Your opinion on exploits such as Dead angling or Lag abuse?

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    Should Exploits be in the game?

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    hey its andres
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    Re: Your opinion on exploits such as Dead angling or Lag abuse?

    Post by hey its andres on Wed Jul 31, 2013 6:01 pm

    Things like toggle escape and dead angling are kinks in the armor surrounding Dark Souls' combat system. Spell swapping is a full on Achilles' heel.

    That much is crystal clear.


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    Re: Your opinion on exploits such as Dead angling or Lag abuse?

    Post by Forum Pirate on Wed Jul 31, 2013 9:38 pm

    TheMeInTeam wrote:Counters to greatshield turtles without shotel or glitching:

    1.  Status effects.  Bleed (if it worked properly, and no reason it couldn't be patched to ignore I frames if one were to actually patch DA), toxic, poison, backstab the turtle if he tries to moss (or just hit him). 
    2.  Kick the shield repeatedly unless he's using a faster weapon than a kick. 
    3.  Also any of the 50+ poise break weapons 2h can rip shields up enough that trying to follow up with attacks after blocking isn't feasible. 

    Because greatshields can't parry, there is no threat of that while spamming them.

    So not only do you have the potential for magic chip, you have status effects, hammers/axes, and shotel.  Pretty much any major stat you opt to invest into will have one of these things to counter a shield, and some will have multiple options.

    There are the methods the game built in to handle great shields.  They're heavy and require significant investment just to use them, making very diffiicult to also fast roll unless at very high levels or running elemental weapons.  You don't "need" dead angles to deal with them.  Dead angles are no more a *necessary* feature than TWoD.  I suspect most people find TWoD more annoying because it's either "instant death" or "stall this out by running", neither of which involve actually fighting.  I'd be surprised if it won more random invasions than DA though if everyone knew about both.

    But what if instead of TWoD, people are using the glitch to "only" sunlight blade buff a lightning weapon?  Still necessarily worse than DA?  Not so clear all of a sudden.  I haven't seen one, but a SLB buffed lightning falchion would probably be really annoying lol.

    (i'm talking about the typical eagles shield/spear, fast roller types, i should have been clear. They can do it with mid shields as well, making parrying an option.)

    Attempting to inflict toxic leaves you vulnerable to leo counters, and spamming into the shield is a fantastic way to eat a leo counter (or a parry, depending on the shield, as explained above.)

    If you're close enough to them to punish a moss attempt, you're also close enough to eat whatever counter they have for attempting to use the status in the first place.

    If you spamm kick, you run into the same problem of eating 500 damage leo counters, and run the risk of missing one and betting bs'd.

    Bleed dodge, did I not mention that? its pretty easy, even while mid rolling, to dodge out bleed even with a mid roll. It could be patched sure, but its not, so, as is, thats not an effective counter.


    Even should these things work properly against turtles, they'd still be generally inadequate, as it takes what 6 or 7 hits to build bleed to the trigger point against a typical build? so you have to land 6 hits (which would normally just kill them) to go through like 30% of their hp?

    Thats not an ideal situation, I'd say turtles would be horriblly overpowered in that situation.


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