Why does _everything_ in the game need Faith?

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    Xaelai
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    Why does _everything_ in the game need Faith?

    Post by Xaelai on Mon Mar 18, 2013 10:53 pm

    So I'm looking through the Wiki, and I'm looking at convenants, weapons, spells, etc and I notice something....

    Wanna be a Darkmoon? I hope you have 30 Faith, otherwise its main reward isn't even usable.

    Wanna be a Gravelord and use one of their main rewards? You don't need Faith, but the damage will suck unless you have good Faith. Oh, and you need a Talisman to even cast the spell (shouldn't they have given the spell to the Sword's R2?). Said Talisman has a Faith requirement.

    Wanna be a Sunbro? Faith.

    Wanna be a Princess's Guard? Faith.

    Want a Divine Weapon to use for the Catacombs so you don't have to fight the same skeletons millions of times until you kill each of the mages, but yet don't want to farm green titanite? You need Faith for nearly anything that does Divine Damage except weapons you make yourself.

    And of course, this stuff is going on in a game where you are heavily punished if you raise your SL too high -- you can't summon or be summoned (in a game where it is already very difficult to do this in the first place, even when you have a friend you know on your friend list).

    Not only that, but most weapons have minimum requirements that _aren't_ faith, so you're forced to grind up the Faith _and_ the Str/Dex... but don't forget about your Endurance, seeing as how important that stat is... oh, and Vitality too -- otherwise you die in 2 hits from nearly anything.

    And perhaps I'm doing it wrong, but I've been having trouble actually getting a Cleric started and trying to keep it at "accepted" Soul Levels. Currently stuck on the Capra Demon because they stuck all the decent armors in places you can't get to: Hard Leather is in the Gaping Dragon's room, I could get the Elite Knight set, but that'd make me needing Havel's Ring and I don't have a very good weapon (killing him would take Forever), the Shadow Set is in Blighttown, so... meh.

    Kinda annoyed at the ridiculous Faith requirements for so much stuff in the game, and somewhat Int too.

    And.... you can't cast very many spells without a good helping of Attunement, too!

    Yet when I'm going through these areas, I keep getting invaded by people with 3+ spells, stuff from ridiculously far in the game doing 2-shot damage.... heh.
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    Re: Why does _everything_ in the game need Faith?

    Post by barrywilkins on Mon Mar 18, 2013 11:01 pm

    You have to believe in yourself to use weapons/spells that require you to believe in yourself.

    Its not like you can't balance your stats to be able to use a range of things. You just cant level your stats to use everything effectively, so ya gotta choose.
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    Re: Why does _everything_ in the game need Faith?

    Post by WandererReece on Mon Mar 18, 2013 11:12 pm

    It's all about choices. It's just like real life. You can't have it all. That's something you learn in economics.


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    Re: Why does _everything_ in the game need Faith?

    Post by Animaaal on Mon Mar 18, 2013 11:20 pm




    Its all about SMS baby 8)
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    Re: Why does _everything_ in the game need Faith?

    Post by Reaperfan on Mon Mar 18, 2013 11:45 pm

    What is Faith if not utilizing the power of a god? Thematically, this game puts a lot of emphasis on the fact that Lordran was home to a pantheon of Gods, and the Gods themselves play a much larger role in the lore for Dark Souls than most other elements. It stands to reason that because of their larger role in the plot, then there are lots of things that draw power from them.


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    Re: Why does _everything_ in the game need Faith?

    Post by IV_Mark_VI on Mon Mar 18, 2013 11:59 pm

    Silver Knight Spear does divine damage; don't need any faith at all to kill skeletons. In fact, you can just run through the skeletons and kill the necromancers.


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    Re: Why does _everything_ in the game need Faith?

    Post by Slarg232 on Tue Mar 19, 2013 12:59 am

    Yeah, I think the only character I've ever used Faith for to kill the skellies was my Leeroy cosplay, everyone else I just run through and two shot the Necromancer.


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    Re: Why does _everything_ in the game need Faith?

    Post by Shindori on Tue Mar 19, 2013 4:47 am

    Youd be surprised how easy it was for me to use a cleric at the beginning. If you want my opinion.. A katana or any weapon that causes bleed is your friend at the beginning. you're weak? No problem. Slash a few times and dice off 30% of the enemy's total HP, except for bosses of course, to which it just shaves off a strong amount. Good armor? Who needs armor when you have dodging and parrying? Miracle? Forget about them! At this level you don't need miracles. you just need skill.


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    Re: Why does _everything_ in the game need Faith?

    Post by Mr. Tart on Tue Mar 19, 2013 5:24 am

    I don't think Faith is too much a problem in this game. I've used up all my character slots, and only 2 characters actually rely on Faith at all. Something that is very helpful in Dark Souls is rolling, so practice your rolls. The gear isn't really that important, unless you don't roll a lot. Here's an example:



    Now, i don't know if you're new to the game or not, but all of us had a hard time with Dark Souls at first. It is very punishing, but once you've completed it a couple of times, you'll notice that you're getting the hang of it. Experiment with builds, try new things, see what you like. Try some PVP. Set up fair duels with no backstabs to introduce you to PVP etc. Experiment, keep trying, and don't ragequit. The game is punishing, but it will eventually reward you. And don't worry about the Faith, it isn't that important really. I hardly ever see people use faith even, and when i do, it's a ganker using TwoG, which i by the way rarely see nowadays.

    Most of the time i face people using pyromancies or sorceries.


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    Re: Why does _everything_ in the game need Faith?

    Post by Zephryl on Tue Mar 19, 2013 5:27 am

    Not everything needs Faith, just Miracles and Holy Weapons. I've done perfectly fine with the default level of Faith, I'm only going to have some Faith on this character because I'd like to get all the achievements on one character if I can (Makes it easier to keep track of the harder ones)

    It sounds more like all the things you're interested in doing need Faith, so... why not make a Faith build?


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    Re: Why does _everything_ in the game need Faith?

    Post by TheBigLebowski on Tue Mar 19, 2013 8:33 am

    WandererReece wrote:It's all about choices. It's just like real life. You can't have it all. That's something you learn in economics.

    Well some think they can have it all, that's what ruins the economy. we all have learned that in the past 15 years. winking
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    Re: Why does _everything_ in the game need Faith?

    Post by WandererReece on Tue Mar 19, 2013 10:08 am

    ^ Got to youtube and type "Global Economic Collapse" that's the scariest video I've ever seen. *shivers*


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    Re: Why does _everything_ in the game need Faith?

    Post by Nybbles on Tue Mar 19, 2013 10:20 am

    if it concerns you that much, try making an Artorias build, you need pretty much every stat anyway so why not?
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    Re: Why does _everything_ in the game need Faith?

    Post by Rynn on Tue Mar 19, 2013 10:30 am

    Faith is a PvE stat that offers no real PvP advantages (no good offensive magic, 1 magic minute of fame buff, and then healing pretty much.)

    Faith is superior for a PvE playthrough, while Int, Strength, and Dex are more PvP oriented.

    Vitality and Endurance aren't designed to be passed up by anyone.
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    Re: Why does _everything_ in the game need Faith?

    Post by Zechk on Tue Mar 19, 2013 10:30 am

    I've always wondered if the magic in the game is a sort of corrupted version of faith, or just the faith of one particular god.


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    Re: Why does _everything_ in the game need Faith?

    Post by WandererReece on Tue Mar 19, 2013 10:33 am

    ^ In Demons' Souls Faith was the "good" magic and was powered by a beleif in god, but Sorcery was an "evil" magic powered by the soul arts.


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    Re: Why does _everything_ in the game need Faith?

    Post by gmwdim on Tue Mar 19, 2013 3:28 pm

    As an atheist, this game offends me!

    Just kidding. silly

    All of us know that intelligence beats the living daylights out of faith, any day!


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    Re: Why does _everything_ in the game need Faith?

    Post by quench on Tue Mar 19, 2013 5:27 pm

    30 faith for DMB and great magic barrier comes in handy


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    Re: Why does _everything_ in the game need Faith?

    Post by psychichobo on Tue Mar 19, 2013 6:16 pm

    You don't really need faith to get through the catacombs - just grab a basic weapon, make it divine, and rely on your own stats to whup skellies to death.

    Or kick them off the edge and suicide run the necromancers. It's a lot easier than it looks, though fire resistant gear helps. Or bows, there's at least two you can get rid of easily that way.


    Gravelords don't always need faith - it's worth it for the mental sword and funtimes in infecting. Sunbros need it for spears, but I find they tend to get summoned more, so that helps.

    Princess Guard sucks. You only get a few miracles out of it which are hidden away anyway. Should've been available much earlier on to allow for more co-opping help.

    Blades of Darkmoon is basically an easier to access Darkwraith Covenant, since you don't have to spend ages trying to smack up the Four Kings early. That, and you get the full Orb early too.

    As for a good cleric build, try getting Astora's Straight Sword. It's in the Valley of the Drakes. I think the Zombie Dragon only wakes up when you grab it or the shield anyways, so you might have time to grab both.
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    Re: Why does _everything_ in the game need Faith?

    Post by swordiris on Tue Mar 19, 2013 7:32 pm

    Rynn wrote:Faith is a PvE stat that offers no real PvP advantages (no good offensive magic, 1 magic minute of fame buff, and then healing pretty much.)

    Faith is superior for a PvE playthrough, while Int, Strength, and Dex are more PvP oriented.

    Vitality and Endurance aren't designed to be passed up by anyone.

    Tell that to all the pvpers that complain about me using miracles.

    Wrath of God, heals, and tranquil walk all garner hatemail.
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    Re: Why does _everything_ in the game need Faith?

    Post by Rynn on Tue Mar 19, 2013 8:04 pm

    swordiris wrote:
    Rynn wrote:Faith is a PvE stat that offers no real PvP advantages (no good offensive magic, 1 magic minute of fame buff, and then healing pretty much.)

    Faith is superior for a PvE playthrough, while Int, Strength, and Dex are more PvP oriented.

    Vitality and Endurance aren't designed to be passed up by anyone.

    Tell that to all the pvpers that complain about me using miracles.

    Wrath of God, heals, and tranquil walk all garner hatemail.
    I've got an issue with that actually, I find it despicable that we punish faith characters for trying to use what is available to them. Wrath is annoying, but if you get hit, it's your fault. Heaing is responded to by the other party flasking... and TWoP is considered noobish to use, and got nerfed incredibly hard.

    The only problem with TWoP is that it can be combined with others spells for some incredibly cheap kills, but the spell itself is fine, I wish more people would use it in PvP.
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    Re: Why does _everything_ in the game need Faith?

    Post by gmwdim on Tue Mar 19, 2013 8:06 pm

    One ganker gets me with TWoP while his buddy casts Pursuers. Jolly cooperation indeed.


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    Re: Why does _everything_ in the game need Faith?

    Post by swordiris on Tue Mar 19, 2013 8:52 pm

    Yeah, I was never a big fan of Twop but my Heals and WoG make them angry.

    Another thing that has been making people mad is DMB.


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    Re: Why does _everything_ in the game need Faith?

    Post by mugenis4real on Tue Mar 19, 2013 9:23 pm

    WandererReece wrote:^ In Demons' Souls Faith was the "good" magic and was powered by a beleif in god, but Sorcery was an "evil" magic powered by the soul arts.

    Wrong. Point Forward

    In Demon's Souls your led to believe that Faith is "Good" magic and that Sorcery is "Evil" magic, but if your lucky enough to discover the Talisman of Beasts, you discover that both sides are actually drawing their powers form the same source and don't even know it.

    God that game was awesome. Praise the Sun

    Dark Souls 2 better not tell you stuff like that through cut-scenes. Look Skyward
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    Re: Why does _everything_ in the game need Faith?

    Post by WandererReece on Wed Mar 20, 2013 11:54 am

    ^ That reminds me.

    Sage Freke wrote:...And heaven forbid the day you find out what their so-called God really is…


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