WTH is the point of a quality build..

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    xenon_nobelium
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    Re: WTH is the point of a quality build..

    Post by xenon_nobelium on Thu May 16, 2013 9:54 am

    http://mmdks.com/1pes coincidently this is the build i'm working on atm^^ not decided if i go havels for 76poise or fap for 61poise...extra stamina and hp from fap maybe overkill^^
    OT: if you have a pure dex and a pure str build already there is no motivation to make a quality guy (for me at least, thats why i converted my quality guy to a black knight weapon build(36/18) mid-leveling, already have a quality pyro). the only "real" quality weapons are murakamo, claymore, (garg)halberd, lucerne, and some straightswords. all weapon categorys are covered by pure dex(16/40) or pure str(40/10) with either better or as good as weapons except heavy curvedswords...
    don't get me wrong, quality is a really good build, the selection of "true" quality weapons is just not the appealing compared to the str and dex selection. of course they are usable with a 40/40 but you'll always have massive wasted stats, especially on a lvl100 cap.


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    Re: WTH is the point of a quality build..

    Post by lordgodofhell on Thu May 16, 2013 4:25 pm

    Hooray for Moonlight Greatsword builds with 8 attunement!!! cheers


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    Re: WTH is the point of a quality build..

    Post by Elifia on Thu May 16, 2013 4:36 pm

    xenon_nobelium wrote:http://mmdks.com/1pes coincidently this is the build i'm working on atm^^ not decided if i go havels for 76poise or fap for 61poise...extra stamina and hp from fap maybe overkill^^
    OT: if you have a pure dex and a pure str build already there is no motivation to make a quality guy (for me at least, thats why i converted my quality guy to a black knight weapon build(36/18) mid-leveling, already have a quality pyro). the only "real" quality weapons are murakamo, claymore, (garg)halberd, lucerne, and some straightswords. all weapon categorys are covered by pure dex(16/40) or pure str(40/10) with either better or as good as weapons except heavy curvedswords...
    don't get me wrong, quality is a really good build, the selection of "true" quality weapons is just not the appealing compared to the str and dex selection. of course they are usable with a 40/40 but you'll always have massive wasted stats, especially on a lvl100 cap.

    Aren't Quality weapons both faster and more damaging than their pure counterparts though? I know that the Zwei and Greatsword are faster than the other UGSs, and the Claymore/Bastard Sword/Great Lord Greatsword are faster than the MSGS (and Stone Greatsword, but that weapon sucks anyway).


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    Re: WTH is the point of a quality build..

    Post by Seignar on Thu May 16, 2013 5:40 pm

    You forgot to mention they also tend to have better movesets and are lighter.

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    Re: WTH is the point of a quality build..

    Post by RANT on Thu May 16, 2013 5:53 pm

    what seig said, most of them are lighter and have a way better move set.


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    Re: WTH is the point of a quality build..

    Post by spillz907 on Thu May 16, 2013 6:20 pm

    40/40 is overkill but good for starting out to figure out what weapons you like. Most likely a 27 or 28/40 build is a better choice. (28 for 1-handing the murakumo). But really, it just gives you the freedom to pretty much equip any weapon and have full scaling with it (at the very likely cost of wasted stat points in strength).
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    Re: WTH is the point of a quality build..

    Post by Carphil on Thu May 16, 2013 6:33 pm

    Glutebrah wrote:i just came to a realization.. what is the point of a 27/40 build??

    Straight swords:
    Balder Side Sword (Dex weapon) - 390 1handed, 399 2handed
    Sunlight straight sword (C/C)- 381 damage, 418 2handed (slower)



    SSS much cooler IMO

    Point proven. lol!


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    Re: WTH is the point of a quality build..

    Post by xenon_nobelium on Thu May 16, 2013 7:32 pm

    i found the differences in swing speed inside a weapon class really insignificant, also it seems to me that it has more to do with weight/poise dmg if a weapon swings slower. on a side note: if the zweihänder is a quality weapon, so is the estoc...i think that would not be entirely correct. also the lighter weight is (in theory) an invalid argument as you have a huge amount of levels you saved in either str or dex you can put into end (that in reality end up used in vit). to be clear i am in no way argumenting against quality builds, just playing OPs advocat if you will. quality weapons "win" quite a few weapon categorys, it's just that there a equally good choices if you consider stat investment. f.e.:
    claymore vs. man serpent sword
    halberd vs. scythe/great scythe
    broadsword vs. balder side sword
    other spears vs. silverknight spear
    washing pole vs. chaos blade
    i'd argue that unless you hit 40/40 the quality weapons can't take #1 due to significant dmg loss when 1-handing. and if you hit 40/40 you have made such a heavy stat investment that a proper lvl100 build is impropable. by no means i want to talk bad things about the claymore or halberd though, just questioning if they are "really"worth such a investment/commitment...


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    Re: WTH is the point of a quality build..

    Post by Seignar on Thu May 16, 2013 7:46 pm

    Viable SL100
    Again, I would like to point out I'm not a fan of too much HP, I play at a slightly below-average HP amount (Usually anywhere between 1000-1300 suffice for me) and I usually keep my defenses at the 350 point with poise and everything (Mid-Roll viable!).

    As you can see, this build guarantees max damage outputs for all weapons and a 198 buff as well as acess to a grand amount of greatshields, shields and some more occult weapons like the BKGA. Quality weapons have some insane benefits such as the WP being one long katana (With an AR higher than the Uchi), the Claymore having a 1H quick thrust attack and the Greatsword having one of the best Strong Attacks for UGS.

    In addition, one key factor about Quality builds is that they have the dreaded murder weapon called the Murakumo which deadangles, stunlocks, swings and breaks poise extremely easily and even has a decent running and Strong Attack. Having that beast is more than enough reason to go Quality.

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    Re: WTH is the point of a quality build..

    Post by Latitoast on Thu May 16, 2013 9:07 pm

    I think it's movesets.

    For example, the Claymore has some awesome R2s, so people make quality builds to use the Claymore.


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    Re: WTH is the point of a quality build..

    Post by xenon_nobelium on Fri May 17, 2013 5:57 am

    the only different attacks the claymore has from man serpent sword are 1h R2 and rolling 2h R1. both are obviously better, else there would be no fuzz about the claymore, but the man serpent swords equivalents serve the same purpose and are really not that much behind in speed and reach. all while clearly outdamaging the claymore (unless you hit 40/40) for half the stat requirements. don't shun the man serpent sword unless you tried it, i'd rank it after abyss but before claymore and moonlight just for it's low stat req.


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