The Glorious Weapon Swap (video)

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    Re: The Glorious Weapon Swap (video)

    Post by Forum Pirate on Sun Mar 31, 2013 9:38 pm

    Maneater_Mildred wrote:It's a slippery slope you're on, justice a small step away from the full weapon animation swap, which is pure evil.
    this.

    I'm going to go with no. I've known of this glitch for a while, but its very easily abusable, muscle memory/programmable controlers can see it done consistently, and it allows unbuffable weapons to be buffed. I can't tell you how much I detest TWoD and cmw mlgss', not to mention the idea of a slb demon spear or dss is terrifying. One could also do things like a ridiculous super lunge from an uchi to a great club, or a zweihander with a halberd r2, which are much safer, while retaining high damage potential.

    Its really the same thing as the spell swap, which was downright dirty.

    Most things fall into a grey area, but this isn't one of them, imo. If its not banned at a tournament, I'll use it without a second thought (I'm there to win after all), but otherwise I'm strictly hands off.


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    Re: The Glorious Weapon Swap (video)

    Post by Forum Pirate on Sun Mar 31, 2013 9:51 pm

    lordgodofhell wrote:This is useless versus anyone worth his armor. Parrying a rolling attack has to be the easiest thing to do in pvp. Entertaining to watch? Yes. Useful against say a Mossad or an Amos? No.
    I call bs. Roll attacks are very useful. How can you say the ability to use a longsword roll r1, with a halberd or a bkga with a with a longsword r2 wouldn't be incredibly useful?


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    Re: The Glorious Weapon Swap (video)

    Post by Emergence on Sun Mar 31, 2013 10:38 pm

    Unfortunately to maintain consistency with forum guidelines we have to remove the actual link to the vid. As a team we have to walk a fine line with glitches that have game breaking implications and it's a tenuous position of information vs proliferation. I think the community should be made aware of everything that is out there, however, allowing the site to be an open showcase for things that could be game breaking undermines our ability to maintain integrity, even if there is a substantial grey area. So for us it's like this: alert that the bomb exists without showing how to build one. Something like this leaves a bit much open for abuse, even if it is mostly innocuous or is impractical to pull off consistently.


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    Re: The Glorious Weapon Swap (video)

    Post by Saturday-Saint on Sun Mar 31, 2013 11:27 pm

    Saturday-Saint wrote:How come a thread linking to a replacement for BBG, a widely used and accepted glitch, got locked and had its link removed, but this thread that showcases a glitch with very clear game-breaking potential is left alone?
    On the other hand, now that I've looked up what the "new BBG", it's on kind of a different level than this since it's hacked save data.


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    Re: The Glorious Weapon Swap (video)

    Post by lordgodofhell on Mon Apr 01, 2013 2:37 am

    Forum Pirate wrote:
    lordgodofhell wrote:This is useless versus anyone worth his armor. Parrying a rolling attack has to be the easiest thing to do in pvp. Entertaining to watch? Yes. Useful against say a Mossad or an Amos? No.
    I call bs. Roll attacks are very useful. How can you say the ability to use a longsword roll r1, with a halberd or a bkga with a with a longsword r2 wouldn't be incredibly useful?

    Because ALL roll attacks have that tell you know.. rolling.

    Keep in mind also, that I mentioned this not being all that useful versus very skilled opponents. The very idea that we would give you time to do this glitch during a fight is silly. If someone tried it I would likely end the fight quickly out of disgust for them using a glitch during a match.


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    Re: The Glorious Weapon Swap (video)

    Post by Juutas on Mon Apr 01, 2013 6:39 am

    Before anyone judges this to be the new doom of PvP, you should actually try and pull this off against a player in actual duel. Yes, the reward of landing one is great, but should you miss it or fail you just deplete your stamina or end up looking like an idiot standing there with swapped weapon.

    This game has way worse things that are "legit", for example roll backstab with buffed weapon and hornet is MUCH easier to pull off and does more dmg than most swaps.


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    Re: The Glorious Weapon Swap (video)

    Post by Saturday-Saint on Mon Apr 01, 2013 7:09 am

    This reminds me of how like back when people first found spellswap in Dark Souls they figured it'd be harmless, fun, and totally balanced.


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    Re: The Glorious Weapon Swap (video)

    Post by Emergence on Mon Apr 01, 2013 10:54 am

    In its present state I agree that it is not the doom of pvp. I think we can also all agree that it is only a matter time before the method is refined to eliminate any of its drawbacks which makes it really problematic.

    And yes, that new bb custom save is way worse because of what it can potentially port over into the PS3 scene.


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    Re: The Glorious Weapon Swap (video)

    Post by Jansports on Mon Apr 01, 2013 11:08 am

    I don't care if Legit things are more dangerous, or deal more damage or are easier to do.

    This is obviously a glitch. And in my opinion it should be kept out of pvp. Because if we allow THIS glitch why not other glitches? Why can't I put a 230 pyro hand Adjust DMB on my DSS? It's hard to pull off and doesn't change much (just adds about a trillion damage to my attacks)

    Why can't I as a host just hang out with my Zwei that has the Rapier moveset?

    No this exists because some code is not fully operational.

    It's really simple to say "No glitches" rather than "Not those glitches but these ones are okay"
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    Re: The Glorious Weapon Swap (video)

    Post by Emergence on Mon Apr 01, 2013 12:11 pm

    Picking and choosing which glitches are ok and which are not is very problematic and it's a discussion I would like to have as a community.

    With ambiguous stuff like DA, toggle escape, ravioli, inst-o-dash is the issue really a black and white affair? If we allow one in, should we not also then be forced to allow everything and vice versa? Or is there a commonality that we can agree on (game breaking, severity, ease of application) when determining what flies? To this point it has been easier to label things as this or that but now the glitches discovered are becoming more and more subtle and the lines are being blurred. To be honest it's a pita to admin it all sometimes, because ultimately I do what I do to advance the game and the community and have the wiki be the hub for innovation.


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    Re: The Glorious Weapon Swap (video)

    Post by Juutas on Mon Apr 01, 2013 12:35 pm

    Jansports wrote:I don't care if Legit things are more dangerous, or deal more damage or are easier to do.

    This is obviously a glitch. And in my opinion it should be kept out of pvp. Because if we allow THIS glitch why not other glitches? Why can't I put a 230 pyro hand Adjust DMB on my DSS? It's hard to pull off and doesn't change much (just adds about a trillion damage to my attacks)

    Why can't I as a host just hang out with my Zwei that has the Rapier moveset?

    No this exists because some code is not fully operational.

    It's really simple to say "No glitches" rather than "Not those glitches but these ones are okay"

    Toggle escape is a glitch too, so is spell cancel and dead angle...I don't see anyone judging these.
    I agree with buffing weapons that are not buffable to be extreme, but buffs in general in this game are broken as they can be to begin with.


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    Re: The Glorious Weapon Swap (video)

    Post by Forum Pirate on Tue Apr 02, 2013 2:50 am

    lordgodofhell wrote:Because ALL roll attacks have that tell you know.. rolling.

    Keep in mind also, that I mentioned this not being all that useful versus very skilled opponents. The very idea that we would give you time to do this glitch during a fight is silly. If someone tried it I would likely end the fight quickly out of disgust for them using a glitch during a match.
    One can roll as a dodge, and counter with that absurdity. Nothing hits good players near as often as it misses, but the sheer damage potential/speed ratio is way off, so its more likely to hit and hit hard than otherwise. I can't speak for others, but I can swap rings in the space of a fast roll, so with a programmable controller or a mid roll it could be done without a delay. Many of the roll attacks & r2's dead angle as well, so parrying isn't really an option. It also allows the stone great sword to be buffed, enabling TWoD (google it.) You wouldn't really have the option to "end it quickly" faced with TWoD.


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    Re: The Glorious Weapon Swap (video)

    Post by lordgodofhell on Tue Apr 02, 2013 4:40 am

    I know what a buffed stone greatsword is lol!

    Confronted with it for your first time of course you're likely to die. Hopefully next time you have space enabling you to stay at a large distance from them. After that you would have many options to win based upon how limited you decided to make the build.

    This glitch is silly. True Forum if you wanted to practice this a lot it could win some battles. However, you more than likely could have beaten them without it, if they fell prey to it.

    This glitch has been abused for going on years so I don't quite understand the intention of making this video as well.


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    Re: The Glorious Weapon Swap (video)

    Post by Forum Pirate on Tue Apr 02, 2013 4:53 am

    Yeah, and CMW MLBHs and slb dss are always broken as all hell. Thats never changed either, and to say buffing unbuffable weapons doesn't make a difference is laughable, especially with weapons like the mlbh that suddenly have 650+ pure magic AR.

    Even with your "next time space better" theory, how do you intend to deal any damage to them from such a distance? You're also assuming you know they've done it before you're caught in it, which isn't necessarily true.


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    Re: The Glorious Weapon Swap (video)

    Post by lordgodofhell on Tue Apr 02, 2013 5:03 am

    Forum Pirate wrote:Yeah, and CMW MLBHs and slb dss are always broken as all hell. Thats never changed either, and to say buffing unbuffable weapons doesn't make a difference is laughable, especially with weapons like the mlbh that suddenly have 650+ pure magic AR.

    Even with your "next time space better" theory, how do you intend to deal any damage to them from such a distance? You're also assuming you know they've done it before you're caught in it, which isn't necessarily true.

    I suppose the answer to that de rails this thread so maybe a new one on countering glitches. To add to the other countering glitch threads.

    In my posts about the rolling attacks I did not mean for that to be bunched in with buffing unbuffables. I know this affects pvp in advantages for the user.

    Some attacks will be hard/impossible to parry, some wont. I'll pass on firing this one up in my tactic book though.


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    Re: The Glorious Weapon Swap (video)

    Post by Juutas on Tue Apr 02, 2013 6:17 am

    Purpose of the video was show some cool swaps you can do AND that it's possible to do it with fast roll (which I've seen no one do ever before on my 2000+ hours on PvP) so a bit of show off was there too
    lol!
    I JUST THINK IT'S COOL ALRIGHT :'D


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    Re: The Glorious Weapon Swap (video)

    Post by Emergence on Tue Apr 02, 2013 11:07 am

    Juutas, glitches are bad and you should feel bad!

    silly

    Seriously though, cool story bro.

    Also, because of your av, everytime I go on twitch I feel like people are constantly saying "Juutas, Juutas, Juutas". I think I may change your forum name to Kappa to balance this out.


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    Re: The Glorious Weapon Swap (video)

    Post by Jansports on Tue Apr 02, 2013 3:29 pm

    The interesting thing to me is actually how easily I accept Dead Angles because they were in DeS they were known about and FROM choose to keep them in the game for DaS

    It's sort of similar to SSBM Nintendo intentionally left some of the buggyness from the first Smash Bros game in because it had become part of the metagame (L cancles wavedashes) But the Ness Super Yo-Yo glitch is NOT allowed because well...it's not an intended feature it just makes things messy.

    Is Ravioli stepping even a glitch, it's just using Unlocked fighting as far as I can tell. It's a normal backstep with normal backstep Iframes and hyper armor, it's just facing a new direction because hey I'm not locked on to you I can do that.
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    Re: The Glorious Weapon Swap (video)

    Post by Juutas on Tue Apr 02, 2013 6:54 pm

    Emergence wrote:Juutas, glitches are bad and you should feel bad!

    silly

    Seriously though, cool story bro.

    Also, because of your av, everytime I go on twitch I feel like people are constantly saying "Juutas, Juutas, Juutas". I think I may change your forum name to Kappa to balance this out.

    LOL! :'D yeah they be shouting mah name in da twitch hoodz~


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    Re: The Glorious Weapon Swap (video)

    Post by The Letter X on Tue Apr 02, 2013 9:56 pm

    Jansports wrote:The interesting thing to me is actually how easily I accept Dead Angles because they were in DeS they were known about and FROM choose to keep them in the game for DaS

    It's sort of similar to SSBM Nintendo intentionally left some of the buggyness from the first Smash Bros game in because it had become part of the metagame (L cancles wavedashes) But the Ness Super Yo-Yo glitch is NOT allowed because well...it's not an intended feature it just makes things messy.

    Is Ravioli stepping even a glitch, it's just using Unlocked fighting as far as I can tell. It's a normal backstep with normal backstep Iframes and hyper armor, it's just facing a new direction because hey I'm not locked on to you I can do that.

    I do not think ravioli step or reverse rolls are glitches. They're just features in my eyes.

    Juutas, I now assume you say "Kappa" after every single one of your posts.


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    Re: The Glorious Weapon Swap (video)

    Post by Phoenix Rising on Wed Apr 03, 2013 1:43 pm

    Emergence wrote:I think I may change your forum name to Kappa to balance this out.

    lol!


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