Dark Souls and Vagrant Story

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    chantienyee
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    Dark Souls and Vagrant Story

    Post by chantienyee on Sat May 04, 2013 3:58 am

    Hey guys.
    Has anybody played Vagrant Story?
    It was always one of my favourite games of all time, probably up until the Souls series, and including the other games by Team Ivalice. I never really understood the complex mechanics, although I did play the game a ton and struggled through a number of times.

    I think it's a lot like Dark Souls. Sorry if this has been covered elsewhere -- I'd love to see where because I don't think I've ever seen a comparison (although I remember EpicNameBro mentioning it in passing in one of his videos), or much talk about Vagrant Story in general. New Game Plus, weapon crafting (albeit far more complex in VS), a crapload of weapon types and complex affinities...

    I've just come back and downloaded it for PSN (only $6!!) to play again and I'm realizing that (not only has it aged amazingly in my eyes, but) Dark Souls has trained me to be good at games. I made a post in another thread about how I've been trying to pick up other games after having beaten Dark Souls like 10 times and platinuming and everything, but I just can't play other games anymore. Vagrant Story immediately felt right at home and I'm playing it a lot better than I did years ago.

    I've been following Vageta's new SL1 NG+7 and in today's video he was talking about how Street Fighter taught him how to be a good gamer and to pay attention to how game mechanics work and I think that's what Dark Souls has done for me. I guess that's an aside, but struggling through Dark Souls so many times and finally getting to the point where I understand most of the stuff there is has made me better appreciate Vagrant Story and I think other Dark Souls aficionados would really dig this game if they haven't already played it.

    I'd love to hear others thoughts on the similarities.



    EDIT: Summary of similarities:
    -new game plus
    -weapon crafting
    -many weapon types
    -complex weapon and enemy classes and affinities
    -...hence much trial and error with weapon use and crafting
    -significant dexterity/reaction time component (DS critical attacks versus VS chain attacks)
    -items you can only acquire in NG+ an beyond (including a key to a level inaccessible in NG)
    -VS's gems are essentially the same as DS's rings
    -infrequent save points similar to bonfires
    -like at bonfires, basic smithing is possible on the go, but workshops must be sought to perform more complex crafting (like DS's blacksmiths)
    -workshops are also specific in the materials with which you are able to forge, such as wood, bronze, iron, etc (similar to DS's upgrading-specific blacksmiths -- giant blacksmith forges lightning weapons, but you must still return to Andre to get +5, +10, etc).
    -bosses and music are awe-inspiring
    -complex and engrossing lore
    -some bosses return later in the game as regular enemies


    Last edited by chantienyee on Tue May 07, 2013 2:04 am; edited 1 time in total


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    Re: Dark Souls and Vagrant Story

    Post by Maneater_Mildred on Sat May 04, 2013 5:30 am

    In the long long ago times I remember this game, it was great.
    Off to the ps store I go....

    And I agree 100% that dark souls is 1 of those games that makes you better at gaming in general, as long as you are willing to learn.

    Great post. Proper Bow


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    Re: Dark Souls and Vagrant Story

    Post by Serious_Much on Sat May 04, 2013 6:17 am

    To be honest as a result of dks, I'm avoiding new games unless I know ill like it..

    Old games are doing it for me winking


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    Re: Dark Souls and Vagrant Story

    Post by Hue on Sat May 04, 2013 8:00 am

    ^Try some arcade-simulation games

    Such as War Thunder


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    Re: Dark Souls and Vagrant Story

    Post by Serious_Much on Sat May 04, 2013 9:17 am

    not that old silly

    I mean ps2/ps1 generation


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    Re: Dark Souls and Vagrant Story

    Post by skarekrow13 on Sat May 04, 2013 9:31 am

    Vagrant Story is a masterpiece. I'd say there are comparisons, not necessarily a ton but you nailed them. Biggest comparison is that VS also made you better as a gamer. Easy mode=getting good at chain attacks


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    Re: Dark Souls and Vagrant Story

    Post by llLeRainbowDash on Sat May 04, 2013 11:21 am

    I miss owning a Playstation so very much. XblA sucks so hard. Especially when you grow up with Playstation.
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    Re: Dark Souls and Vagrant Story

    Post by Hue on Sat May 04, 2013 12:29 pm

    PCSX2, if you have a good computer

    I'm still playing Shadow of the Colossus and Burnout Revenge


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    Re: Dark Souls and Vagrant Story

    Post by chantienyee on Sat May 04, 2013 3:24 pm

    Some more similarities: There are items that you can only acquire after multiple NG+s. There's also a level that you can only access in NG+. There's a lot of trial and error required (figuring out which weapon types work against which types of enemies, balancing affinities and classes in forging and using weapons against the right baddies. Gems are pretty much like rings. Bosses, music, environments are awe-inspiring. Save points are infrequent and essentially the same as bonfires. You can do some minor forging at them too, but like modifying in DS, you can only do certain things at workshops, and only certain workshops. So like getting a fire weapon from Vamos but then being able to upgrade up to a certain level at the bonfire, in VS you can dissassemble weapons and attach gems and stuf, but you can only assemble new weapons in workshops, and only with materials attributed to that workshop, so, like bronze and wood, but not iron (just like how you can upgrade lightning at the giant blacksmith, but in order to get something to +5 or +10 on the regular path, you have to run back to Andre). Complex and engrossing lore (although clearly not as subtle as DS).

    It's hard to find good VS videos online, but here's one of a pro forging some maxed weapons... I've never been this good, but it's now my goal to be, post-Dark Souls (and in light of flickering):


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    Re: Dark Souls and Vagrant Story

    Post by Cheylus on Sat May 04, 2013 6:18 pm

    Vagrant Story is my favorite video game. I beat it when I was a kid, struggling to kill the final boss (I killed most of the bosses with weapons that do 1hp per strike...).

    Then I got better and better, did it twenty times. I opened a website about this game and its lore in 2001.
    Vagrant Story is the game that make me love Dark Souls (I read something on gamefaqs comparing the two games, I jumped on DS after that).

    For me, it had the best intro in a video game. It lasts nearly 10 min, it's playable (and skippable), the music themes are wonderful, it's filled with mysteries and greatness.
    The soundtrack is, also, still the best I've heard anywhere.
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    Re: Dark Souls and Vagrant Story

    Post by chantienyee on Sat May 04, 2013 7:03 pm

    Yesss.
    I beat everything in my first playthroughs doing piddly 1-damage hits. I played the game through with max risk relying on chains from miss incrementally up to 10s of damage at 20-ish chains. I understood the basics of risk but I never understood the complexities of the weapon system, so I probably used the fandango most of the way through, mostly because I felt more confident with its chaining motions. Eventually I forged my own, but it was probably only meagerly better. I never understood that attacking an enemy increased your weapon's strength against that type of enemy and weakened it against the opposite types.

    I'm playing again now, trying to look through FAQs to better understand. I think that some of the displays should be default, like the one that tells you how your weapons are being shaped during a battle -- I probably would have figured out the system a lot easier if I had seen these displays. I only just happened to go through the gameplay option menus to find this.

    Is your website still active?? Or can you recommend any good resources? I'm finding it pretty hit and miss to find good info.


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    Re: Dark Souls and Vagrant Story

    Post by SlakeMoth on Sat May 04, 2013 7:11 pm

    Played it, loved it and have still got it. I remember the final boss fight being pretty hard and had an unusual setting. It was set on a big disc thing and you had to use split second timing to score a hit.
    I also remember that at the beginning I thought the main man was wearing hairy trousers and braces. I christened them 'troll trousers' right then. He also had weird hair, it looked like he had horns. Not long after I got my first pair of spectacles.
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    Re: Dark Souls and Vagrant Story

    Post by Cheylus on Sat May 04, 2013 7:37 pm

    I can't remember exactly the gameplay mechanics, sorry... Haven't played the game for a very, very long time.
    My website closed :/
    I can't think about anything but gamefaqs, sorry. This site also has everything useful covered, imo.

    I only remember that you should have 3 weapons at least: one who can deal with 1. humans & beasts, another for 2. ghosts & undeads and another for 3. evil & dragons, to raise affinities. I had a greatsword for 1., a silver dagger (named Soul Kriss iirc) for 2. and a spear for Dragons (had a special staff for "evil" iirc). Always keep a great mace for some cases.
    I've almost never crafted anything, really. I did my last NG playthrough of the game without any craft.
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    Re: Dark Souls and Vagrant Story

    Post by chantienyee on Sat May 04, 2013 9:05 pm

    Cool. Thanks.
    Yeah, I've got similar weapons, thanks to a guide I found. I switched from a spear to a greatsword for dragons though -- I hate that moveset -- so tough to chain. And instead I have a scimitar for humans/beasts. I also use the Soul Kiss though. I think the main thing I'm crafting right now is changing the hilts so I can add gems.


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    Re: Dark Souls and Vagrant Story

    Post by chantienyee on Mon May 06, 2013 3:23 am

    Another similarity: the game progresses in such a way that bosses later reappear as regular enemies (ie the fire elemental).


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    Re: Dark Souls and Vagrant Story

    Post by Jansports on Mon May 06, 2013 4:10 am

    this thread reminded me that I had worked up and down every single Nippon Ichi title from Rhapsody through everything made up til like disgaea4. Except Soul Nomad. When it was brand new, it seemed like Nothing I did worked. I'd get by for a dozen missions or so then just get ultra blast hyper cannon stone walled. I went back to it after I had beaten the tar out of Demon's and well I "got" it more. I wasn't struggling, things went smoth, my rooms was tight and my furniture ballin.
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    Re: Dark Souls and Vagrant Story

    Post by chantienyee on Tue May 07, 2013 1:38 am

    I'll also point out that Vagrant Story got a 9.6 on IGN, while Dark Souls only got a 9 :p Not that I don't love Dark Souls, of course, but it's just testament to VS's underrated brilliance.
    http://ca.ign.com/articles/2000/05/23/vagrant-story


    EDIT: Also added a running summary of similarities to the first post so far.


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