Someone help me lower this to SL150?

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    Someone help me lower this to SL150?

    Post by Automancer on Sat Feb 16, 2013 4:56 pm

    http://mugenmonkey.com/darksouls/?c=225596786493787215

    It's supposed to be a pure caster build. I have close to no real experience with castings other than some pyros and sorceries. This build is mostly meant for gank hunting.

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    Re: Someone help me lower this to SL150?

    Post by ErrJon6661 on Sat Feb 16, 2013 5:17 pm

    Lowered your end and vit and changed the armor/rings a bit. More poise, less health, less stamina but more of a caster build.

    http://mmdks.com/15fb

    You'd have some better luck focusing on int or end and mixing pyro in. I'd recommend intelligence so you can focus on offence. That would look like this.
    http://mmdks.com/15fc


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    Re: Someone help me lower this to SL150?

    Post by Animaaal on Sat Feb 16, 2013 6:21 pm

    Start here: For tha Love of Castings

    Follow the links in that thread. You should be able to answer all of your questions reagrding pure casting.


    1) I'd seriously consider the value your putting on dexterity and casting speed. If using dexterity, I'd consider using a rapier or dagger for backstabs and making a build that focuses on castings, but is not a pure caster.

    2) Ditch WoG. You have enough power from everything else, you won't need it imo. Force will better serve you and free up soul levels.

    3) The 2 most important stats for a pure caster, imo, are vitality and endurance. You can't backstab, these two stats can help you compensate.

    4) Use the DWGR.

    5) Double up. The less total attunement slots you have to cycle through the better off you'll be.

    Read post #4 in this thread: Insanity Mage Build

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    Re: Someone help me lower this to SL150?

    Post by LunarFog on Sat Feb 16, 2013 6:21 pm

    http://mmdks.com/15fx

    Here you go. I looked at each of your stats and thought to myself "If I was some spoiled mage who needed to take full advantage of magic that requires zero skill to use, but still wanted the max amount of every stat because I'm just that spoiled, which ones would be the most important?"

    I decided that since you seemed to be a TOTAL magician sissy, faith and vitality were the least important. Sorceries will be your main damage dealer(I presume you'll be spamming dark bead and crystal souls spear asap), so the only use Faith has is for spamming WoG and support spells, so 30 will be all that you need. Having 50 in it was a complete waste.

    After that it was a choice between decreasing vitality and keeping ring of FaP, or decreasing endurance and switching to Havel's ring. If you switch to havels ring you end up with 150 more health. You lose out on a lot of stamina, but get to keep your quickroll and poise, and since you're a punk magician stamina is almost zero concern for you since it still recovers when you cast spells.

    You're welcome.


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    Re: Someone help me lower this to SL150?

    Post by Animaaal on Sat Feb 16, 2013 6:50 pm

    LunarFog wrote:...faith and vitality were the least important...

    This is not true. You might not need vitality against rookies, but a vet will backstab you at least once, especially if you are not wearing the DWGR.

    LunarFog wrote:...so the only use Faith has is for spamming WoG and support spells, so 30 will be all that you need. Having 50 in it was a complete waste...

    I agree, however I'd say again Force will serve you better. WoG is not needed for pure casters. Force is if you decide not to use some sort of shield.***edit***Yes I see you have a shield, I just mean Force can also be used as a shield with practice.

    LunarFog wrote:...and since you're a punk magician stamina is almost zero concern for you since it still recovers when you cast spells...

    Not true. You’ll need stamina more than you think. Creating space will be the only way to safely deter backstab fishers. It regens when you cast, but you’ll find yourself rolling, casting, rolling, casting…unless again, you’re fighting rookies.

    Also, endurance comes in handy if you decide to use poise along with the DWGR<---I'm tellin you.

    Lunar is trying to brainwash you, don’t listen…..its a trap. The Eye The Eye

    ***EDIT***

    Also, since you will not be buffing a weapon, I'd consider the Darkhand and using Strong Magic Shield.
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    Re: Someone help me lower this to SL150?

    Post by LunarFog on Sat Feb 16, 2013 7:23 pm

    What, am I trying to brainshwash a magician into being a different kind of magician? If I wanted to brainwash him I'd be converting him to being a pure melee user.

    A vet won't backstab you if you don't suck. Obviously, if you're going to try to use a soul spear when someone is side-stepping 2 feet away from you then yea, you deserve to be backstabbed. But you can counter backstabbers with WoG, Dark bead, combustion, force, Tranquil walk of peace. I assume this is why you have so much attunement: so you have a selection of far-range and CLOSE-range spells.

    WoG > Force. This issue isn't really that big a deal and you could use one or the other but you have to weigh the pros and cons of each.
    WoG: Farther range, does moderate damage
    Force: More castings.
    Using them as a shield should probably be avoided though, especially Force. Since it has such short range, some people could probably hit you and not get hit even if you time it perfectly. And if you use Force and it ends with both of you hitting each other, then wouldn't you much rather do damage in that situation?

    It's entirely true. Stamina isn't that useful, definitely not as useful as all the other stats and creating space isn't the only option you have against bs fishers. Even with 10 endurance a mage has more than enough stamina to fight effectively. You'd be able to roll 3 or 4 times and if you just wait for half a second you'd have enough stamina again to roll 2 more times. All you use stamina for is rolling or blocking. If stamina regain was so terrible that pure-mages needed the max amount to ever fight anything, then how would melee-users who have to roll, defend, and attack even EXIST?

    Darkwood grain ring is pretty bad. It gives you more invincibility frames for rolls, but how many times have you thought "Damn. If I was just invincible during that roll for a little while longer I wouldn't have gotten hit"? Besides, enjoy trying to replace Havel's ring with Darkwood ring and not having to get rid of even more endurance or vit.

    EDIT

    I would avoid switching crest shield to dark hand. It has less stability than the crest shield, melee attacks go through it like butter, and it has the same magic defense as the crest shield. You'd basically be trading functionality and usefulness for...nothing.


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    Re: Someone help me lower this to SL150?

    Post by Animaaal on Sat Feb 16, 2013 7:49 pm

    LunarFog wrote:...What, am I trying to brainshwash a magician into being a different kind of magician? If I wanted to brainwash him I'd be converting him to being a pure melee user...

    Yes. Conversion does not equal sabotage....beware, I see what she did there :suspect:

    LunarFog wrote:...A vet won't backstab you if you don't suck...

    Not true. Think about that bro, you have no pivot stabs....

    LunarFog wrote:...WoG > Force. This issue isn't really that big a deal and you could use one or the other but you have to weigh the pros and cons of each.
    WoG: Farther range, does moderate damage
    Force: More castings.
    Using them as a shield should probably be avoided though, especially Force. Since it has such short range, some people could probably hit you and not get hit even if you time it perfectly. And if you use Force and it ends with both of you hitting each other, then wouldn't you much rather do damage in that situation?.

    Very logical standpoint...I can't quite see the deception....UNLESS SHE'S TRYING TO TALK YOU INTO WOG!

    No seriously, she's right. The only time you would want to use those miracles as a shield is if you have no other option. However, the amount of difficulty stated I think is bit of an exaggeration. It just takes practice.

    Also, Force is nice to have to combo in to.
    LunarFog wrote:...It's entirely true. Stamina isn't that useful, definitely not as useful as all the other stats and creating space isn't the only option you have against bs fishers. Even with 10 endurance a mage has more than enough stamina to fight effectively. You'd be able to roll 3 or 4 times and if you just wait for half a second you'd have enough stamina again to roll 2 more times. All you use stamina for is rolling or blocking. If stamina regain was so terrible that pure-mages needed the max amount to ever fight anything, then how would melee-users who have to roll, defend, and attack even EXIST?...

    I disagree with everything said here. Make your build, fight against "fight clubbers" and you will too.

    LunarFog wrote:...Darkwood grain ring is pretty bad. It gives you more invincibility frames for rolls, but how many times have you thought "Damn. If I was just invincible during that roll for a little while longer I wouldn't have gotten hit"? Besides, enjoy trying to replace Havel's ring with Darkwood ring and not having to get rid of even more endurance or vit...

    Pretty bad is an exaggeration. You will find yourself asking that question a lot. Again dude, you have no backstabs and counter backstabs. You might think now that you'll be okay, but once you start attunement cycling in the heat of battle against someone who realizes you have no backstabs.......

    LunarFog wrote:...I would avoid switching crest shield to dark hand. It has less stability than the crest shield, melee attacks go through it like butter, and it has the same magic defense as the crest shield. You'd basically be trading functionality and usefulness for...nothing.

    The low stability is actually the advantage of the Darkhand. The “knockback effect” is vital for someone not having 36 or 76 poise. Nothing goes through it like butter. The damage split is 80/80/80/80. If you want to stand there and tank hits….then you should probably make a different build anyway.

    Also, SMS on a Darkhand = edge.

    @Lunar silly I'm jj about the sabotage stuff. happy
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    Re: Someone help me lower this to SL150?

    Post by LunarFog on Sat Feb 16, 2013 7:59 pm

    ...I'm doing it. I'm making my own magician.


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    Re: Someone help me lower this to SL150?

    Post by Animaaal on Sat Feb 16, 2013 8:17 pm

    LunarFog wrote:...I'm doing it. I'm making my own magician.




    Welcome Lunar.......welcome aha haha hahaha HAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!!!!!!!
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    Re: Someone help me lower this to SL150?

    Post by LunarFog on Sat Feb 16, 2013 8:21 pm

    Shut up. It's only so I can prove my point when I say that magic takes no skill and magicians are the dirtiest kinds of players in the game.

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    Re: Someone help me lower this to SL150?

    Post by Carphil on Sat Feb 16, 2013 8:27 pm

    LunarFog wrote:Shut up. It's only so I can prove my point when I say that magic takes no skill and magicians are the dirtiest kinds of players in the game.

    I thought it were the spear users :|


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    Re: Someone help me lower this to SL150?

    Post by ErrJon6661 on Sat Feb 16, 2013 8:35 pm

    Carphil wrote:
    LunarFog wrote:Shut up. It's only so I can prove my point when I say that magic takes no skill and magicians are the dirtiest kinds of players in the game.

    I thought it were the spear users :|

    i thought everybody hated the backstabbers. At least thats what my psn mail tells me.


    But for real this looks like its going to get out of hand. Every play style has its merits and its downfalls. Just because you don't like it doesn't mean its dirty or unfair.

    I can tell you right now that pure casters have just as hard of a time during pvp as any other build. My caster would often have to rely on ambush and quick thinking instead of button mashing, combo chaining or parry timing.


    And fyi, the dirties players are the ones who message you to rub it in your face afterwards.


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    Re: Someone help me lower this to SL150?

    Post by LunarFog on Sat Feb 16, 2013 8:38 pm

    Carphil wrote:
    LunarFog wrote:Shut up. It's only so I can prove my point when I say that magic takes no skill and magicians are the dirtiest kinds of players in the game.

    I thought it were the spear users :|

    No. Spear users are the master race.


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    Re: Someone help me lower this to SL150?

    Post by Animaaal on Sat Feb 16, 2013 9:26 pm

    LunarFog wrote:Shut up. It's only so I can prove my point when I say that magic takes no skill and magicians are the dirtiest kinds of players in the game.

    O'..... sad

    Try this:
    Animaaal wrote:
    Spoiler:
    How to be a Master Caster:
    1) Never wear: Elf Ears / CotDS / BDCR
    2) Make your castings your main weapon
    3) Win

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    Re: Someone help me lower this to SL150?

    Post by LunarFog on Sat Feb 16, 2013 9:33 pm

    Animaaal wrote:
    LunarFog wrote:Shut up. It's only so I can prove my point when I say that magic takes no skill and magicians are the dirtiest kinds of players in the game.

    O'..... sad

    Try this:
    Animaaal wrote:
    Spoiler:
    How to be a Master Caster:
    1) Never wear: Elf Ears / CotDS / BDCR
    2) Make your castings your main weapon
    3) Win

    Shaddap. I'll wear the elf ears if I want. And I have no idea what either of those other acronyms stand for.

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    Re: Someone help me lower this to SL150?

    Post by ErrJon6661 on Sat Feb 16, 2013 9:46 pm

    Its crown of the darksun and bellowing dragoncrest ring.


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    Re: Someone help me lower this to SL150?

    Post by LunarFog on Sat Feb 16, 2013 10:00 pm

    ErrJon6661 wrote:Its crown of the darksun and bellowing dragoncrest ring.
    HAHA. Yea right I'm not gonna use those if I make a magician.


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    Re: Someone help me lower this to SL150?

    Post by Animaaal on Sat Feb 16, 2013 10:30 pm

    LunarFog wrote:...Shaddap. I'll wear the elf ears if I want...

    Its okay. Crutches are necessary for the weak.
    Eventually young padawan, you'll heal and let the power flow through you.

    Embrace the :weap-enchanted:
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    Re: Someone help me lower this to SL150?

    Post by ChizFreak on Sat Feb 16, 2013 10:53 pm

    LunarFog wrote:
    Carphil wrote:
    LunarFog wrote:Shut up. It's only so I can prove my point when I say that magic takes no skill and magicians are the dirtiest kinds of players in the game.

    I thought it were the spear users :|

    No. Spear users are the master race.

    It's true... I'm the living example of it.

    Silver Knight Spear is best spear.


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    Re: Someone help me lower this to SL150?

    Post by WyrmHero on Sat Feb 16, 2013 11:47 pm

    I'd try this:

    http://mugenmonkey.com/darksouls/?c=182899427116176510

    50 Faith just for WoG seems like a waste if your build is a pure mage that will use pyro. WoG is your AoE and finish off so don't waste it. Close to 0 poise is the only way to keep high HP.


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    Re: Someone help me lower this to SL150?

    Post by WyrmHero on Sun Feb 17, 2013 12:44 am

    LunarFog wrote: so the only use Faith has is for spamming WoG and support spells, so 30 will be all that you need. Having 50 in it was a complete waste.

    LOL exactly my thoughts. big grin


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    Re: Someone help me lower this to SL150?

    Post by Animaaal on Sun Feb 17, 2013 1:32 am

    WyrmHero wrote:I'd try this:

    http://mugenmonkey.com/darksouls/?c=182899427116176510

    50 Faith just for WoG seems like a waste if your build is a pure mage that will use pyro. WoG is your AoE and finish off so don't waste it. Close to 0 poise is the only way to keep high HP.

    A few things to consider:

    -Keep Crest shield equipped instead of heater. Mages kill from a distance, I wouldn't give you the time to swap...I doubt anyone else will either.

    -Without a weapon, the catalyst is a waste in your left hand since you could be casting Strong Magic Shield, especially if you're gonna use Pursuers.

    -Dump WoG dude. Thats the way to increase your health.

    -Dump the dexterity. Another way to get the hp without the MoM.

    Try this: winner

    I dont use pursuers because its not needed. Everyone and their brother knows how to roll through it now. Its only real use is set up and distraction, HCSM serves this purpose just fine.

    Also, once you make this build...you will be asking yourself about the DWGR.<---wisdom.


    Last edited by Animaaal on Sun Feb 17, 2013 1:46 am; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : wording)
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    Re: Someone help me lower this to SL150?

    Post by WyrmHero on Sun Feb 17, 2013 1:39 am

    A lot of wrong? That breaks my heart animal, lol.

    You made another version, which works good as well. I made the build around a pyro/sorcery/faith caster, thus the 45 Dex. Your version is an optimized pure Int mage. You're right on Pursuers. winking


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    Re: Someone help me lower this to SL150?

    Post by Animaaal on Sun Feb 17, 2013 1:46 am

    WyrmHero wrote:A lot of wrong? That breaks my heart animal, lol.

    You made another version, which works good as well. I made the build around a pyro/sorcery/faith caster, thus the 45 Dex. Your version is an optimized pure Int mage. You're right on Pursuers. winking

    Oh, a lot was a poor choice of words...editing... silly


    To the op, Wyrm and Lunar both gave good advice and I can't actually say you'd go wrong with it.

    There are just a couple points you really need to keep in mind:

    1) You have no backstabs. How would you change your playstyle if someone told you that you cannot backstab....EVER???

    2) SMS is useable. It lasts 15 seconds so get use to it. Its purposes are so diverse I would rant explaining it. Just remember you CAN set it up. Pursuers/HCSM--->SMS=success.

    3) 3 castings for WoG...I thought and thought and thought and thought andhtougnadhtougandhtougnadnthtougnandndndiothtgnandnrio about it....its not necessary I swear. You have all the power you need man.

    4) The DWGR, i just...it just.....cycling your attunements will be your problem. Its the only thing that has given me victories when I clearly shouldn't have won.

    I'll quit blathering all in your thread now man.


    Last edited by Animaaal on Sun Feb 17, 2013 3:29 am; edited 1 time in total
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    Re: Someone help me lower this to SL150?

    Post by WyrmHero on Sun Feb 17, 2013 1:52 am

    WoG's usefulness has increase though because now it's harder to avoid (at least for me) due to fast roll's lower I frames. I would ditch the shield and put on a dagger/rapier for counter bsing. SMS so short it's just better to roll. I agree on DWGR perfect for mages.


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