whats wrong with using Twop to land sorceries?

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    evandmcgrath95

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    whats wrong with using Twop to land sorceries?

    Post by evandmcgrath95 on Thu May 16, 2013 3:54 pm

    To me its frustrating to have invested so much into sorcery and just miss again and again. Its so rare to actually land that soul spear and usually its just luck, like he was in the middle of eating moss/grass.
    I guess it is strong but what else am I supposed to do?
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    Re: whats wrong with using Twop to land sorceries?

    Post by billy_bayonet on Thu May 16, 2013 3:57 pm

    use heavy great soul arrow a few times so they think its that then use soul spear, they will be used to dodging the heavy soul arrow which has a different timing, big grin


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    Re: whats wrong with using Twop to land sorceries?

    Post by Tolvo on Thu May 16, 2013 3:57 pm

    Where are you fighting people? Depending on the area you can use certain things to your advantage, like hallways. In duels, yes landing Soul Spears can be pretty difficult though if you want to learn how, you can unlock and predict where an opponent will dodge to. It's a bit of a luck game but if you hit it will usually be a counter hit and you will hit them really hard.
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    Re: whats wrong with using Twop to land sorceries?

    Post by LunarFog on Thu May 16, 2013 4:01 pm

    Um...How about you try not to spam mindlessly?

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    Re: whats wrong with using Twop to land sorceries?

    Post by Forum Pirate on Thu May 16, 2013 4:09 pm

    I run gmb, so I don't care, but for people who don't/ when I'm not running faith, it makes it damn near impossible to dodge.

    Its superficially the same as a combo, but one cannot dodge twop, it requires one flee, which isn't always possible, thus it creates a borderline unwinable situation for the person being twopped right from the get go.


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    Re: whats wrong with using Twop to land sorceries?

    Post by TheMeInTeam on Thu May 16, 2013 4:24 pm

    Forum Pirate wrote:I run gmb, so I don't care, but for people who don't/ when I'm not running faith, it makes it damn near impossible to dodge.

    Its superficially the same as a combo, but one cannot dodge twop, it requires one flee, which isn't always possible, thus it creates a borderline unwinable situation for the person being twopped right from the get go.

    Great magic shield makes spells a joke also for its duration.

    Only pure pyro and non-casting builds really suffer from the tactic, but unless it's being used for spawn destruction it isn't particularly hard to avoid getting caught in it.

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    Re: whats wrong with using Twop to land sorceries?

    Post by evandmcgrath95 on Thu May 16, 2013 4:37 pm

    LunarFog wrote:Um...How about you try not to spam mindlessly?
    I dont spam mindlessly but I'm not a master sniper either. I dont see how you assuming I spam mindlessly has any value to this thread.

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    Re: whats wrong with using Twop to land sorceries?

    Post by evandmcgrath95 on Thu May 16, 2013 4:39 pm

    billy_bayonet wrote:use heavy great soul arrow a few times so they think its that then use soul spear, they will be used to dodging the heavy soul arrow which has a different timing, big grin
    Thats not a bad idea at all. Pretty creative.
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    Re: whats wrong with using Twop to land sorceries?

    Post by skarekrow13 on Thu May 16, 2013 4:39 pm

    I don't see anything wrong with TWoP to land sorcery. It's kind of the spell's purpose.


    Also, if you try it on me, be prepared for a WoG spam twisted

    I honestly am fine with the tactic though. I just really will WoG you to the moon if I can.

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    Re: whats wrong with using Twop to land sorceries?

    Post by Forum Pirate on Thu May 16, 2013 4:46 pm

    Won't do anything to do dark magic.


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    Re: whats wrong with using Twop to land sorceries?

    Post by Forum Pirate on Thu May 16, 2013 4:49 pm

    TheMeInTeam wrote:
    Forum Pirate wrote:I run gmb, so I don't care, but for people who don't/ when I'm not running faith, it makes it damn near impossible to dodge.

    Its superficially the same as a combo, but one cannot dodge twop, it requires one flee, which isn't always possible, thus it creates a borderline unwinable situation for the person being twopped right from the get go.

    Great magic shield makes spells a joke also for its duration.

    Only pure pyro and non-casting builds really suffer from the tactic, but unless it's being used for spawn destruction it isn't particularly hard to avoid getting caught in it.
    only for straight up blows. Pursuers, for example, dead angles.


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    Re: whats wrong with using Twop to land sorceries?

    Post by Soris Ice Goldwing on Thu May 16, 2013 4:58 pm

    evandmcgrath95 wrote:
    LunarFog wrote:Um...How about you try not to spam mindlessly?
    I dont spam mindlessly but I'm not a master sniper either. I dont see how you assuming I spam mindlessly has any value to this thread.

    Typically some players have a lot of att slots and fill them with magic and just spam them in hope that the spell hit. I really don't it but it makes some sense in 2v1 cases. From what I have seen being creative with magic and the soul arrows help. Though I have nothing against using twop to help and it doesn't last long.


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    Re: whats wrong with using Twop to land sorceries?

    Post by Dibsville on Thu May 16, 2013 5:27 pm

    billy_bayonet wrote:use heavy great soul arrow a few times so they think its that then use soul spear, they will be used to dodging the heavy soul arrow which has a different timing, big grin
    Better yet, use normal Heavy Soul Arrow because it has a similar colour as Soul Spear.


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    Re: whats wrong with using Twop to land sorceries?

    Post by lordgodofhell on Thu May 16, 2013 5:53 pm

    Step 1. Catalyst in right hand
    Step 2. Dexterity to 45
    Step 3. Parry your opponent
    Step 4. Cast Crystal Soul Spear
    Step 5. Send them a proper GG message


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    Re: whats wrong with using Twop to land sorceries?

    Post by sparkly-twinkly-lizard on Thu May 16, 2013 6:43 pm

    the reason twop and magic as a combo are disliked... well you wouldn't like it if you were chained to a rock while someone fired a cannon at you from 5 feet away...

    sorcery is all about landing one or two big hits, think of it a a ranged str build, both focus on landing a small number of powerful hits, however the mage doesn't usually have the advantage of heavy armor or high hp and so you must rely on trickery and evasion, also dark orb (if you can bear the slowish cast time) has a larger hit box than most projectile spells, this could help you out, getting a few hits in...


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    Re: whats wrong with using Twop to land sorceries?

    Post by GenericUsername on Thu May 16, 2013 6:47 pm

    because the only people that use TWoP and magic are the same people that just spam dark bead right after they get them with TWoP.

    But if they keep dodging your magic I think you're not going about something right. If you just whip out the catalyst in the middle of the fight, your opponent is already going to see any attacks coming.

    As others have already said, you may wanna try just mixing combos of magic and melee, just throw it out there randomly and try and catch them off guard.
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    Re: whats wrong with using Twop to land sorceries?

    Post by reim0027 on Thu May 16, 2013 11:01 pm

    Also, unlock and manually aim. Sure it is harder, but that is part of the skill needed to effectively be a mage.

    And, TWoD, + CSS, DB, or dead angle WoG is about the cheapest thing you can do in PvP. If you use it, be prepared for a lot of hatemail. Personally, if you used it as your attack against me (away from the forest), I would put my controller down, let you win, and block you ASAP (so we don't invade each other again).


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    Re: whats wrong with using Twop to land sorceries?

    Post by TheMeInTeam on Fri May 17, 2013 3:11 am

    reim0027 wrote:Also, unlock and manually aim. Sure it is harder, but that is part of the skill needed to effectively be a mage.

    And, TWoD, + CSS, DB, or dead angle WoG is about the cheapest thing you can do in PvP. If you use it, be prepared for a lot of hatemail. Personally, if you used it as your attack against me (away from the forest), I would put my controller down, let you win, and block you ASAP (so we don't invade each other again).

    I wouldn't mind it outside of pre-arranged duels. It wouldn't frustrate me any more than lag-stabs or spawning into gankers. If that's someone's skill ceiling, that's where they play. It's not fun to me, but some people enjoy using the most powerful combinations possible. For it to work, they DO have to manage to get a TWOP off, actually have it hit the opponent, and then not get spells blocked by havel's, great magic shield, or whatever...and they also have to avoid eating a great fireball or someone else's CSS while casting TWOP. It's a cheap tactic but if you don't land TWOP...well...the outlook darkens because you've been relying on that.

    While gankers annoy me to some degree, the only thing I will block people for (and report them for tampering) are cheaters.
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    Re: whats wrong with using Twop to land sorceries?

    Post by Werdax on Fri May 17, 2013 3:38 am

    I don't mind TWOP that much. The only time I have lost a fight against this tactic, was the very first time I ever saw it. Ever since then, every time I see a TWOP being activated, I immediately check my environments, scouting for a good evasion route. Then I quickly turn my attention to my opponent, memorize the environment, and avoid close combat until I know its safe to approach them again.

    The way I see it: Only a handful of sorcery users put effort into their tactics. Time and again, they just spam with dark bead, crystal soul arrows and pursuers.
    Every now and then, there are SOME who use their sorcery differently, using it as distractions rather then an attempt to land a hit.
    I can't really give you any tips since I hate sorcery, and never have I used it in game before (with the exception of GMS).
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    Re: whats wrong with using Twop to land sorceries?

    Post by crbngville2 on Fri May 17, 2013 7:53 am

    To the Op:
    There is nothing wrong with it. Use whatever spells/tactics/strategies/builds make you happy.


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    Re: whats wrong with using Twop to land sorceries?

    Post by Glutebrah on Fri May 17, 2013 9:45 am

    billy_bayonet wrote:use heavy great soul arrow a few times so they think its that then use soul spear, they will be used to dodging the heavy soul arrow which has a different timing, big grin

    lol so this is why i run into some players that spam a weaker spell 2-3x then a CSS?? i always thought they were just retarded.. never once was i "tricked" lol

    any ways what i do on my Caster is open with Pursuers, then once they activate see the way the player is rolling line my self up and start casting CSS

    works pretty good

    reim0027 wrote:Also, unlock and manually aim. Sure it is harder, but that is part of the skill needed to effectively be a mage.

    And, TWoD, + CSS, DB, or dead angle WoG is about the cheapest thing you can do in PvP. If you use it, be prepared for a lot of hatemail. Personally, if you used it as your attack against me (away from the forest), I would put my controller down, let you win, and block you ASAP (so we don't invade each other again).

    manually aiming CSS is hard i always end up shooting the ground 2 feet in front of me. manually aiming Crystal Dragon breathe is fun.

    And Dead angle WoG is awesome for the people with Great shields who refuse to attack/do anything besides BS fish


    crbngville2 wrote:To the Op:
    There is nothing wrong with it. Use whatever spells/tactics/strategies/builds make you happy.

    i dont see how trapping some one in TWOP then 1-2 casts of CSS match is over would be fun or make any one happy. sounds boring, takes as much skill as pressing start at the menu and loading your character.


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    Re: whats wrong with using Twop to land sorceries?

    Post by Animaaal on Fri May 17, 2013 11:13 am

    crbngville2 wrote:To the Op:
    There is nothing wrong with it. Use whatever spells/tactics/strategies/builds make you happy.

    TWoD and Pursuers to CSS is/are tactics that are cheap.

    Horrible advice imo.
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    Re: whats wrong with using Twop to land sorceries?

    Post by crbngville2 on Fri May 17, 2013 11:54 am

    I am really at the point of not caring/judging how someone else plays THEIR game. Who are we to tell anyone what to do or how to play THEIR game. From included rules with the copy of software they sold you. If what someone wants to do in THEIR game doesn't violate those rules, who are we to tell them differently? Everyone has a different view of what's considered cheap, and chances are that noone is correct.


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    Re: whats wrong with using Twop to land sorceries?

    Post by Glutebrah on Fri May 17, 2013 12:03 pm

    crbngville2 wrote:I am really at the point of not caring/judging how someone else plays THEIR game. Who are we to tell anyone what to do or how to play THEIR game. From included rules with the copy of software they sold you. If what someone wants to do in THEIR game doesn't violate those rules, who are we to tell them differently? Everyone has a different view of what's considered cheap, and chances are that noone is correct.

    Cheap and cheating are not the same thing.


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    Re: whats wrong with using Twop to land sorceries?

    Post by Rumeye on Fri May 17, 2013 12:11 pm

    The lowest thing you can do in this game is resorting to TWOP, its not as overpowered as it used to be but still casting it the most cowardly act you could commit. I can only slightly tolerate it if its being used against a gank squad and if your strategy absolutely depends on it.

    As for finding it hard to hit people with your magic, i always cast CHSM unlocked and the hit ratio is better than when casting it locked. CSS as the guys said can be casted unlocked but there’s also a good way to get better chances of it hitting people, cast the spell unlocked and then at the last moment before it fires lock on your opponent, but that’s not everything you have to observe your opponent’s movements and act accordingly, don’t get frustrated so fast, if you like magic builds then you should spend more time on them, you’ll get better along the way and you’ll discover the techniques all by yourself, Crystal magic is a bit hard to master as it actually needs skill to be effectively used in battle so just be patient : )

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