is there a reason why the hydra is protected by ice golems and havel?

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    is there a reason why the hydra is protected by ice golems and havel?

    Post by Havel_The_Rock on Wed May 22, 2013 7:36 pm

    i was just running around lost izalith and tomb of the giants when i suddenly remembered killing the hydra (dog skeletons trigger weird memories) and was wondering why there were ice golems seemingly protecting the hydra? seeing as i play the game in full havels im surprised it took e so long to question why havel (or one of his followers depending on which path you believe) is at the bottom of the tower, seemingly guarding the forest. it may not be that he is guarding it but was wondering what the community has to say about these sunjects?

    all replies will be greatly appreciated as i am transfixed by the lore in dark souls and the way in which everything has a meaning. it fascinated me since the moment i talked to my first npc, i wanted to get to know the backstory and reasoning behind all characters and what it is that they are searching for. anyway thanks for reading this and thank you for your time.
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    Re: is there a reason why the hydra is protected by ice golems and havel?

    Post by Dibsville on Wed May 22, 2013 7:39 pm

    My thoughts:
    Havel was initially banished the the bottom of Darkroot Basin by Gwyn when he thought to rebel. He has no connection to the Hydra. The Crystal Golems just in front of the Hydra are drawn to the magical source that is a tear in time. (you know, the DLC area). The Hydra has always been there as it can never leave.


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    Re: is there a reason why the hydra is protected by ice golems and havel?

    Post by Latitoast on Wed May 22, 2013 7:52 pm

    The Hydra drops the Dusk Crown Ring, personally given to Dusk upon her birth.

    Why does it drop the ring?

    The Golems are in place to defend the Crystal Golem, who has Dusk captive.

    My interpretation is that Seath captured Dusk, and left her there to be guarded by Crystal Golems and the Hydra.

    Havel was just placed there after he plotted a revolt against Gwyn.


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    Re: is there a reason why the hydra is protected by ice golems and havel?

    Post by Havel_The_Rock on Wed May 22, 2013 7:58 pm

    Latitoast wrote:The Hydra drops the Dusk Crown Ring, personally given to Dusk upon her birth.

    Why does it drop the ring?

    The Golems are in place to defend the Crystal Golem, who has Dusk captive.

    My interpretation is that Seath captured Dusk, and left her there to be guarded by Crystal Golems and the Hydra.

    Havel was just placed there after he plotted a revolt against Gwyn.

    always grateful on these takes, never even thought about dusk! great theory but what if havel in the tower isnt actually havel and merely a disciple and thats why you only recieve the ring?

    food for thought, ut thank you still for expanding my horizons
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    Re: is there a reason why the hydra is protected by ice golems and havel?

    Post by Havel_The_Rock on Wed May 22, 2013 8:02 pm

    Dibsville wrote:
    My thoughts:
    Havel was initially banished the the bottom of Darkroot Basin by Gwyn when he thought to rebel. He has no connection to the Hydra. The Crystal Golems just in front of the Hydra are drawn to the magical source that is a tear in time. (you know, the DLC area). The Hydra has always been there as it can never leave.


    i enjoyed this take on the events but for some reason it almost feels as if theres more to it than his hatred of magic, especially when there is a tear in time, this might have drawn havel to it but was prevented by the hydra and the ice golems remind him of seath? so he decides istead that he will leave a disciple to prevent anyone else from being able to kill the hydra but havel is no longer able to kill it as he is defeated in his quest to kill seath?

    thanks for the response though, new takes on everything are always very grateful and its nice to see the community welcome such a new person so openly.

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    Re: is there a reason why the hydra is protected by ice golems and havel?

    Post by Dibsville on Wed May 22, 2013 8:03 pm

    A new person is just another person to have fun with. happy
    Welcome to the Forums, by the way.


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    Re: is there a reason why the hydra is protected by ice golems and havel?

    Post by Latitoast on Wed May 22, 2013 8:04 pm

    The Havel in the tower carries the Dragon Tooth and Havel's Greatshield, both are legendary treasure of Havel the Rock, only he carries them.


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    Re: is there a reason why the hydra is protected by ice golems and havel?

    Post by Havel_The_Rock on Wed May 22, 2013 8:17 pm

    Latitoast wrote:The Havel in the tower carries the Dragon Tooth and Havel's Greatshield, both are legendary treasure of Havel the Rock, only he carries them.

    i was thinking that too but then the acual charachter model is a woman and the character model for havel is a man. there are just so many complexities and slight anomalies in both of what we are saying that i fell as if weare both right but at the same time wrong. perhaps it has something to do with the flow of time but unlikely considering that that was just created to form a multiplayer for them game but everything could have a mild significance


    amazing how such a small part of such a huge game can have so many questions asked about it and have so much lore, even if it isnt much in the grand scheme of things its still alot when you just have to think about it.
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    Re: is there a reason why the hydra is protected by ice golems and havel?

    Post by Havel_The_Rock on Wed May 22, 2013 8:19 pm

    Dibsville wrote:A new person is just another person to have fun with. happy
    Welcome to the Forums, by the way.
    and to that i thank you sincerely

    shame we arent on the same platform otherwise i would have liked to perhaps play ds with a member of the community. alas cross platforming has not reached us yet but hopefully in the near future
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    Re: is there a reason why the hydra is protected by ice golems and havel?

    Post by Latitoast on Wed May 22, 2013 8:28 pm

    Havel_The_Rock wrote:
    Latitoast wrote:The Havel in the tower carries the Dragon Tooth and Havel's Greatshield, both are legendary treasure of Havel the Rock, only he carries them.

    i was thinking that too but then the acual charachter model is a woman and the character model for havel is a man. there are just so many complexities and slight anomalies in both of what we are saying that i fell as if weare both right but at the same time wrong. perhaps it has something to do with the flow of time but unlikely considering that that was just created to form a multiplayer for them game but everything could have a mild significance


    amazing how such a small part of such a huge game can have so many questions asked about it and have so much lore, even if it isnt much in the grand scheme of things its still alot when you just have to think about it.
    If the weapons aren't enough, the key description says the person in the tower is a great hero.

    Havel is the great hero, his warriors wouldn't be important enough in the medieval society system that Dark Souls is based off of to be the real Havel.

    The Occult Club in Havel's stash is also another hint as to why that is the real Havel.

    Gwyn found out of his plot and locked Havel away to protect himself.

    Why did Havel revolt? Because Gwyn made Seath, a magical being his Duke. Havel hates magic.

    Gwyn had a blacksmith produce a key to the tower to keep him locked away, and he kept the key. Seath had one of his Moonlight Butterflies guard the tower the Blacksmith lived in. Due to Seath's madness, he had the Butterfly kill the Blacksmith.

    The Moonlight Butterfly now guards the tower to prevent Havel from being saved, because Seath fears Havel will kill him.(Not hard to do, Havel has a magic resistant shield, his weapon grants magic defense, his armor is very protective, and his weapon can deal some damage.)


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    Re: is there a reason why the hydra is protected by ice golems and havel?

    Post by Encore on Wed May 22, 2013 8:31 pm

    Welcome to the forums, my fellow feline.


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    Re: is there a reason why the hydra is protected by ice golems and havel?

    Post by Havel_The_Rock on Wed May 22, 2013 8:35 pm

    Latitoast wrote:
    Havel_The_Rock wrote:
    Latitoast wrote:The Havel in the tower carries the Dragon Tooth and Havel's Greatshield, both are legendary treasure of Havel the Rock, only he carries them.

    i was thinking that too but then the acual charachter model is a woman and the character model for havel is a man. there are just so many complexities and slight anomalies in both of what we are saying that i fell as if weare both right but at the same time wrong. perhaps it has something to do with the flow of time but unlikely considering that that was just created to form a multiplayer for them game but everything could have a mild significance


    amazing how such a small part of such a huge game can have so many questions asked about it and have so much lore, even if it isnt much in the grand scheme of things its still alot when you just have to think about it.
    If the weapons aren't enough, the key description says the person in the tower is a great hero.

    Havel is the great hero, his warriors wouldn't be important enough in the medieval society system that Dark Souls is based off of to be the real Havel.

    The Occult Club in Havel's stash is also another hint as to why that is the real Havel.

    Gwyn found out of his plot and locked Havel away to protect himself.

    Why did Havel revolt? Because Gwyn made Seath, a magical being his Duke. Havel hates magic.

    Gwyn had a blacksmith produce a key to the tower to keep him locked away, and he kept the key. Seath had one of his Moonlight Butterflies guard the tower the Blacksmith lived in. Due to Seath's madness, he had the Butterfly kill the Blacksmith.

    The Moonlight Butterfly now guards the tower to prevent Havel from being saved, because Seath fears Havel will kill him.(Not hard to do, Havel has a magic resistant shield, his weapon grants magic defense, his armor is very protective, and his weapon can deal some damage.)


    thank you very much for completely clearing everything up, very grateful for it and i can now sleep in peace knowing that that person is havel and the entire reason as to why he is there, as you can probably tell i ratehr like havel.

    quick question though, didnt havel also give rings to his disciples? i know that the one in the tower is havel but was just wondering if there are others out there who may have been his disciples? perhaps they travelled all over Lordran and we might meet a disciple in ds2?
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    Re: is there a reason why the hydra is protected by ice golems and havel?

    Post by Encore on Wed May 22, 2013 8:36 pm

    I am thinking that The idea that crystal golems are drawn towards magical places sound more reasonable, because I can not understand the motivation to keep Miss Dusk kept there in Darkroot Basin, as Seath would need her for experiments. As for the Dusk ring, I suspect that it is because it got stuck to the hydra as it set home in the water there.


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    Re: is there a reason why the hydra is protected by ice golems and havel?

    Post by Latitoast on Wed May 22, 2013 8:43 pm

    Havel_The_Rock wrote:
    Latitoast wrote:
    Havel_The_Rock wrote:
    Latitoast wrote:The Havel in the tower carries the Dragon Tooth and Havel's Greatshield, both are legendary treasure of Havel the Rock, only he carries them.

    i was thinking that too but then the acual charachter model is a woman and the character model for havel is a man. there are just so many complexities and slight anomalies in both of what we are saying that i fell as if weare both right but at the same time wrong. perhaps it has something to do with the flow of time but unlikely considering that that was just created to form a multiplayer for them game but everything could have a mild significance


    amazing how such a small part of such a huge game can have so many questions asked about it and have so much lore, even if it isnt much in the grand scheme of things its still alot when you just have to think about it.
    If the weapons aren't enough, the key description says the person in the tower is a great hero.

    Havel is the great hero, his warriors wouldn't be important enough in the medieval society system that Dark Souls is based off of to be the real Havel.

    The Occult Club in Havel's stash is also another hint as to why that is the real Havel.

    Gwyn found out of his plot and locked Havel away to protect himself.

    Why did Havel revolt? Because Gwyn made Seath, a magical being his Duke. Havel hates magic.

    Gwyn had a blacksmith produce a key to the tower to keep him locked away, and he kept the key. Seath had one of his Moonlight Butterflies guard the tower the Blacksmith lived in. Due to Seath's madness, he had the Butterfly kill the Blacksmith.

    The Moonlight Butterfly now guards the tower to prevent Havel from being saved, because Seath fears Havel will kill him.(Not hard to do, Havel has a magic resistant shield, his weapon grants magic defense, his armor is very protective, and his weapon can deal some damage.)


    thank you very much for completely clearing everything up, very grateful for it and i can now sleep in peace knowing that that person is havel and the entire reason as to why he is there, as you can probably tell i ratehr like havel.

    quick question though, didnt havel also give rings to his disciples? i know that the one in the tower is havel but was just wondering if there are others out there who may have been his disciples? perhaps they travelled all over Lordran and we might meet a disciple in ds2?
    He did give his rings to his warriors, it was used to boost moral under Havel himself. He just had one of his own as well.


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    Re: is there a reason why the hydra is protected by ice golems and havel?

    Post by Latitoast on Wed May 22, 2013 8:44 pm

    Tehdoomgrasp wrote:I am thinking that The idea that crystal golems are drawn towards magical places sound more reasonable, because I can not understand the motivation to keep Miss Dusk kept there in Darkroot Basin, as Seath would need her for experiments. As for the Dusk ring, I suspect that it is because it got stuck to the hydra as it set home in the water there.
    Seath is insane.

    There's not much of a reason needed for him to keep Dusk captured there.


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    Re: is there a reason why the hydra is protected by ice golems and havel?

    Post by Elifia on Wed May 22, 2013 8:52 pm

    Dusk was the princess of Oolacile, one of the few places that develops magic. Seath's Dragon School in Vinheim being another. Seath obviously didn't like Oolacile. I'm not sure if the destruction of Oolacile was purely because of the Abyss, Seath might have had a hand in it too. But either way, Dusk was trapped inside a Golem in the ruins of Oolacile.


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    Re: is there a reason why the hydra is protected by ice golems and havel?

    Post by Havel_The_Rock on Wed May 22, 2013 8:56 pm

    Elifia wrote:Dusk was the princess of Oolacile, one of the few places that develops magic. Seath's Dragon School in Vinheim being another. Seath obviously didn't like Oolacile. I'm not sure if the destruction of Oolacile was purely because of the Abyss, Seath might have had a hand in it too. But either way, Dusk was trapped inside a Golem in the ruins of Oolacile.

    ahhhh yes i see now, that would definitely give the golems a true purpose to being there. i've learnt so much in such a short space of time i couldn't possibly hope to glean so much information putely by surfing the web
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    Re: is there a reason why the hydra is protected by ice golems and havel?

    Post by Dibsville on Wed May 22, 2013 11:05 pm

    Havel_The_Rock wrote:
    Dibsville wrote:A new person is just another person to have fun with. happy
    Welcome to the Forums, by the way.
    and to that i thank you sincerely

    shame we arent on the same platform otherwise i would have liked to perhaps play ds with a member of the community. alas cross platforming has not reached us yet but hopefully in the near future
    Apologies that I didn't say this sooner, but I'm just tired today. I was going to go extremely in-depth, but I just couldn't muster up the strength to do so.
    I may do it tomorrow.


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