Gesture Backstabbing

Animaaal wrote:

Forum Pirate wrote:.....You cannot know wether or not they are baiting, thus pragmatism dictates it always poses a threat.....

It certainly does not.

By that logic, offering you a couch to sleep on because you've had too much to drink inherently implies I'm going to fondle you while you sleep....

...not saying I'm above that.






I kid I kid

It does not inherently imply anything, but it certainly should be considered.

In fact, pragmatism dictates you should not have been drinking in the firstplace, at least not around people who may take advantage of your lesser state of mind.



In any case, what jan said.

I don't know the intent behind any of your actions, and you have forcefully invaded my world presumably, as thats the point of the covs that invade, to kill me. Any and all actions will be treated as hostile.

I can't believe this OP:

chundersmiff wrote:have you ever done a gesture backstab? like when someone is bowing and you just go up to their backs and kill them in 1 backstab? I've done it to low level players in Undead Parish about 20 times in the past 2 hours

im pretty honourable

Got this many posts already.

Animaaal wrote:Chivalry is real?  

 You often post things like this. A statement that by itself makes no sense and a shrug.

The world (or specifically myself) cannot read your mind, and it is very unclear what you mean when you post like this.

because of the shrug and the question mark my only assumption is that it's either sarcastic or sardonic in nature. And so I'm just left with a feeling that you are either incapable of explaining yourself or you don't believe it's worth the effort to explain yourself. And in either case it simply seems antagonistic

Chilvalry loses fights, and wars. An english king is famous for murdering knights with hoards of archers instead of doing the typical randsom 1v1 combat thing, and it won him many battles.

Forum Pirate wrote:

Animaaal wrote:

Forum Pirate wrote:.....You cannot know wether or not they are baiting, thus pragmatism dictates it always poses a threat.....

It certainly does not.

By that logic, offering you a couch to sleep on because you've had too much to drink inherently implies I'm going to fondle you while you sleep....

...not saying I'm above that.






I kid I kid

It does not inherently imply anything, but it certainly should be considered.

In fact, pragmatism dictates you should not have been drinking in the firstplace, at least not around people who may take advantage of your lesser state of mind.



In any case, what jan said.

I don't know the intent behind any of your actions, and you have forcefully invaded my world presumably, as thats the point of the covs that invade, to kill me. Any and all actions will be treated as hostile.

Well some people drink a little too much, or have too much alcohol in their system to avoid a DUI, even if they are competent to drive.  In which case choosing to sleep on the couch is not only responsible, but the right thing to do according to any logic.

I never said that invaders, or even hosts for that matter shouldn’t be treated as a threat.  But bowing at your invader/host is not as big of a threat as you make it out to be imo.

Jansports wrote:

Animaaal wrote:Chivalry is real?

You often post things like this. A statement that by itself makes no sense and a shrug.

The world (or specifically myself) cannot read your mind, and it is very unclear what you mean when you post like this.

because of the shrug and the question mark my only assumption is that it's either sarcastic or sardonic in nature. And so I'm just left with a feeling that you are either incapable of explaining yourself or you don't believe it's worth the effort to explain yourself. And in either case it simply seems antagonistic

Ya, thanks for leaving out the other part.  Just saying bowing is 99% of the time an act of chivalry…

….jeez man.  Sorry?

PS-btw...I'm usually pretty transparent when I want to say something like "you're stupid"...I usually word it with "you're stupid".

You are unfairly labeling me. I didn't use the "Well what is it gesture" ya know.

Forum Pirate wrote:Chivalry loses fights, and wars. An english king is famous for murdering knights with hoards of archers instead of doing the typical randsom 1v1 combat thing, and it won him many battles.

Its also how America won.  I get what you’re saying, but chivalry maintains society…without it…there would be no “society”.

So what you meant by your statement and emoticon shrug was something along the lines of

"Bowing before a fight is generally a chivalrous act, even if their intention is to kill you immediately afterwards for this brief moment they should not be viewed as a threat as from assumption we can deduce that while bowing they are harmless and are simply showing us respect"

Because previously Chivalry had not come up, nor does this statement seem to address the issue that an invader simply entering my world is a threatening action. As soon as the invader spawns is precisely when he becomes a threat to me, and I become a threat to him.

Perhaps if there was more exposition about chivalry and how it relates to the discussion at hand in your post I wouldn't have been so lost as to your meaning.

Jansports wrote:

Animaaal wrote:Chivalry is real?  

 You often post things like this. A statement that by itself makes no sense and a shrug.

The world (or specifically myself) cannot read your mind, and it is very unclear what you mean when you post like this.

because of the shrug and the question mark my only assumption is that it's either sarcastic or sardonic in nature. And so I'm just left with a feeling that you are either incapable of explaining yourself or you don't believe it's worth the effort to explain yourself. And in either case it simply seems antagonistic

 
I don't understand. If you wouldn't have deleted a part of his post, that statement wouldn't have been by itself. 

This is a forum, not a pissing contest.

It looks like this is another thread gone down to egos and trying to one up each other with petty comments.

Please stop with the personal comments and get back on the topic, or just leave the thread alone to people who wish to express their experience of what the OP discussed.

The second part of his post is expanding on Chivalry which even with the second statement it is unclear why chivalry is even an issue when considering whether or not to backstab a bow. My point is that by itself there is no reason to assume chivalry has anything to do with the current topic. The post lacks the explanation that Bowing is seen by part of the community to be a chivalrous act.

Once explained it becomes clear why he would bring up chivalry. But my point is that the explanation was lacking.

Imo, the only reason to actually bow (without a phantom waiting in the shurbs of course) is chivalry.

I don't see how the use of the word is irrelevant to the discussion.

There's nothing wrong with discussing chivalry, as it's part of the issue (though very much a side note). What I object to is posts where members go back and forth picking apart each others posts for no other reason than to belittle and one up each other while ignoring the topic at hand and derailing it. Keep the discussion to the point and steer clear of the personal jabs.

Should have ended here before inflamed ego's erupted.

TooLeet wrote:When the community duels against each other, we always bow.

When bowing to random, we risk the chance of getting backstabbed.

We all understand this, no point in going further, and certainly no point in over-analyzing such a simple topic.

/thread.

 

Just don't backstab bows in pvp areas ya'll.  

Chivalry has been what sets us apart from the CoD atmosphere and other gaming communities that believe "anything goes".

We on the other hand, have realized the flaws in the design FROM has made (and by that I mean no one is perfect...not even FROM) and have chose to establish our own set of "rules of conduct" to compensate for the lack of perfection that FROM (or anyone for that matter) is incapable of achieving.

Chivalry has a lot to do with that.

Bowing makes you vulnerable, and the community in large part has accepted that as a "norm" and have chosen to forgo exploiting that weakness.

Anyone who has be seasoned will not be upset by someone who backstabs them while bowing.  However, anyone who is seasoned will also look at such tactics as unsavory and scrubish.

This is the souls community truth, but it has little to do with random invasions.

In random invasions, "ALMOST anything goes" has been stated by the majority voice for a very long time.

I never do it on purpose.  I don't care if they are gankers and rank somewhere between a "roach and that white stuff that accumulates at the corner of your mouth when you're really thirsty", I fight people how I want to be fought.

reim0027 wrote:I never do it on purpose.  I don't care if they are gankers and rank somewhere between a "**** and that white stuff that accumulates at the corner of your mouth when you're really thirsty", I fight people how I want to be fought.

Sticky white stuff needs +1 and ^ rep.  

If not, I'll get you tomorrow reim....or maybe in 1 hour and 48 minutes...depends  

^ Post time is 1 minute off.

See Animaal? We do agree on some aspects on PvP.  

I bowstab sometimes,bearing in mind I'm always in the forest.It really depends how I feel/how PVP has been that day.I do have a soft spot for people who bow though,I end up going easy on them if I'm not having a bad day.

Reminds me of this one invader I had in Anor Londo.
CoD, Catalyst and Rapier. He ran right onto me and did a proper bow. I backed away. He ran to me again and did proper bow once more. We repeated this one more time.
On one side, I believe he wanted to bs me, or use a spell as soon as I use a gesture. The danger was there and it was pretty obvious too. But on the other hand maybe he was really into the honour thing and only wanted to bow to me before we fight. There were quite a few guys I met that did this. Basically refusing to engage until both of you bow. I'll never know. 
Since I was questing and all and really wanted to get rid of him to use the bonfire, I backstabbed him on his third proper bow.

Similar thing, again in Anor Londo. I summoned two guys at the start of Anor and we got to Solaires bonfire. I was thinking about sending them home, especially since I got only 1 Estus left. Before I could decide, we had an invader. He saw us all standing there and bowed. Who the hell bows to a gank squad?! My phantoms bowed back. Really? What? You gonna go at him one at a time guys? Anyway, I didn't want to take any risks and went to bs him as he was bowing. Since this was before DLC and Nito, I couldn't use Prostration, or I'm sorry Carving. I'm not happy I did, but he showed an opening and I took it. Better then finding out he has modded weapon, or skills high enough to take us and I have to stroll through whole Anor again.
Later, I got a mail from the vader telling me, in a very polite way that I have no honour. I replied to him that I don't care about honour, I just want to clear Anor Londo and if he dislikes this sort of behavior he shouldn't invade people and perhaps use RSS, or Dragon Eye.

Should I feel bad about it?

Sentiel wrote:Similar thing, again in Anor Londo. I summoned two guys at the start of Anor and we got to Solaires bonfire. I was thinking about sending them home, especially since I got only 1 Estus left. Before I could decide, we had an invader. He saw us all standing there and bowed. Who the hell bows to a gank squad?! 

 
It sounds to me you were questing. Not ganking.


Or, were you ganking? Because that would explain "gank squad."

Sentiel wrote:Reminds me of this one invader I had in Anor Londo.
CoD, Catalyst and Rapier. He ran right onto me and did a proper bow. I backed away. He ran to me again and did proper bow once more. We repeated this one more time. 

Had something similar except i bowed like an idiot after the third attempt and got soulsucked for 10 humanity.

Forum Pirate wrote:Not even kind of. Bow stabbing is taking an advantage your opponent has (foolishly) provided you with.

Forum Pirate wrote:You cannot know wether or not they are baiting, thus pragmatism dictates it always poses a threat. They could be baiting so they can buff as well.

   

tell me what is a bow? an advantage that the opponent gave you, or a threat to you...sorry can't take you serious you only interpret that bow how you need it to fight the way you want to fight, thats it!
But even worse you try to tell everybody that this is logical and the only way to treat a bow.
And it's getting better:

Forum Pirate wrote:Chilvalry loses fights, and wars. An english king is famous for murdering knights with hoards of archers instead of doing the typical randsom 1v1 combat thing, and it won him many battles.

 Use ABC Weapons in real world conflicts, it's logical to take any measure to kill the opponent ASAP  

really a bow is a threat to you  you should play pokemon or something with low violence if THIS is a thread to you...really you made my day  


No rules = no community

simple as that!

I call all honorable knights to torture every bow-stabber slowly to death. Let them feel the pain. Be creative, use poison&toxic, let them heal until they got no more estus or humanity. Parry&Riposte them bare handed, use broken Sword - humiliate them in every way you can think of and make it long and dirty for them.

The amount of times you put 'thread' instead of 'threat' is making my head spin

TooLeet wrote:

Sentiel wrote:Similar thing, again in Anor Londo. I summoned two guys at the start of Anor and we got to Solaires bonfire. I was thinking about sending them home, especially since I got only 1 Estus left. Before I could decide, we had an invader. He saw us all standing there and bowed. Who the hell bows to a gank squad?! 

 
It sounds to me you were questing. Not ganking.


Or, were you ganking? Because that would explain "gank squad."

We were questing, but at the same time, we stopped to face the invader. I didn't want to get sudden ohko bs. We were 3v1. Even if it's for the sake of questing, if we go fight the invader all at the same time, it's still gank.

AnCapaillMor wrote:

Sentiel wrote:Reminds me of this one invader I had in Anor Londo.
CoD, Catalyst and Rapier. He ran right onto me and did a proper bow. I backed away. He ran to me again and did proper bow once more. We repeated this one more time. 

Had something similar except i bowed like an idiot after the third attempt and got soulsucked for 10 humanity.

10?! Darkwraith +3 huh?
Something like that also happened to me. I was watching the host and invader battle it out. They got close to me and suddnely, the host tried to R2 with Dark Hand on me. I had no idea if it's parriable, or no, but I still tried it. That Rapier riposte ended the whole mess.