Fighting games, what's most important?

    Share
    avatar
    Slarg232
    Insomniac
    Insomniac

    Posts : 1351
    Reputation : 51
    Join date : 2012-08-07
    Age : 26

    Fighting games, what's most important?

    Post by Slarg232 on Thu Feb 14, 2013 1:21 pm

    Hey all, making a fighting game, and I want to ask you what the most important aspects as to what you look for in the genre.

    Also, is it skill to have the ability to use the skills via harder inputs and tight controls, or is it skill to know WHEN to use abilities/moves? Which do you prefer?


    _________________


    avatar
    skarekrow13
    Chat Moderator

    Posts : 10236
    Reputation : 410
    Join date : 2012-01-27
    Location : Ralph Wilson Stadium

    Re: Fighting games, what's most important?

    Post by skarekrow13 on Thu Feb 14, 2013 1:28 pm

    I'd say a combination. My favorite of all time is the Tekken series (although the last few haven't really added to the allure any). They're like the Dark Souls of Fighting Games.

    All characters have basically the same concept: aka left and right punch and kick. This is also a logical button configuration with some added things thrown in (bumpers and triggers for combo presses).

    This adds accessibility. I just explained the whole mechanic for the entire series. Anyone can start with this and even button mashers can meet with some success reinforcing their desire to play more.

    The depth, which will make people come back for more, is that each fighting style leads to many many specific uses of that same mechanic. So while Brian might have a stronger right punch, it could be slower than say, Kunimitsu.

    To answer another of your questions, this game has both intricate button combos to pull of the best moves (King, Baek) there are also fighters where timing is much more important with easier button combos (Heihachi, Brian). Both require skill. Just different skill.

    avatar
    Mr. Tart
    Compulsory Poster
    Compulsory Poster

    Posts : 3748
    Reputation : 112
    Join date : 2012-09-14
    Age : 22
    Location : The Void.

    Re: Fighting games, what's most important?

    Post by Mr. Tart on Thu Feb 14, 2013 2:41 pm

    What's important in a fighting game is variety. If you're making a fighting game, make sure each and every character has unique moves and unique gameplay, while still keeping it balanced.

    As far as skill goes, i think both can surely be considered skillful, though being able to memorize a certain input seems less skillful than knowing when to use what skill and ability.


    _________________
    XBL Gamertag: xFingeR PaiNtx PSN ID: Mr_Tartington
    "I have returned. After an eternity away from you all, Jack of Blades is back!"
    avatar
    BIG TIME MASTER
    Insomniac
    Insomniac

    Posts : 1445
    Reputation : 77
    Join date : 2012-06-26
    Location : Junkyard Porto-John

    Re: Fighting games, what's most important?

    Post by BIG TIME MASTER on Thu Feb 14, 2013 3:20 pm

    When characters strike eachother, it needs to actually look like they are striking eachother, and not just poor hit detection covered up with a comic book "pow" or such. Every successful hit needs to register a reaction in the opponent. There has to be real consequence for poor move choice or reckless attacking.

    avatar
    RANT
    Tyler Durden
    Tyler Durden

    Posts : 7779
    Reputation : 268
    Join date : 2012-01-17
    Location : Winterfell

    Re: Fighting games, what's most important?

    Post by RANT on Thu Feb 14, 2013 3:59 pm

    dont make the easiest guy too powerful since mosst people is what theyre gonna use and nothing else, like the fat guys from tekken and street fighter, also phoenix in MvsC3. im probably in the minorit but i would make it a hard to pull of the combos, learning everything about your favorite character and mastering them after a while feel pretty awesome, kinda like vitua fighter.


    _________________
    Night gathers, and now my watch begins.
    I am the sword in the darkness, I am the watcher on the walls, I am the fire that burns against the cold, the light that brings the dawn, the horn that wakes the sleepers, the shield that guards the realm of men.
    I pledge my life and honor to the knight's watch for this night and all the nights to come.
    avatar
    Slarg232
    Insomniac
    Insomniac

    Posts : 1351
    Reputation : 51
    Join date : 2012-08-07
    Age : 26

    Re: Fighting games, what's most important?

    Post by Slarg232 on Thu Feb 14, 2013 4:40 pm

    Hmmm.... How many characters do you guys think is legit? 5 or 6?

    It's set in hell, and my two characters so far are Gregore the Butcher and Benedict the Malevalent. Gregore being more rushdown, and Benedict summoning units onto the feild for him to use.

    AND I REFUSE.... to go into the fighting game trope of impossibly hard boss. Mine will be more like a set peice you would expect to see in a 2d God of War.



    And Fatalities, though these will be less over the top MK and more WHAM! BAM! THANK YOU MA'AM!


    _________________


    avatar
    Mr. Tart
    Compulsory Poster
    Compulsory Poster

    Posts : 3748
    Reputation : 112
    Join date : 2012-09-14
    Age : 22
    Location : The Void.

    Re: Fighting games, what's most important?

    Post by Mr. Tart on Thu Feb 14, 2013 4:52 pm

    I assume it won't be a very big game? So i'd say 6, just so that no one will feel alone when they go to the prom.


    _________________
    XBL Gamertag: xFingeR PaiNtx PSN ID: Mr_Tartington
    "I have returned. After an eternity away from you all, Jack of Blades is back!"
    avatar
    Seignar
    Insomniac
    Insomniac

    Posts : 1206
    Reputation : 106
    Join date : 2012-08-07

    Re: Fighting games, what's most important?

    Post by Seignar on Thu Feb 14, 2013 5:05 pm

    Many things matter in Fighting games, like in all games; there is no most important thing. What you should focus in is to try make every character different in a variety of ways, it will appeal to other player's tastes. There is no absolutely no real point to make 2 same characters (or even with similar inputs) as it is only seen, in the long run, as wasted effort. There are quite a vast amount of ways to create unique characters amongst fighting games, just see Blazblue and their roster.

    A typical acceptable roster would be at least 5, but as long as there are interesting -and balanced- characters a roster could be unlimited, in theory (Because in reality, you have to eventually run out of ideas).

    If anything, you should make sure "easy to learn" characters are made, but don't be afraid to throw in the ones with steep learning curve as well.

    avatar
    Slarg232
    Insomniac
    Insomniac

    Posts : 1351
    Reputation : 51
    Join date : 2012-08-07
    Age : 26

    Re: Fighting games, what's most important?

    Post by Slarg232 on Thu Feb 14, 2013 6:26 pm

    Oh gah damnit, leave my account logged in while I go to class and a friend of my room mate hijacks it..... So glad this wasn't my Facebook....


    _________________


    avatar
    Sevans
    Casual
    Casual

    Posts : 73
    Reputation : 5
    Join date : 2012-12-27

    Re: Fighting games, what's most important?

    Post by Sevans on Thu Feb 14, 2013 6:40 pm

    Are you trying to sell this? Because if you are, you're going to want a lot more than five or six characters. You could swing that on the SNES, but people are going to want more now-a-days. And as other folks have mentioned, character variety goes a long way, but don't let that stop you from having characters who share concepts. It's really the subtle nuances that matter to competitive fighting game players.

    And to answer your original question: Sadly, there is no correct answer to that. They both matter, however. I've made some observations over the years.

    Simpler inputs will make more your games more accessible, but they will also lower the ceiling that your players are willing to reach because simple inputs create monotony and, for lack of a better term, they make the hands-on experience very boring. There are reasons why games like Marvel vs Capcom 2 and Guilty Gear have enjoyed a long-lasting fan base; One such reason being that the sky was the limit as far as execution goes. It kept folks interested and willing to learn, it's also incredibly rewarding. The downside to this being that it will potentially drive away the not-so-serious crowd and create a very steep entry barrier.

    Execution heavy fighting games also add a layer of depth in human error. With simplified inputs you don't really get to test the reactions of someone who was just dropped out of a combo on accident. Of course, that's only one example, but I think you get the idea.

    Knowing when to use moves is just as important as knowing how to perform them, but it may be best for someone developing a fighting game for the first time to focus on this. If every move is unpunishable or just overpowered, then your game will be watered down and nobody will enjoy it. It's this reason why I think that a few modern fighters have kind of fallen from grace compared to their predecessors. Think MvC3, there are a lot of moves in the game that can be performed without really thinking about "Is this the proper time to use the move?" with very little negative repercussion (doubly so because of the depth-killing idiocy that is X-Factor.) Again though, because of a simplification in both execution and decision making facets, the game has managed to become one of the most accessible and widely played fighters of all time.

    There is a ton more that can be said on this topic, but I try not to be too long winded. If you have any other questions please ask! Fighting games are kinda my thing and I could discuss them all day long.


    _________________
    PSN: SevansVII
    SL 100
    avatar
    RANT
    Tyler Durden
    Tyler Durden

    Posts : 7779
    Reputation : 268
    Join date : 2012-01-17
    Location : Winterfell

    Re: Fighting games, what's most important?

    Post by RANT on Thu Feb 14, 2013 7:31 pm

    Wait, so you're not actually making a fighting game? Lol


    _________________
    Night gathers, and now my watch begins.
    I am the sword in the darkness, I am the watcher on the walls, I am the fire that burns against the cold, the light that brings the dawn, the horn that wakes the sleepers, the shield that guards the realm of men.
    I pledge my life and honor to the knight's watch for this night and all the nights to come.
    avatar
    Slarg232
    Insomniac
    Insomniac

    Posts : 1351
    Reputation : 51
    Join date : 2012-08-07
    Age : 26

    Re: Fighting games, what's most important?

    Post by Slarg232 on Thu Feb 14, 2013 7:39 pm

    No, I'm not, but I'm sure he will see these since I'm now missing one of my sticky notes that had a character idea on it for my books....


    _________________


    avatar
    Emergence
    Sovereign
    Sovereign

    Posts : 4226
    Reputation : 579
    Join date : 2012-01-16
    Age : 103
    Location : Jupiter

    Re: Fighting games, what's most important?

    Post by Emergence on Thu Feb 14, 2013 7:45 pm

    Man that friend sucks. Wasted all these fine folk's brain power, and I was about to post myself since I'm looking through fightsticks at the moment.


    _________________
    This Forum is a bonfire.  Thank you all for kindling it.  

    Please help the community by joining both wikis and Fextralife!

    Forum Guidelines / Resource Guides / Dark Souls Wiki / Dark Souls 2 Wiki / Wiki Live Chat

    Fextralife / Wiki Twitch / Emergence Twitch / Wiki Fight Club / The Pantheon
    avatar
    Slarg232
    Insomniac
    Insomniac

    Posts : 1351
    Reputation : 51
    Join date : 2012-08-07
    Age : 26

    Re: Fighting games, what's most important?

    Post by Slarg232 on Thu Feb 14, 2013 8:27 pm

    Well, he's probably going to check back, and he DOES have an early build being started (I tried it), it's decent, even if I think it's execution is a bit off (Can't specify due to a promise) and he is taking in all the info he can.

    It won't be wasted, but he will NOT be replying (Unless he makes his own @#$% #%#$@#@ [email=%@#*&$]%@#*&$[/email]@@# account....


    _________________


    avatar
    Sevans
    Casual
    Casual

    Posts : 73
    Reputation : 5
    Join date : 2012-12-27

    Re: Fighting games, what's most important?

    Post by Sevans on Thu Feb 14, 2013 11:34 pm

    Emergence wrote:Man that friend sucks. Wasted all these fine folk's brain power, and I was about to post myself since I'm looking through fightsticks at the moment.

    This thread is now about fight sticks!


    _________________
    PSN: SevansVII
    SL 100
    avatar
    Slarg232
    Insomniac
    Insomniac

    Posts : 1351
    Reputation : 51
    Join date : 2012-08-07
    Age : 26

    Re: Fighting games, what's most important?

    Post by Slarg232 on Fri Feb 15, 2013 2:37 am

    I'm going to get rode out of the town on a rail, but I'm more of a fan of controllers over fight sticks. Though I never played in an arcade.


    _________________


    avatar
    Forum Pirate
    Chosen Undead
    Chosen Undead

    Posts : 6625
    Reputation : 232
    Join date : 2012-01-30
    Age : 26
    Location : International waters

    Re: Fighting games, what's most important?

    Post by Forum Pirate on Fri Feb 15, 2013 4:16 am

    I prefer simple commands, eg burst limit, dissedia, the non-ninja dead or alive characters, where the skill is in the timing. Chains are cool, but the juggleing for someones entire hp bar like in tekken or the gfb, cfw, gc combo in dark souls tends to be more frustrating than fun.
    This is just my opinion though.


    _________________
    Your rules are yours
    My honor is mine.
    Perspective is everything.
    We are Exiles, and our home is Painted with the blood of trespassers.
    avatar
    Slarg232
    Insomniac
    Insomniac

    Posts : 1351
    Reputation : 51
    Join date : 2012-08-07
    Age : 26

    Re: Fighting games, what's most important?

    Post by Slarg232 on Sun Feb 17, 2013 4:51 pm

    Hey all. It was a bit late what with valentines day and all, but I was able to set the Real Slarg232 up on a date with a friend of mine, a huge girl gamer that never gets out of her room. As repayment, he is allowing me to post here, in this topic.
    I have figured out what I want to do with it, another character, and I wanted your guy's opinion.

    Each fighter has ~4 moves; two that are heavily in sync with their role, and two that in any other fighting game would be considered overpowered for anyone in that role. For instance:
    Gregore the Butcher is a rushdown character that can press B F 2 to do a dashing upper cut with Armor, and press D F 1 to do a guard breaking overhead slash with his meat cleaver, both of which are incredibly fast and relatively safe. When the need arises though, he can pull out his skull shotgun and blast everything in a short cone in front of him by pressing D B F 4, and can even use a counter move that sets the opponent back 12 frames if they connect by using F D F B 4.
    This gives newbs the ability to pick up and play a character how they were meant, and it turns people who actually try to master one character into total terrors. It also makes each character more rounded with more personality, I feel.
    A character idea I had is an Angel, or an Incubus, I haven't decided yet. Either way, they start the battle as a normal person and as the weakest fighter in the game. Once their meter fills, they can use a move to gain increased speed, damage, and a tiny amount of Health Regen, and a set of wings. This move can be used three times, and by that time the character goes full Shao Khan. Is this a character you guys think would be cool?


    _________________



    Sponsored content

    Re: Fighting games, what's most important?

    Post by Sponsored content


      Current date/time is Sat Nov 25, 2017 8:14 am