling does in parentheses next to it) then what is the value for?
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    Re: Problem: Magic Weapon Damage

    Post by Serious_Much on Fri Mar 09, 2012 11:25 pm

    Okay the pure AR is not the same as damage in practice.

    In general pure damage 450 (eg Moonlight GS) will be far superior to damage done by a Lightning uchi +5 (also near that number) because it has to go through two sets of defences. (and the scaling for physical is reduced)

    So lets say 230 phys (inc. scaling) goes into 300 shared into 2 150s.

    If defence is 100 for each one, the pure damage comes out at 130 damage and the magic weapon at only 100 in total. These are complete bull **** numbers but the premice is there.

    also remember end game defences are around the 250 minimum up to 350 area. This shows you compared to usual ARs of dual element weapons why you need a larger total.


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    Re: Problem: Magic Weapon Damage

    Post by Tortuga on Sat Mar 10, 2012 9:12 am

    Today I went back to New Londo, this time with a Lightning Iato +0 vs Washing Pole +10. The Lightning Iato behaved exactly as it should, doing almost 2X damage. Fire probably works the same way, obviously. I just don't understand why *those* numbers are accurate and yet the Magic category is a big fat liar. I suppose it *must* have something to do with scaling, but... come on. The stat display page has no business listing 100-odd Magic Attack Rating unless it does do that. especially when the other elements behave the way they say they do.

    Sorry for being thick, but I still don't understand why AR for magic is a fraction of what it says it is even when there is no magic defense going into the equation. My understanding is there's nothing else going into the equation... :/

    (got my character to Giant Blacksmith anyhow but I'd still love to get this squared away in my mind)

    I appreciate the responses. happy

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