Slow Weapon? Go for a Backstab!

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    Slow Weapon? Go for a Backstab!

    Post by Tolvo on Wed Feb 20, 2013 12:28 am

    So I was doing a bunch of invasions today and in a row I managed to get something like 50 kills.

    This is not a show of my skill but more so a level of incompetence I haven't seen in Dark Souls before tonight. I've seen some dumb things but not by so many different people. I only invaded the same person a few times and other than that I got around 40+ different people. I'd fight them with a Zwei and when they got low on health they'd pull out a rapier or the Dark Silver Tracer. They'd then go towards me and try for a backstab, trying to roll through my attack or strafe around me quickly.

    Every single person did this, and all I did was dead angle BS cancel and kill them. Every single time. It was almost humorous, on about the 51st person when he got near me low on health I did the BS cancel then ate a SS to the back of the head. He messaged me afterwards about why I did such an odd move and just swung away behind myself twice. I could only say that he wouldn't believe the night I've had.

    Now I'm not here to talk about backstabbing and what it is or isn't. I am however wondering if people see this a lot, people just going for this one technique for an easy kill. It's incredibly transparent and I don't understand how anyone can fall for this outside of a really bad lagstab. What is going on. Did I just end up facing a lot of idiots randomly or is this just becoming a lot more common?
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    Re: Slow Weapon? Go for a Backstab!

    Post by RANT on Wed Feb 20, 2013 12:35 am

    No,that's your about your typical night in dark souls.


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    Re: Slow Weapon? Go for a Backstab!

    Post by Tolvo on Wed Feb 20, 2013 12:39 am

    I mean, people have always gone for backstabs sure. But I always remember them at least trying to be sneaky about it. Tonight though it just seemed beyond transparent. I can normally guess what a player is going to try but this required basically no real pvp knowledge to see coming. It was like seeing a guy start to cast fire tempest with little dexterity at point blank with zero poise. Why would you do such a thing? Why wouldn't you use a corner, or hide the weapon. Why would you just upfront try something like that?
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    Re: Slow Weapon? Go for a Backstab!

    Post by RANT on Wed Feb 20, 2013 12:44 am

    Tbh I think its just lazyness on their part, most people just wanna win and will just go with the easiest way to do it.


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    Re: Slow Weapon? Go for a Backstab!

    Post by Tolvo on Wed Feb 20, 2013 12:49 am

    It's about as lazy as WotG spam or GC spam when the enemy is at low health. Usually people still try to space a little or lead you into it.

    It just doesn't seem like laziness only and just general incompetence. This was at the Kiln though so I don't know if that place is really the cream of the crop for dueling.
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    Re: Slow Weapon? Go for a Backstab!

    Post by The Letter X on Wed Feb 20, 2013 12:49 am

    I've seen an uprising in it as well. The more I use the Catch Pole and the Greatsword, the more it comes out. I normally have to eat the BS when using the Catch Pole, but the GS is amazing for pivoting, just like the Zwei.

    A funny thing that easily allowed me to get 1k+ damage was using the R2 of the Greatsword with the Leo Ring on a BS fisher. I'd use it to bait a BS, and pivot at the last moment. It normally caught them in their attacking animation, giving me a nice counter for more than half their health and an opportunity to stunlock the rest of the way.


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    Re: Slow Weapon? Go for a Backstab!

    Post by lordgodofhell on Wed Feb 20, 2013 1:19 am

    Tolvo wrote:So I was doing a bunch of invasions today and in a row I managed to get something like 50 kills.

    This is not a show of my skill but more so a level of incompetence I haven't seen in Dark Souls before tonight. I've seen some dumb things but not by so many different people. I only invaded the same person a few times and other than that I got around 40+ different people. I'd fight them with a Zwei and when they got low on health they'd pull out a rapier or the Dark Silver Tracer. They'd then go towards me and try for a backstab, trying to roll through my attack or strafe around me quickly.

    Every single person did this, and all I did was dead angle BS cancel and kill them. Every single time. It was almost humorous, on about the 51st person when he got near me low on health I did the BS cancel then ate a SS to the back of the head. He messaged me afterwards about why I did such an odd move and just swung away behind myself twice. I could only say that he wouldn't believe the night I've had.

    Now I'm not here to talk about backstabbing and what it is or isn't. I am however wondering if people see this a lot, people just going for this one technique for an easy kill. It's incredibly transparent and I don't understand how anyone can fall for this outside of a really bad lagstab. What is going on. Did I just end up facing a lot of idiots randomly or is this just becoming a lot more common?

    +1 For fooling me with the thread title. I knew you had something up your sleeve.

    I agree with Rant on backstab fishers. It is quite common. I have been running with way more hp than I originally did nearly a year ago due to it. I used to run about 900 hp now I probably opt for the casul 1749 area.

    Moral of the story. 2H R1 locked off Ultra Greats > bs fishing.

    Dead angle.....


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    Re: Slow Weapon? Go for a Backstab!

    Post by Ghadis_God on Wed Feb 20, 2013 1:20 am

    It was the same for me, invading SL50 in the PW with a Zwei. Opponent goes for a bs, turn around unlocked, win. Over and over and over, when I got bored of doing that I just counter bsed them. It really surprises me how many people think they're safe trying to strafe bs with their shield up, I don't think I was bsed all night.


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    Re: Slow Weapon? Go for a Backstab!

    Post by Tolvo on Wed Feb 20, 2013 1:22 am

    They did it with their shield up? Nearly everyone did it to me without a shield up, and a good amount of them had zero poise.
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    Re: Slow Weapon? Go for a Backstab!

    Post by sparkly-twinkly-lizard on Wed Feb 20, 2013 2:20 am

    http://mugenmonkey.com/darksouls/?c=396819217813889371
    so i take it this would now be the major counter to most fighters in dks now? i wouldn't really know cause i've been playing demons souls for the past 3 weeks


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    Re: Slow Weapon? Go for a Backstab!

    Post by CrackSouls on Wed Feb 20, 2013 2:28 am

    I generally don't do invasions any more, because of this. Even the Battle of Stoicism can get pretty bad. A lot of people focus on what I call "poise backstabbing" and it gets quite boring.

    It's why I duel people from this forum instead!


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    Re: Slow Weapon? Go for a Backstab!

    Post by Ghadis_God on Wed Feb 20, 2013 6:07 am

    To be fair Tol, a lot of the players were new-ish since I was invading at SL50, so it's natural that they try to bs with their shield up. A good few of them seemed to be PvP meta guys who were in the process of building, but I don't know why they all went for BS. It was really kind of strange, I've never met that many incompetent fishers in a row.


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    Re: Slow Weapon? Go for a Backstab!

    Post by WaLKA on Wed Feb 20, 2013 6:25 am

    To be honest I'm glad it's not just me. I always assume when it comes to multi-platform games that the PS3 community isn't as dumb as the xbox community due to our steady supply of FPS tryhards.


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    Re: Slow Weapon? Go for a Backstab!

    Post by Sentiel on Wed Feb 20, 2013 6:33 am

    RantFromRant wrote:No,that's your about your typical night in dark souls.
    This made me lol so hard!
    I don't even know why. big grin
    +1 for you good sir.


    Tolvo, I challenge you :!:
    Tonight.
    Burg, or Moonpit.
    SL 100
    My Rapier vs your Zwei.

    You will face something, you never fought before! A Rapier user, that doesn't bs fish!
    Hopefuly it will at least make you chuckle. winking

    I had similar experience though. When people get below 1/3 of their HP, they start to BS fish, or spell spam. DST users are especially funny, because that weapon is trash outside of it's high Crit, but they use it more than Rapier, which not only is much more viable to fight with it you fail to bs, but it actually does a bit more Crit damage.

    BS fishing people with UGS is pretty bad idea, since they got large horizontal arc on their swings and can stunlock you if you don't have high Poise. Not to mention Dead Angles. Anyone who does it deserves to get killed imo.

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    Re: Slow Weapon? Go for a Backstab!

    Post by Tolvo on Wed Feb 20, 2013 8:14 am

    I actually do use the DST when people are low on health, but I just use it in two hands and go for a flurry of attacks. I really only do this if I think they are below 100, since I haven't upgraded any fast weapons yet on my current main pvp character aside from my Zwei and a Dragonslayer spear. It's sort of funny since everyone assumes I'm going for a backstab so they space for that then I just get in some R1's and kill them.
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    Re: Slow Weapon? Go for a Backstab!

    Post by Sentiel on Wed Feb 20, 2013 8:29 am

    Tolvo wrote:I actually do use the DST when people are low on health, but I just use it in two hands and go for a flurry of attacks. I really only do this if I think they are below 100, since I haven't upgraded any fast weapons yet on my current main pvp character aside from my Zwei and a Dragonslayer spear. It's sort of funny since everyone assumes I'm going for a backstab so they space for that then I just get in some R1's and kill them.
    ^ That.
    Ever since I started using Rapier, people treat me as the worst kind of BS fisherman, while in reality I prefer to poke them with R2, or parry them if they get stupid.

    I can understand why people would asume you want to BS them when you take out DST, but since they have next to no HP, who would bother with a BS if you can just hit them with 1-2 R1? People be crazy in dis game....

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    Re: Slow Weapon? Go for a Backstab!

    Post by Tolvo on Wed Feb 20, 2013 8:35 am

    By the way if you really do want to duel I'd be happy to. Just don't expect much out of me in the way of danger haha. As I said in the first post my victories that night were mostly from the mistakes of my enemies.
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    Re: Slow Weapon? Go for a Backstab!

    Post by Sentiel on Wed Feb 20, 2013 8:47 am

    Sure, I love to play with people from here. You're all a good spirited bunch, so it's always fun to play with you guys. winking

    Don't expect much from me either, I'm still quite the noob. :oops:

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    Re: Slow Weapon? Go for a Backstab!

    Post by Tolvo on Wed Feb 20, 2013 2:53 pm

    I was just hosting in the burg and again saw a lot of this while on the hosting side. I was using a Smough's Hammer+5 and Fat Rolling. Whenever anyone couldn't easily kill me or just get Dead Angle WotG's, they'd just try to wait for an attack and strafe/roll for a backstab.

    Smough's hammer hits hard locked on and unlocked as it turns out.

    Though I didn't see any Silver Tracers today.
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    Re: Slow Weapon? Go for a Backstab!

    Post by Saturday-Saint on Wed Feb 20, 2013 11:22 pm

    Tolvo wrote:dead angle BS cancel and kill them

    ?????

    What is this?

    Anyways, BS fishing vs. ultra weapons in any way other than roll BS'ing them on reaction = dumb. You most likely just ran into a string of bad players, it happens.


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    Re: Slow Weapon? Go for a Backstab!

    Post by Sentiel on Thu Feb 21, 2013 6:44 am

    I'm sorry we didn't got to fight yesterday Tovlo. I was really looking forward to showing you that there are people that can play even without backstabs.
    :cry:

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    Re: Slow Weapon? Go for a Backstab!

    Post by EeAyEss on Thu Feb 21, 2013 11:25 am

    Happy 400th rep, Tolvo.


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    Re: Slow Weapon? Go for a Backstab!

    Post by Rynn on Thu Feb 21, 2013 11:29 am

    Tolvo wrote:It was like seeing a guy start to cast fire tempest with little dexterity at point blank with zero poise. Why would you do such a thing? Why wouldn't you use a corner, or hide the weapon. Why would you just upfront try something like that?
    I do this.
    I cast Tempest about 15 feet away from an opponent. If they react fast enough they can jump forward and hit me, but if they choke, then run forward, they eat hot tempest.
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    Re: Slow Weapon? Go for a Backstab!

    Post by Tolvo on Thu Feb 21, 2013 11:58 am

    I didn't say 15 feet, I said point blank. Zero room between you two.

    Even if they hesitate they'll still be able to interrupt you unless there is a serious connection issue.
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    Re: Slow Weapon? Go for a Backstab!

    Post by Rynn on Thu Feb 21, 2013 12:10 pm

    Tolvo wrote:I didn't say 15 feet, I said point blank. Zero room between you two.

    Even if they hesitate they'll still be able to interrupt you unless there is a serious connection issue.
    Ah, I've done that too, when someone was casting pursuers.
    We both 1shot each other.

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