Some things I've discovered about duel-wielding 5 4 4

    Some things I've discovered about duel-wielding

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    Some things I've discovered about duel-wielding

    Post by Dibsville on Fri Apr 26, 2013 12:41 pm

    I've been duel-wielding since the Dark Souls 2 preview has been released, so I could brush up on my skills and get ready for when duel-wielding will actually be viable.
    I've discovered a ton of surprising things that you guys should at least try once:

    -Halberds off-hand uses the vertical strike, it's also faster then the normal on-hand strike. This goes for every halberd type weapon, even Halberd and Giant's Halberd. This makes it extremely good as an off-hand choice as its fast speed and long range make it good for finishers.

    -Scythes off-hand use the R2 attack when used, its long reach and decent recovery, plus the huge distance it covers per swing makes it a good finisher, especially with Lifehunt as you'll have the chance to max out the bleed bar as well as do huge damage.

    -Curved Greatswords off-hand are actually pretty fast, the attack is diagonal and do huge damage as well as have a very quick follow-up. They are a little harder to use, but can be worth it when you get used to it.

    -Straight Swords off-hand have the fastest recovery of any weapon, hit or miss. Balder Side Sword off-hand is an amazing way to start a combo as it's fast and has long reach on top of decent damage. I'm not exaggerating when I say that a straight sword off-hand may be the most viable off-hand weapon in this game.

    -Hand Axe is fast and can stun through quite a bit of poise, it's good for surprising people.

    -Spears off-hand are extremely viable. Being one of the better choices for off-handing, they have fast, long-ranged attacks that do good damage and can surprise people with their range. I'd recommend using the Demon's Spear as it has split damage meaning you can use it on turtles fairly well while still doing decent damage when you do actually get a hit in. It's also tied for being the longest spear in the game, making it very useful for kiting with it then going in and doing high damage with your on-hand weapon.

    -Katanas off-hand definitely wouldn't be my first choice. While they have good range and semi-high damage as well as increasing bleed build-up, they're not much better for anything other than looking cool. They have vertical strikes, making them almost useless for stopping a backstab fisher (one of the things that makes duel-wielding so good). They also have a large recovery time, so they are generally useless for damage output. Generally, if you're going to off-hand a Katana, your best bet would be to pair it with another bleed weapon as well as strictly use the Chaos Blade as it has the most bleed build-up of the Katanas. A Curved Sword would be a better choice for general use as it has horizontal strikes with faster recovery and less weight.

    -Rapiers off-hand are good for Leo pokes against poiseless people, the parry is also pretty discreet so people will literally be walking right into the parry without even seeing it. You can also use it as a quick "hit and run" weapon to get a quick strike in during your enemy's recovery.

    -Daggers off-hand are really only good for the Parrying Dagger, it's too short to actually be viable. However; Priscilla's Dagger can be paired with a bleed weapon for devestating results.

    -Curved Swords are one the better off-hand options, fast attacks, fast recoveries, decent damage, and can parry. It's a pretty common duel-wielding weapon, and for a good reason. I'd recommend using these as a starter duel-wielding weapon if you've never tried it before.

    -Ultra-Greatswords make amazing off-hand weapons as you can surprise people by randomly pulling it out and hitting a 400 on them, it's also pretty fast and very easy to bait with as there is a small pause before the swing. Don't forget you can also dead-angle with it.

    -Great Hammers off-hand have great slam attacks that are good for tight corridors and surprise attacks. It also puts your enemy on the ground so you get a wake-up advantage.

    -Whips off-hand have better tracking than their on-hand versions, as well as being able to parry. Even better, they can not be parried like most other off-hand weapons, and have bleed and poison versions for status build-ups. One of the better off-hand weapons, and quite common like the Curved Swords.

    -Gauntlets are fast and light, but that's generally all they have going for them. They're outclassed by Daggers, which have faster, horizontal attacks and more variation. Unfortunately, the Claw' off-hand attack is somewhat useless, while the Caestus is weaker than a Dagger for the same weight, and the Dragonbone Fist is too heavy compared to its damage output. Generally not the best choice-- but they can be put to good use in some situations.

    -Greatswords have good damage with a pretty decent attack speed, while sacrificing a bit of recovery speed. They can be put to good use due to horizontal swings with high range, making backstab fishers easier to deal with.

    -Greataxes are a bit more advanced and harder to use, but it's well worth it to get used to them. They do huge damage as well as having high poise break, good range, and a decently fast attack. They have horizontal attacks, making them good for backstab fishers, and are great for baits. Overall a good weapon, but hard to get used to.

    I'm excluding Bows, Crossbows, Greatbows, Catalysts, Talismans, and Shields simply because it's generally assumed that these go well in the off-hand.

    This is what I've found from duel-wielding. Just my opinion, but you should at least give it a try.


    Last edited by Dibsville on Wed Aug 21, 2013 6:15 pm; edited 1 time in total


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    Re: Some things I've discovered about duel-wielding

    Post by Seignar on Fri Apr 26, 2013 1:19 pm

    Ultra-Greatswords have large stun times with incredible recovery. You can actually combo a ton of stuff from it if you break poise.

    Straight Sword attacks have an extremely quick recovery frame, faster than the Balder Side sword 1H R1 (It varies, however. The off-hand BSS has faster recovery than the on-hand BSS).


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    Re: Some things I've discovered about duel-wielding

    Post by Dibsville on Fri Apr 26, 2013 2:27 pm

    Seignar wrote:Ultra-Greatswords have large stun times with incredible recovery. You can actually combo a ton of stuff from it if you break poise.

    Straight Sword attacks have an extremely quick recovery frame, faster than the Balder Side sword 1H R1 (It varies, however. The off-hand BSS has faster recovery than the on-hand BSS).
    I mentioned this, I don't think I said that they can be useful for combos, though.
    If I didn't I should have put it there. Off-hand Ultras recovery time is amazing.


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    Re: Some things I've discovered about duel-wielding

    Post by Seignar on Fri Apr 26, 2013 3:02 pm

    I wonder what you can't combo it with...considering UGS have the high stun time due to their slow swing speeds, anything faster than the Zweihander will combo...


    *Runs off to make a UGS Mage*


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    Re: Some things I've discovered about duel-wielding

    Post by ResIsBestStat on Fri Apr 26, 2013 4:14 pm

    Seignar wrote:I wonder what you can't combo it with...considering UGS have the high stun time due to their slow swing speeds, anything faster than the Zweihander will combo...


    *Runs off to make a UGS Mage*

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    Re: Some things I've discovered about duel-wielding

    Post by sparkly-twinkly-lizard on Fri Apr 26, 2013 4:44 pm

    whips, in the off hand can parry and are a good tactic against parry spammers.
    fist weapons, one of the fastest if not the fastest attack in the game off handed(not claw or dark hand), and can parry.
    great axes strike quiker in the off hand then in the main hand one handed.
    crossbow in the off hand means you have a ranged attack and you can spam the change bolts button to scratch your @$$ mid combat, this animation also serves as a hilarious battle poker face making it hard for opponents to predict what you'll do.


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    Re: Some things I've discovered about duel-wielding

    Post by Dibsville on Fri Apr 26, 2013 4:51 pm

    Crossbows didn't make the cut because everyone already knows they are good for off-handing.
    Fist weapons are too weak to be any good, they also have short range. Unless you're using the Dragonbone Fist, it's pretty useless. Even then, you'll only hit about 150 per hit, so fast or not it's not going to be very effective against anyone who knows to stay out of range.
    Greataxes were mentioned that they could be used well with practice. I honestly could not find use of it with most of the combinations I tried.
    Whips are amazing off-hand weapons as they have better tracking and do decent damage. Notched Whip will also continue bleed build up, likewise Guardian Tail will continue poison build up. I didn't mention them because they are a well known off-hand weapon, and using one off-hand is nothing new. Even though I say this, I included Curved Swords but only to prove a point that it's better to go with a Curved Sword than a Katana.


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    Re: Some things I've discovered about duel-wielding

    Post by WandererReece on Fri Apr 26, 2013 5:06 pm

    sparkly-twinkly-lizard wrote:not claw

    That is so true. I thought Duel Claws would be really cool. I thought I would be awsome like Wolverine if I got Duel Claws. That didn't work well. The left hand L1 is like the right hand R2, and the parry is too slow in my opinion.

    It would be great for a challenge run.


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    Re: Some things I've discovered about duel-wielding

    Post by MosquitoPower on Fri Apr 26, 2013 5:08 pm

    Of the great swords, Gravelord sword in off hand seems to swing waaaay faster than if its used in main hand (and seems to still hit really hard). Downside is you can’t block or parry with it.

    Pointless fashion tip of the day:
    If you want to look “super cool” on the field, off hand a bastard-sword or claymore (because they have scabbards on your back). When you double hand your main weapon your character will sheath the sub weapon.
    Wanders coat + dual bastard-swords – arrows = Awesome


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    Re: Some things I've discovered about duel-wielding

    Post by Dibsville on Fri Apr 26, 2013 5:10 pm

    MosquitoPower wrote:Of the great swords, Gravelord sword in off hand seems to swing waaaay faster than if its used in main hand (and seems to still hit really hard). Downside is you can’t block or parry with it.

    Pointless fashion tip of the day:
    If you want to look “super cool” on the field, off hand a bastard-sword or claymore (because they have scabbards on your back). When you double hand your main weapon your character will sheath the sub weapon.
    Wanders coat + dual bastard-swords – arrows = Awesome
    I mentioned that off-hand Curved Greatswords are good.
    You need to learn the beauty of Chester's Overcoat, you'll never use Wanderer's again.


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    Re: Some things I've discovered about duel-wielding

    Post by sparkly-twinkly-lizard on Fri Apr 26, 2013 5:57 pm

    on a 40/40 build the caestus does quite a bit of damage actually considering its speed
    https://mugenmonkey.com/darksouls/?c=427199743890877237
    also i forgot about dual axes (that aren't the handaxe), you actually can stunlock by alternating hits, plus the off hand swipe is useful for cancelling bs's
    the only other bit of info i have is that off hand curved greatswords are only so-so in the off hand as they can't block or parry, only the same attack for L1 or L2


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    Re: Some things I've discovered about duel-wielding

    Post by Dibsville on Fri Apr 26, 2013 6:01 pm

    I used a 40-40 build with these.
    Axes off-hand aren't as good as I thought they were going to be. I was expecting a good combo starter but ended up having a "if I miss, I'm going to die" weapon, and even on a hit it didn't really have enough recovery for me to do anything.


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    Re: Some things I've discovered about duel-wielding

    Post by MosquitoPower on Fri Apr 26, 2013 9:21 pm

    Dibsville wrote:
    MosquitoPower wrote:Of the great swords, Gravelord sword in off hand seems to swing waaaay faster than if its used in main hand (and seems to still hit really hard). Downside is you can’t block or parry with it.

    Pointless fashion tip of the day:
    If you want to look “super cool” on the field, off hand a bastard-sword or claymore (because they have scabbards on your back). When you double hand your main weapon your character will sheath the sub weapon.
    Wanders coat + dual bastard-swords – arrows = Awesome
    I mentioned that off-hand Curved Greatswords are good.
    You need to learn the beauty of Chester's Overcoat, you'll never use Wanderer's again.

    Hehe, while the Chester's coat has the look of the well dressed adventurer, the wanderer's coat has the look of someone who has spent some time sleeping in the dirt/mud. Overcoat wars!

    But seriously, I think Latrec set with Chester's Coat is the most fly look in the game =)


    Dident mean to double list your curved greatsword information, what I meant to cover was being that (unlike some of the other curved greatswords)the Gravelord sword has such laughably slow R2 (strong) attacks that you are not missing anything by off handing it.
    (Other than the speedy 2handed running attack)
    So it was my personal pick for best curved great-sword to off hand.


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    Re: Some things I've discovered about duel-wielding

    Post by Dibsville on Sat Apr 27, 2013 10:50 am

    MosquitoPower wrote:
    Dibsville wrote:
    MosquitoPower wrote:Of the great swords, Gravelord sword in off hand seems to swing waaaay faster than if its used in main hand (and seems to still hit really hard). Downside is you can’t block or parry with it.

    Pointless fashion tip of the day:
    If you want to look “super cool” on the field, off hand a bastard-sword or claymore (because they have scabbards on your back). When you double hand your main weapon your character will sheath the sub weapon.
    Wanders coat + dual bastard-swords – arrows = Awesome
    I mentioned that off-hand Curved Greatswords are good.
    You need to learn the beauty of Chester's Overcoat, you'll never use Wanderer's again.

    Hehe, while the Chester's coat has the look of the well dressed adventurer, the wanderer's coat has the look of someone who has spent some time sleeping in the dirt/mud. Overcoat wars!

    But seriously, I think Latrec set with Chester's Coat is the most fly look in the game =)


    Dident mean to double list your curved greatsword information, what I meant to cover was being that (unlike some of the other curved greatswords)the Gravelord sword has such laughably slow R2 (strong) attacks that you are not missing anything by off handing it.
    (Other than the speedy 2handed running attack)
    So it was my personal pick for best curved great-sword to off hand.
    Actually, the Gravelord Sword R2 is an amazing bait if you're fighting unlocked, which I tend to do. Since you can turn right before the stab, you can put the strike right beside your opponent, so if they parry it then they will be hit, if they guard it they will be pushed back to prevent a BS, and of course you have the chance to dead angle.


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    Re: Some things I've discovered about duel-wielding

    Post by WhatDoesThePendantDo? on Sun Apr 28, 2013 12:38 am

    Very informative.


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    Re: Some things I've discovered about duel-wielding

    Post by Thel65 on Wed May 01, 2013 2:39 pm

    I've always used shields in my offhand and never gave a second thought about other weapons. Maybe I should do a play-through with a different off hand weapon.

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    Re: Some things I've discovered about duel-wielding

    Post by Dibsville on Mon Jun 10, 2013 6:12 pm

    Thel65 wrote:I've always used shields in my offhand and never gave a second thought about other weapons. Maybe I should do a play-through with a different off hand weapon.
    You definitely should, it's well worth the time.


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    Re: Some things I've discovered about duel-wielding

    Post by Hatsune Miku on Mon Jun 10, 2013 6:27 pm

    Thank you Dibsy-Doo. Thank you.


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    Re: Some things I've discovered about duel-wielding

    Post by Animaaal on Mon Jun 10, 2013 6:40 pm

    MosquitoPower wrote:...Of the great swords, Gravelord sword in off hand seems to swing waaaay faster than if its used in main hand (and seems to still hit really hard). Downside is you can’t block or parry with it....

    Then what does it do? Block, or parry, or have 2 attacks? I've never used it in the left hand. confused

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    Re: Some things I've discovered about duel-wielding

    Post by Dibsville on Mon Jun 10, 2013 6:41 pm

    If I remember correctly, Server and Mura can block.


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    Re: Some things I've discovered about duel-wielding

    Post by Animaaal on Mon Jun 10, 2013 6:48 pm

    thnx biggrin

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    Re: Some things I've discovered about duel-wielding

    Post by Odinbear on Mon Jun 10, 2013 8:30 pm

    Offhand weapon can be parry/riposted. . Had it happen today with the BKGS in left hand.


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    Re: Some things I've discovered about duel-wielding

    Post by jimmyc0341 on Sat Jun 29, 2013 4:42 pm

    obviously this thread is a few weeks old but what would you say to a BSS? I'm very comfortable w/that weapon and it has decent reach. Should it be a main weapon or off-hand weapon or should I just not try it at all for dual-wielding


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    Re: Some things I've discovered about duel-wielding

    Post by Animaaal on Sat Jun 29, 2013 4:56 pm

    The BSS attacks and blocks. If you want an off hand weapon that blocks, there are better options. But then again, that's subjective to how I play. If you like the BSS in the offhand and do good with it then go for it I say.

    Just an example though, a katana has the same if not better reach and it can parry.

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    Re: Some things I've discovered about duel-wielding

    Post by Dibsville on Sat Jun 29, 2013 5:07 pm

    BSS is an amazing off-hand because it has an insane recovery and can get a stunlock combo if you pair it with a fast weapon such as a Katana or another Straight Sword.

    Like I said in the OP, I'm not exaggerating when I say that off-hand Straight Swords may be the most viable off-hand weapon in the game.

    @Animaaal, the difference is the Katana off-hand has **** for recovery whereas a Straight Sword has one of the fastest in the entire game.

    Also, Parrying is not always the better choice over blocking. Parrying is risky, blocking keeps you alive. I'd rather block a hit rather than fail my parry and get completely demolished in one combo, which happens quite often if you miss a parry without any way of blocking.


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