Strange weapons

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    Sentiel
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    Strange weapons

    Post by Sentiel on Tue Jul 02, 2013 11:19 am

    There are many weapons and shields. Even the most useless ones like Cracked Round Shield can find their use. Some are lighter, stronger, or identical, only with different aesthetics, or with slightly different moveset.

    However even among this well balanced repertoire of equipment, there are some that I cannot find any meaning to, nor reason to use them.

    Giant's Halberd
    Never saw anyone use this thing. It weights 16 units, which is 10 more than other weapons of the same class, but has no benefits, that would make it better than others.
    It also does split Lightning damage, which is strange, because Sentinels, nor Royal Sentinels do Lightning damage with it.

    Sniper Crossbow
    Just...why? We can't manually aim it and it takes longer to shoot than other Crossbows. While it does have longer flight path, it's pointless since you have to use lock-on to hit anything.

    Izalith and Beatrice's Catalyst
    As far as i know, both of these have identical scaling to Sorcerer's Catalyst and don't have any special melee attack.

    Demon Great Hammer
    It seems to have only slightly higher AR than Great Club, but weights a ton more. Does it have any other benefits?

    Mail Breaker
    The weakest of all Rapiers. Short too, so using it outside of criticals seems pointless. While it is slightly lighter than Rapier, the damage difference is too big to make the 0,5 difference worth it.

    Knight Shield
    The star of this show.
    It is 2,5 units heavier than Caduceus Iron and Tower shields, yet has less Stability. Other stats are identical. It looks nice, but why is it so heavy and yet has no benefits over other shields?

    What is your take on these? Or do you have some equipment you cannot find a single use for as well?

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    Re: Strange weapons

    Post by AnCapaillMor on Tue Jul 02, 2013 11:48 am

    Knight shield i say the same but for some reason pre sens it's the shield i see the most on xbox.

    Mailbreaker, never used it but it does have a better critical than rapier so i imagine it'd be handy early on. It ws useless in demons too if i remember correctly.

    Agree on the others.

    For me its the Flamberge's, well not the sword itself, it's bleed effect. It's so redundant. Rynn did a playthrough purely based on bleeding people out with it and after 3 days or more she got a grand total of 1 bleed out. Does way too much damage and swings too slow to build up enough or let the person take enough hits to bleed.


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    Re: Strange weapons

    Post by Sentiel on Tue Jul 02, 2013 11:57 am

    I'd take Knight Shield on mercy if there wasn't Andre, selling Caduceus and Tower right behind the corner and the merchant in Burg sells Heater, which weights only 2 units and also has 100% Physical portection.

    The problem with Mail Breaker is that Dagger does roughly the same criticals but actually does more damage in normal combat.

    Flamberge doesn't need Bleed. It's very powerful weapon, capable of insane Poise damage, staggering and can dead angle with most of it's attacks.


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    Re: Strange weapons

    Post by IV_Mark_VI on Tue Jul 02, 2013 12:32 pm

    Why isn't Plank and Cracked shield in there?  Finding a use for those is very difficult.  I've never used them, except as starting equipment.


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    Re: Strange weapons

    Post by TheMeInTeam on Tue Jul 02, 2013 12:38 pm

    Why isn't Plank and Cracked shield in there?  Finding a use for those is very difficult.  I've never used them, except as starting equipment.


    A lot of low level challenge runs block with them on purpose to take enough damage to get into red tearstone ring range.


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    Re: Strange weapons

    Post by Sentiel on Tue Jul 02, 2013 12:53 pm

    TheMeInTeam wrote:
    Why isn't Plank and Cracked shield in there?  Finding a use for those is very difficult.  I've never used them, except as starting equipment.


    A lot of low level challenge runs block with them on purpose to take enough damage to get into red tearstone ring range.
    Exactly. They are good for low SL and glass canon builds to safely reach RTSR effect.

    For example you can use Cracked Round Shield to block magic attack from Four Kings (SL1 on NG+) to get RTSR from full HP.

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    Re: Strange weapons

    Post by WaffleGuy on Tue Jul 02, 2013 2:04 pm

    Sword Hilt. 
    I mean, I use one to mess with new players, but that's about it :razz:


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    Re: Strange weapons

    Post by Sentiel on Tue Jul 02, 2013 2:09 pm

    Sword Hilt is useless, since it does the same damage you do bare handed, but it adds to the story, that you don't start without a weapon. Also, it's priceless to upgrade it in one of the elemental paths and drop it to low SL hosts in Burg and Parish that ask for elemental weapons.

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    Re: Strange weapons

    Post by WaffleGuy on Tue Jul 02, 2013 2:20 pm

    Sentiel wrote:Sword Hilt is useless, since it does the same damage you do bare handed, but it adds to the story, that you don't start without a weapon. Also, it's priceless to upgrade it in one of the elemental paths and drop it to low SL hosts in Burg and Parish that ask for elemental weapons.

     Yeah, ok, mixed those two up. I know we need to start with a really weak weapon. I just don't see the point of sword hilt AND broken ss.
    And I do drop those when players bug me for one :razz:


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    Re: Strange weapons

    Post by sparkly-twinkly-lizard on Tue Jul 02, 2013 4:17 pm

    The dgH has a faster r2 than the great club and a bit more range.

    the sniper crossbow can be aimed with binoculars but thats just a fun mini game, sniping hollows in the burg from firelink...
    the Giants halberd has more reach than any of the "swing attack" halberds, thats about it....
    the mail breakers a parry tool.


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    Re: Strange weapons

    Post by Muker on Tue Jul 02, 2013 4:50 pm

    Wow, I was planning to open a new topic about the same subject, with knight shield being the main star. It's so bad that even knights don't have it as starting equipment big grin
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    Re: Strange weapons

    Post by Latitoast on Tue Jul 02, 2013 5:05 pm

    I like Demon's Great Hammer though...


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    Re: Strange weapons

    Post by Soris Ice Goldwing on Tue Jul 02, 2013 7:41 pm

    Lati I have to agree with the Demon Great Hammer. I never see anyone with it and even less who put the hornet ring for a 1 kill bs. That and the mace and bandit knife though I guess some put people don't know the parry and bs increase the bandit has.


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    Re: Strange weapons

    Post by Latitoast on Tue Jul 02, 2013 9:06 pm

    That's because everyone sits around making Katana builds and Greatsword builds.

    Or they're trying to be "funny" and make Giantdad builds.

    Or they're spamming R1 on a buffed Falchion or a Gold Tracer.

    You don't see Demon's Great Hammer because you don't see Great Hammers at all!

    Same with the Mace, nobody uses hammers, so you can't see maces.

    People always go for Dex builds over strength builds because they see how slow strength weapons are and never bother with learning how to build around that slowness to make it useful.


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    Re: Strange weapons

    Post by Sentiel on Tue Jul 02, 2013 11:02 pm

    In another topic, I'm talking about how I was rolling a medium Str build with Greataxe and Mace.
    Since I'm usually a Dex guy I didn't have any Str weapons, so I bought a Greataxe and used that. As for Mace, the thing wrecks low Poise builds, because it can infinite stunlock and thanks to it being a hammer, it gets through shields in few hits.

    The problem with Str weapons lies in how easy backstabs are done in this game.

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    Re: Strange weapons

    Post by Latitoast on Tue Jul 02, 2013 11:22 pm

    Kids, there's nothing more irritating then being backstabbed but if anyone backstabs you with a hornet ring or rapier that makes you feel uncomfortable, that's no good!

    It's not hard to prevent backstabs with a strength weapon.


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    Re: Strange weapons

    Post by Carphil on Tue Jul 02, 2013 11:26 pm

    good list


    In defense of the 3 last itens, I've used them for some time, mostly for the looks


    The crystal knight shield you find in the archives might be heavy, but it helps when you don't have a good shield around


    mail breaker is a cool weapon to use in the off hand, straight sword-dagger style!


    demos hammer also used for looks, but it didn't last long.


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    Re: Strange weapons

    Post by Latitoast on Tue Jul 02, 2013 11:27 pm

    I don't understand the hate for Demon's Great Hammer.

    I love it.


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    Re: Strange weapons

    Post by Sentiel on Tue Jul 02, 2013 11:39 pm

    Never saw anyone except Emergence wield it. Plus, the problem I have with it is that it's way too heavy for the few extra AR it offers when compared to other similar weapons.

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    Re: Strange weapons

    Post by Latitoast on Tue Jul 02, 2013 11:48 pm

    I never see anyone besides myself even use a Great Hammer.

    The Great Club is nice, but so is Demon's Great Hammer.


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    Re: Strange weapons

    Post by Hugh_G_Johnson on Thu Jul 04, 2013 12:33 pm

    Sentiel wrote:The problem with Str weapons lies in how easy backstabs are done in this game.

    Indeed.  I like to make tank-type characters and I'd love to use strength weapons.  However, if I don't want to get rekt in pvp I have to use the man-serpent greatsword.  There isn't anything wrong with that, but it feels like I'm just using a heavy claymore with a worse moveset.  And, it doesn't give you that caveman satisfaction of crushing stuff that the other strength weapons do.  I made a strength character a long time ago, that I haven't been on in months.  I'm probably going to delete it and do something else.  I tried to make a strength/faith hybrid yesterday, but twice I switched characters just to get revenge on people I should have beat easily, but couldn't on a strength build.  FYI -- I was undefeated in grudge matches and I beat one guy 3 or 4 times.

    Latitoast wrote:It's not hard to prevent backstabs with a strength weapon.

    It can be rather difficult to prevent back-stabs on PS3 outright.  From what I understand not only is PS3 notorious for having more lag, but Xbox is region-locked; meaning you don't have to fight people on the other side of the world.  On PS3 it's not unheard of to get BSed by people (usually from Japan) well in front of you who are outside kick range or even greatsword range.  But, if you are able to prevent yourself from getting BSed without strictly using criticals; I'd very much be interested in your techniques anyway.  I would like to be able to do more than 3 invasions on a strength build before I get fed up and switch builds. :razz:

    --------

    As far as the specific subject matter, I'd like to make an odd submission for consideration: the falchion!  The scimitar has the same moveset and if it doesn't have the same range, the difference is extremely subtle.  The scimitar weighs a full unit less and the biggest difference in AR you can possibly get between the falchion and scimitar is 11.  Using the 40 soft cap for dex the AR difference is 10 (sometimes 9 at odd strength levels).  So why do I want a weapon that weights a full unit more for a mere 10 extra AR -- especially when I'm going to put an OP buff on it anyway?

    PS -- I just started watching Brandon505's twitch, please don't tell him I said that.  I enjoy his stream and I don't want to get banned. nail biting 


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    Re: Strange weapons

    Post by Dibsville on Thu Jul 04, 2013 12:37 pm

    Demon's Great Hammer has a different moveset, and actually is my favourite great hammer (Actually, Dragon Tooth is my favourite, but DGH has the same moveset but does more damage. I only like DT more for looks). DGH makes up for itself for its amazing moveset.

    Mail Breaker has its uses. I find it to be a superb weapon. But that's just me.


    I can't really explain any of the others, but those two should be taken off the list.


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    Re: Strange weapons

    Post by ResIsBestStat on Thu Jul 04, 2013 12:44 pm

    http://mmdks.com/30bn
    da ultimate strange wep build
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    Re: Strange weapons

    Post by Dibsville on Thu Jul 04, 2013 12:45 pm

    ResIsBestStat wrote:http://mmdks.com/30bn
    da ultimate strange wep build
    Fixed.


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    Re: Strange weapons

    Post by xenon_nobelium on Thu Jul 04, 2013 12:57 pm

    giants halberd is good for a black knight build, shares the stat req./weight with bk halberd and ultra sword so you can menu swap easily...maybe good against hardcore turles...bk halberd is surperior in every way (except chip dmg) though.


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