Your opinion on exploits such as Dead angling or Lag abuse?

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    Should Exploits be in the game?

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    [ 24 ]
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    Re: Your opinion on exploits such as Dead angling or Lag abuse?

    Post by Tolvo on Mon Jul 29, 2013 4:25 pm

    But it isn't a hack?  It's an exploit, a glitch.
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    Re: Your opinion on exploits such as Dead angling or Lag abuse?

    Post by Forum Pirate on Mon Jul 29, 2013 4:26 pm

    It can be done without hacking in any way. Its not necessarily a hack, though to be honest I'd rather deal with infinite hp than twod.


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    Re: Your opinion on exploits such as Dead angling or Lag abuse?

    Post by Serious_Much on Mon Jul 29, 2013 4:27 pm

    Tolvo wrote:But it isn't a hack?  It's an exploit, a glitch.

     Prime example of my lack of knowledge regarding hacks/mods/glitches lol!


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    Re: Your opinion on exploits such as Dead angling or Lag abuse?

    Post by Animaaal on Mon Jul 29, 2013 4:31 pm

    Serious_Much wrote:Still lacking the word hack in there Prostration 

    I preferred The untranquil dashing tactic of getting your rocks off though winking

    "The Walk of I Can Hack and Will One Day be Working at Microsoft While I Unknowingly Allow Them to Implant A Chip in my Arm and Find Myself in the Same Predicament as Those People in the Movie Resident Evil When Umbrella Self-contained their Leak by Murdering Their Employees all Because I Thought I was Working on Processors in a Static Free Zone While not Knowing the True Premise of my Employer Which was to Take Over the World all Along"


    Imatool for short?
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    Re: Your opinion on exploits such as Dead angling or Lag abuse?

    Post by Forum Pirate on Mon Jul 29, 2013 4:32 pm

    Its not hard to do, I'm actually surprised its not more common, especially in places like the forest.


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    Re: Your opinion on exploits such as Dead angling or Lag abuse?

    Post by Tolvo on Mon Jul 29, 2013 4:33 pm

    It can sometimes be common in the forest...I mean, when I find out about glitches to test out and find out how to counter I pretty much just go there to use them on gankers to figure things out.  devil
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    Re: Your opinion on exploits such as Dead angling or Lag abuse?

    Post by TheMeInTeam on Mon Jul 29, 2013 4:34 pm

    By this standard, lagswitching has a counter...just power off, problem solved right?



    Lag switches and hacks are not part of the game, and should be considered separately from in-game choices.  These things are in direct violation of a console's terms of service and are bannable to the extent of legally removing online priviledges...hardly the same thing as using an in-game glitch.

    I already pointed out that TWoD could be argued as "more game altering".  You are inaccurately portraying the difference in its advantage against the other glitches with your analogy, however.  In terms of efficacy I see little difference between it and, say, 2 gankers throwing a TWoP on you and then casting Dark Bead from both front and back on spawn...which is perfectly legal and even logical in some respects.  The assertion that it is never acceptable is merely an opinion and nothing more.  Nerfing the viability of entire weapon classes unnecessarily could also be described as "never acceptable", and that wouldn't be any more or less accurate than what you've said.

    Those who choose not to use it do so because playing without it is more fun for them (which is why I don't use it), but that isn't everyone.

    It's an instakill hack, no two ways about it. Everything about that description shows how wrong it is. If you start calling it TWoD it's making it sound slightly legitimate, when it's really not.

    Considering you need no 3rd party software or hardware whatsoever to execute it, it is every single bit as objectively legit as DA and toggle escaping.  Outside of closed duel environments such as the arena, it isn't even necessarily stronger.  Take a 1v1 in the forest, for example.  Between two very experienced players who are willing to do every non-hack possible to win, which out of DA, Toggles, and TWoD would lead to more victories?  How often would an experienced player who sees the stone greatsword being buffed do anything but run from it?  In that case, the other two "acceptable" glitches could easily have a larger impact on who wins than the supposedly "broken" glitch.

    The reality is that all 3 alter the game.  Significantly.

    Also, calling TWoD a hack is factually inaccurate.  You need no hacking to accomplish it, unless the rules have changed since I've seen it executed.
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    Re: Your opinion on exploits such as Dead angling or Lag abuse?

    Post by Serious_Much on Mon Jul 29, 2013 4:36 pm

    Animaaal wrote:
    Serious_Much wrote:Still lacking the word hack in there Prostration 

    I preferred The untranquil dashing tactic of getting your rocks off though winking

    "The Walk of I Can Hack and Will One Day be Working at Microsoft While I Unknowingly Allow Them to Implant A Chip in my Arm and Find Myself in the Same Predicament as Those People in the Movie Resident Evil When Umbrella Self-contained their Leak by Murdering Their Employees all Because I Thought I was Working on Processors in a Static Free Zone While not Knowing the True Premise of my Employer Which was to Take Over the World all Along"


    Imatool for short?

     I'll quickly confess that I didn't read it all and that Imatool is absolutely perfect


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    Re: Your opinion on exploits such as Dead angling or Lag abuse?

    Post by Animaaal on Mon Jul 29, 2013 4:55 pm

    @team

    Whatever dude. rolling eyes 

    Imo, you should drop the psyco-babble and use common sense.

    Imatool is NEVER acceptable, it is fact not opinion....

    ...we can do this all day bro Well What is it 
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    Re: Your opinion on exploits such as Dead angling or Lag abuse?

    Post by Tolvo on Mon Jul 29, 2013 5:01 pm

    I think there should be a distinction.  Whether you can do something, whether people will find it acceptable.  TwoD is something you can do, people won't find it acceptable on average.  Simple as that.  There are instances I will use it against gank squads that are also using glitches so I can kill them, or to stunlock hackers as I knock them off of ledges in the forest.  However in these instances do I find it acceptable?  Not really, I just do it anyway.  You can just not care if something is acceptable or not.  You can choose to do things the community may not find acceptable if you want, just don't expect them to be fine with it.

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    Re: Your opinion on exploits such as Dead angling or Lag abuse?

    Post by Animaaal on Mon Jul 29, 2013 5:08 pm

    Off Topic..sorta....

    Did you know via a Section 32 Disclosure that it is perfectly legal to charge a homeowner 10% of their loan amount when refinancing???

    If they are refinancing a loan amount of 120K, it is legal to charge apprx 12K (minus certain RESPA required fees).....straight face 

    And before anyone says, "Read the fine print"...its impossible for almost everyone.  Some people are not smart enough to understand the documents, and almost EVERYONE does not have time to read them in an hour during the closing.

    *This is an example of when common sense and self-regulation should supersede the available boundries in which an entity can operate.
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    Re: Your opinion on exploits such as Dead angling or Lag abuse?

    Post by Sentiel on Mon Jul 29, 2013 5:12 pm

    Am I the only one in here who wants to see an argument between TheMeInTeam and Forum Pirate?
    Would be like House vs Sheldon Cooper.
    ...not telling which one of the users is associated with which character. silly

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    Re: Your opinion on exploits such as Dead angling or Lag abuse?

    Post by Serious_Much on Mon Jul 29, 2013 5:15 pm

    Pretty sure I'd say team is the sheldon. It's the giant explanations. Forum is much more short silly


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    Re: Your opinion on exploits such as Dead angling or Lag abuse?

    Post by Tolvo on Mon Jul 29, 2013 5:16 pm

    That's what she said!

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    Re: Your opinion on exploits such as Dead angling or Lag abuse?

    Post by Forum Pirate on Mon Jul 29, 2013 5:21 pm

    Were we to argue, would you even be able to tell thats what we were doing? I would think it would just look like a conversation to the uninitiated.


    Also, we'd have to disagree first, and on a point worth arguing.


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    Re: Your opinion on exploits such as Dead angling or Lag abuse?

    Post by Animaaal on Mon Jul 29, 2013 5:26 pm

    What? Popcorn 
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    Re: Your opinion on exploits such as Dead angling or Lag abuse?

    Post by Sentiel on Mon Jul 29, 2013 5:26 pm

    I would have to use a translator and a vocabuary book and still wouldn't understand more than half of what you both would say. But I'd totally copy paste it and use it for my graduation work. Since my own English is on a higher level than my current teachers (crap prep-course, but it's free), I think he would snap and ragequit his job.

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    Re: Your opinion on exploits such as Dead angling or Lag abuse?

    Post by Tolvo on Mon Jul 29, 2013 5:27 pm

    I'd understand it easily and possibly join in.  No one ever seemed really surprised when Forum and I have disagreed(Except the one time I actually got pissed and lost my cool), why would that be any different?  It's just people having a debate.

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    Re: Your opinion on exploits such as Dead angling or Lag abuse?

    Post by Animaaal on Mon Jul 29, 2013 5:36 pm

    I wouldn't care who was right, I'm supporting the guy who's name is associated with "booty". thumbs up 
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    Re: Your opinion on exploits such as Dead angling or Lag abuse?

    Post by TheMeInTeam on Mon Jul 29, 2013 5:37 pm

    Whatever dude.  

    Imo, you should drop the psyco-babble and use common sense.



    Psycho-babble?  Arguing based on sound constructs *is* common sense.  Passing off arguments as psycho-babble is a convenient way to ignore them rather than addressing them.  Your appeal to common sense is a logical fallacy.  I have given good reasons why TWoD is potentially weaker in some circumstances than widely accepted glitches.  Just because such is not consistent with your preferences doesn't mean a logical fallacy is a valid means of refuting those reasons.


    I think there should be a distinction.  Whether you can do something, whether people will find it acceptable.  TwoD is something you can do, people won't find it acceptable on average.  Simple as that.

    False assumption.  There has been presented no objectively gathered evidence from the community as a whole to support this conclusion, and especially not how such support compares to other game-altering glitches or even tactics that require no glitches at all.

    Were we to argue, would you even be able to tell thats what we were doing? I would think it would just look like a conversation to the uninitiated.


    Also, we'd have to disagree first, and on a point worth arguing.


    Indeed.  However it would be enjoyable regardless.  I've been proven wrong or mistaken before (I've also seen debate opponents concede), and the process leading to that has been quite a lot of fun either way.

    But arguing over sheer preference is no fun, so we'd need a good point.


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    Re: Your opinion on exploits such as Dead angling or Lag abuse?

    Post by Tolvo on Mon Jul 29, 2013 5:39 pm

    Oh, so there aren't things people don't find acceptable?  Excuse me for thinking people have opinions of their own Mein.
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    Re: Your opinion on exploits such as Dead angling or Lag abuse?

    Post by Forum Pirate on Mon Jul 29, 2013 5:43 pm

    maybe because its a debate, and most people (even here) don't actually know how to debate and resort to logical fallacys and attacks on character, or ignore the debate entirely and simply post their opinion without any counterpoints to anything said thus far.






    He's saying that you'r emaking an assumption, and that you don't have hard evidence to support it.

    I'd guess it (your assumption)would be true, at least in the short term, but his point remains.


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    Re: Your opinion on exploits such as Dead angling or Lag abuse?

    Post by Tolvo on Mon Jul 29, 2013 5:46 pm

    The majority of people that speak don't find backstabs acceptable, does he think they'd also find a glitch that lets you stunlock people while slowing them and dealing large amounts of damage is acceptable?  There is being technical, and then there is being blind.  

    Alright, I'm officially pissed off now at how ignorant a person can be of common sense alone.  I'm utterly baffled now, I try to defend his view partially and he decides to go overly technical on me when I'm merely trying to say people have different opinions.  I now remember why I try to turn a blind eye to the crap in the PvP section.
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    Re: Your opinion on exploits such as Dead angling or Lag abuse?

    Post by Forum Pirate on Mon Jul 29, 2013 5:49 pm

    he wasn't saying he disagrees.

    he may well agree, or agree under specific conditions, he was just pointing out that your assertion was conjecture.

    he did not actually post his opinion on the matter, nor has he done so (to my knowledge)


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    Re: Your opinion on exploits such as Dead angling or Lag abuse?

    Post by Animaaal on Mon Jul 29, 2013 5:50 pm

    TheMeInTeam wrote:
    Whatever dude.  

    Imo, you should drop the psyco-babble and use common sense.



    ...Psycho-babble?  Arguing based on sound constructs *is* common sense...

    Yes.  If your argument was made of sound constructs (justifying TWoD against a gank squad is a weak argument) then I would agree.

    You also state that hacks are outside of the "constructs" of the game, and are therefore unacceptable.  By this statement, you are saying hacking a cool dragon face for the MoM is more game breaking than TWoD, which is ridiculous.

    Also, trying to essentially demonize people for using the word "hack" instead of "glitch" when making a blanket statement or a joke is trivial.

    Common sense......avoided by society like the plague.....Look Skyward

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