Countering the Dragonslayer Spear

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    GrinTwist
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    Countering the Dragonslayer Spear

    Post by GrinTwist on Thu Mar 21, 2013 10:39 pm

    I feel like this is a worthwhile subject to talk about seeing as I and a few other people may have trouble dealing with this weapon. So with the new forum rule in place, I have to ask what are some ways to counter the Dragonslayer Spear in PVP?


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    Re: Countering the Dragonslayer Spear

    Post by Saturday-Saint on Thu Mar 21, 2013 10:48 pm

    Are they two-handing it? Sit just outside their range. Then sprint in and do running attacks whenever you think they're going to attack. If you're sitting outside their range, they'll have to walk forward, that's a good cue they're about to attack.

    Are they one-handing it with a shield? Block to get in close without taking much damage. Then unlock and run in for a BS. If they keep rolling away before you can get behind them, then try to punish the rolls with an attack. You should be getting in close enough that you can hit them out of a roll with your attacks, and since you're running at them for a BS you can use a running attack if needed.

    At least, that's how I fight them with Zweihander and Uchi. You might need different strategies for different match-ups.


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    Re: Countering the Dragonslayer Spear

    Post by Emergence on Thu Mar 21, 2013 10:50 pm

    +1 to you both, for getting the ball rolling in the right direction.


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    Re: Countering the Dragonslayer Spear

    Post by Tolvo on Thu Mar 21, 2013 11:21 pm

    Dual wield Dragonslayer spears!
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    Re: Countering the Dragonslayer Spear

    Post by GrinTwist on Thu Mar 21, 2013 11:24 pm

    Tolvo wrote:Dual wield Dragonslayer spears!


    If this is advice, the idea of this thread was to make it to were people of different playstyles could counter the spear not where both parties are using the same weapon. Either way, thanks for the advice.


    Last edited by GrinTwist on Thu Mar 21, 2013 11:27 pm; edited 1 time in total


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    Re: Countering the Dragonslayer Spear

    Post by Tolvo on Thu Mar 21, 2013 11:26 pm

    I mean, logically if you use two while they use one, you'll have the advantage.
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    Re: Countering the Dragonslayer Spear

    Post by Ghadis_God on Thu Mar 21, 2013 11:29 pm

    Use a bow in the offhand, and dodge when they come near you. Once they try to rush you with a sprint, take your hand off the bow and pivot bs them. The bow's poison also bones their stamina regen so they can't dodge all over the place.

    Edit: alternatively, for a Str build, use a crossbow in the offhand and shoot them every time they miss a poke.


    Last edited by Ghadis_God on Thu Mar 21, 2013 11:32 pm; edited 1 time in total


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    Re: Countering the Dragonslayer Spear

    Post by Tolvo on Thu Mar 21, 2013 11:32 pm

    Now if I had to give actual advice then I'd simply go with what Ghadis said.

    If I'm having trouble dealing with an opponent using a spear I will typically switch to a spear myself so I can match them in range and simply try to out maneuver them. If that isn't working a good option is to use an elemental/magic/divine bow with appropriate arrows to chip damage them. Or if there is a decent amount of lag, just smash them with a strong weapon.

    Whatever you do be wary of standing in water. The Lightning R2 will spread into an AoE effect when hitting water, similar to the effect seen during the Sanctuary Guardian boss fight.
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    Re: Countering the Dragonslayer Spear

    Post by mofomey on Fri Mar 22, 2013 12:21 am

    on my str/int build im usin of late, i have been chewing thru spear users. i have been using the large club two handed and dont stay off them, i am right on top of them, dont let them get any distance. when i see a thrust coming i roll towards them and smash...more smashie. dragonspear's included. dont let them charge, make them backpedal. this may work with dex weaps as well.

    @tolvo, thanks for makin me laugh...


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    Re: Countering the Dragonslayer Spear

    Post by Automancer on Fri Mar 29, 2013 12:21 pm

    On the topic of countering spears, what tactic would you guys advice those that do not have poise? Because clearly, most of the tips here would require at least a certain amount of poise.


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    Re: Countering the Dragonslayer Spear

    Post by Jansports on Fri Mar 29, 2013 12:50 pm

    I'd Advise getting some poise. If you don't have enough poise to tank a single 1hr1 from a spear... well I'd consider that itself a problem.
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    Re: Countering the Dragonslayer Spear

    Post by Tolvo on Fri Mar 29, 2013 1:59 pm

    The bow Tactic works fine without poise, since it involves roll turtling. Whatever you do don't get anywhere near to the enemy and just run away. When not running, fire arrows. This tactic works against nearly any build really.

    It is however super tedious, and given that healing items are a thing this battle could go on for a very long time.
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    Re: Countering the Dragonslayer Spear

    Post by Ghadis_God on Fri Mar 29, 2013 4:30 pm

    I hate fighting people that do what Tolvo said, but against a spear user I would consider it. Also recall that poisoning the enemy nerfs their stamina regen, which makes a fast spear build useless. Keep on them and don't let them regen stamina, after a few dodges of theirs trade hits and stunlock them.


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    Re: Countering the Dragonslayer Spear

    Post by Jansports on Fri Mar 29, 2013 7:08 pm

    The stamina regen loss from poison is hardly enough to keep someone from roll kiting if they're smart. Just backing away and only rolling if you swing will keep their stamina healthy.
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    Re: Countering the Dragonslayer Spear

    Post by Rynn on Fri Mar 29, 2013 8:16 pm

    You can not counter this if wielded by a good player.
    But, if you really think so, feel free to give some counters to that.
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    Re: Countering the Dragonslayer Spear

    Post by Tolvo on Fri Mar 29, 2013 8:17 pm

    Bow Turtling.

    Until they run into a close quarters area. In which case, disconnect.
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    Re: Countering the Dragonslayer Spear

    Post by Forum Pirate on Fri Mar 29, 2013 8:45 pm

    I usually just swap to the demons spear and out range them, but simply refusing to engage and blasting them with whatever (magic) when they try works to.


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    Re: Countering the Dragonslayer Spear

    Post by AnCapaillMor on Fri Mar 29, 2013 8:49 pm

    Bow and the basic halberd, if you got the poise, draw them in with the bow, then as they run in do the halberds jumping attack to their left, you'll poise through the attack but have a high chance of dead angling it. you'll take damage but deal more to them.


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    Re: Countering the Dragonslayer Spear

    Post by Forum Pirate on Fri Mar 29, 2013 8:56 pm

    leo ring. you might not do more damage, they could tag you for 500.


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    Re: Countering the Dragonslayer Spear

    Post by OrnsteinBro on Mon Apr 01, 2013 1:13 am

    Tolvo wrote:Whatever you do be wary of standing in water. The Lightning R2 will spread into an AoE effect when hitting water, similar to the effect seen during the Sanctuary Guardian boss fight.

    Since when does anyone use the lightning R1, lol. It's too easy to get roll BSed with.

    I'm actually happy if they attempt it, it's a free roll BS. Even if the lightning on the water forces a no-damage BS, they end up falling to the floor, and oki is much better than an upright spearman dealing damage to me by frantically jabbing away from me in random wrong directions.


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    Re: Countering the Dragonslayer Spear

    Post by Noob-of-Artorias on Mon Apr 01, 2013 2:20 am

    People who use the DSS tend to 2H spam it, my effective strategy is getting in close, waiting till they start spamming and parry em.

    I realize that the spears have a weird parry length, but if you take a step forward every time they spam, you should easily get into parry territory.


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    Re: Countering the Dragonslayer Spear

    Post by Stonedtrooper on Mon Apr 01, 2013 4:32 am

    The spear is strongest only at a very specific distance where the spearman can poke you but your smaller weapon can't reach the spearman so like many people here suggested, either stay completely out of range and use a bow or stay very close the whole fight and pressure the spearman to land a parry.


    However, if you're a stubborn no-shield/bs/parry/weapon buff, melee-only dex dual wielder like me then consider either countering the spearman by using a dss/silver knight spear yourself. Both have good range and depending on stats/poise/leo ring, you could poke the spearman dead before he pokes you dead. Basically, a poking contest where the main factor would be your skill.


    But that sounds super lame so mix and match the spear with maybe something like great scythe, shotel, and notched whip. If the spearman doesn't turtle then your spear acts as a deterrent while your scythe is your hit-and-run weapon.
    If the spearman turtles, shotel and whip is your friend. Shotel especially if turtle is silly enough to use a greatshield.
    If turtle spearman parries, whip is your friend. Don't underestimate the whip's R1 light attack. It is an unparryable stamina killer. Stamina is one of the major requirements for a turtle so if you break that then turtle has to run away.



    As a left-hand spear user with the advantage over non-spear users and disadvantage against right hand spear users, I find that if you have four different weapons and constantly switch between them to keep the spearman guessing, the fight is less one-sided. Ninja flip ring helps to keep the spearman on his toes but you would need to sacrifice poise for that.


    The most one-sided spear build I have managed to beat so far was a TWoP+WotG high-poise turtle by using iron flesh. Spear turtle can't beat iron flesh.
    Or bs. Backstab solves everything silly


    tl;dr - bs


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