Temperary stat enhancers

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    Do you think temperorary stat enhancers would be good or bad?

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    Samurainova
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    Temperary stat enhancers

    Post by Samurainova on Mon Jan 14, 2013 3:18 pm

    Hey guys, I was wondering, what would you guys think about temperary stat enhancers? Like something that would boost strength or dexterity for a short time, but with repurcussions, perhaps less stamina for a short time in exchange for plus 40 strength. Do you think this would be a good thing, or ruin pvp? How would it effect the game? Would it an entirely new level? Or makes things more complicated then necessary? Please tell me your thoughts below happy
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    Re: Temperary stat enhancers

    Post by Forum Pirate on Mon Jan 14, 2013 3:19 pm

    No. I hate consumable buffs.


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    Re: Temperary stat enhancers

    Post by Samurainova on Mon Jan 14, 2013 3:20 pm

    Forum Pirate wrote:No. I hate consumable buffs.

    Unfortunately people chug green grass like its a drug. Its literally the weed of Dark souls lol. Thanks for your opinion happy
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    Re: Temperary stat enhancers

    Post by Forum Pirate on Mon Jan 14, 2013 3:25 pm

    ^ thats why. Its a plauge in mmo's to. Either farm them (or the money to buy them) or get schooled by people who do because they have a really serious advantage. (obviously I'm exaggerating, but not much)


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    Re: Temperary stat enhancers

    Post by tinypantha on Mon Jan 14, 2013 4:45 pm

    mmos.... my childhood.

    Buffs with negatives? Yes.

    Weapon Buffs? Never should they return.

    Body Buffs? Negatives needed. ex grass drains health for a total of 600 dmg?


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    Re: Temperary stat enhancers

    Post by RANT on Mon Jan 14, 2013 4:49 pm

    nope, horrible idea. theres just no neeed for stuff like that.


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    Re: Temperary stat enhancers

    Post by LunarFog on Mon Jan 14, 2013 5:02 pm

    Temporary buffs? Oh, you mean like grass, poison resin, gold resin, black pine resin, Dark Moon blade, sunlight blade, Havel's greatshield's skill, iron flesh, power within, the Dragon covenant members roar, magic weapon, great magic weapon, magic shield, magic strong shield, magic barrier, and great magic barrier?

    And in some points of view you could also include things like Hush, Cast light, Hidden body, Hidden weapon, fall control, vow of silence, Bountiful sunlight, Karmic Justice, and replenishment as temporary buffs.


    The fact that you apparently didn't know about temporary buffs already being in the game is...upsetting.

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    Re: Temperary stat enhancers

    Post by Samurainova on Mon Jan 14, 2013 5:18 pm

    LunarFog wrote:Temporary buffs? Oh, you mean like grass, poison resin, gold resin, black pine resin, Dark Moon blade, sunlight blade, Havel's greatshield's skill, iron flesh, power within, the Dragon covenant members roar, magic weapon, great magic weapon, magic shield, magic strong shield, magic barrier, and great magic barrier?

    And in some points of view you could also include things like Hush, Cast light, Hidden body, Hidden weapon, fall control, vow of silence, Bountiful sunlight, Karmic Justice, and replenishment as temporary buffs.


    The fact that you apparently didn't know about temporary buffs already being in the game is...upsetting.

    I am refferring to consumables that directly effecy stats. Not just slap on damage to the outer layer.
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    Re: Temperary stat enhancers

    Post by skarekrow13 on Mon Jan 14, 2013 5:59 pm

    I see the difference you're stating Samurainova but I kinda agree with LunarFog on this one. They don't effect the stats directly but they end up with the same result. Particularly in Dark Souls the stat buff would be hard to pull off, and probably useless. For instance, take my Great Scythe wielder (SL 220s). Black Iron Armor and blood shield.

    Str buff: Already at 40 str. Increased str by ten or twenty and still almost zero return to anything

    Dex buff: Already at 45 dex. Increased dex to the point of diminished returns already and same boat as str buff. Negligible return using buff

    Int buff: Already at 40+ int. You get the idea. No significant return.

    Faith buff: You get the idea

    Resistance buff: Bloodshield does that better than stat investment/modification

    Attunement buff: There's rings for that and would require a fast bonfire visit to get the extra spell lined up.


    Conclusion: Buffs are for a very limited number of reasons which are already in the game in some manner.

    Reason 1: increased damage output (resins, lemon buff, power within, etc.)

    Reason 2: make me harder to kill (havel's shield, magic barriers, moss, etc.)

    Dark Souls already has plenty of examples of both main types or motivations to buff. Some are temporary like weapons. Some are (relatively) permanent like rings and shields.

    Buffing stats directly is highly dependent on having the item in hand that would benefit from the buff AND having that stat low enough to avoid dimished returns. So essentially, the only time a stat buff item would work is a low level player who would benefit either the same or more from the buffs already in game.

    The only practical use I can envision is to temporarily equip items you can't normally use. While I can see some value in this I don't see it making up for the increase in confusion and added items.

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    Re: Temperary stat enhancers

    Post by Samurainova on Mon Jan 14, 2013 6:33 pm

    skarekrow13 wrote:I see the difference you're stating Samurainova but I kinda agree with LunarFog on this one. They don't effect the stats directly but they end up with the same result. Particularly in Dark Souls the stat buff would be hard to pull off, and probably useless. For instance, take my Great Scythe wielder (SL 220s). Black Iron Armor and blood shield.

    Str buff: Already at 40 str. Increased str by ten or twenty and still almost zero return to anything

    Dex buff: Already at 45 dex. Increased dex to the point of diminished returns already and same boat as str buff. Negligible return using buff

    Int buff: Already at 40+ int. You get the idea. No significant return.

    Faith buff: You get the idea

    Resistance buff: Bloodshield does that better than stat investment/modification

    Attunement buff: There's rings for that and would require a fast bonfire visit to get the extra spell lined up.


    Conclusion: Buffs are for a very limited number of reasons which are already in the game in some manner.

    Reason 1: increased damage output (resins, lemon buff, power within, etc.)

    Reason 2: make me harder to kill (havel's shield, magic barriers, moss, etc.)

    Dark Souls already has plenty of examples of both main types or motivations to buff. Some are temporary like weapons. Some are (relatively) permanent like rings and shields.

    Buffing stats directly is highly dependent on having the item in hand that would benefit from the buff AND having that stat low enough to avoid dimished returns. So essentially, the only time a stat buff item would work is a low level player who would benefit either the same or more from the buffs already in game.

    The only practical use I can envision is to temporarily equip items you can't normally use. While I can see some value in this I don't see it making up for the increase in confusion and added items.

    Wow you pose very wll thought out points to backup your standpoint. Thank you for your opinion we all appreciate it happy
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    Re: Temperary stat enhancers

    Post by Peaceful Wollyhop on Mon Jan 14, 2013 6:35 pm

    I swear you've come to these forums just to ask everybody's opinions


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    Re: Temperary stat enhancers

    Post by Samurainova on Mon Jan 14, 2013 6:42 pm

    Peaceful Wollyhop wrote:I swear you've come to these forums just to ask everybody's opinions

    I enjoy what others have to say. Its who I am ^^
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    Re: Temperary stat enhancers

    Post by The Letter X on Mon Jan 14, 2013 6:48 pm

    I agree with no consumable buffs because of MMO's...

    I'm satisfied with grass.


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    Re: Temperary stat enhancers

    Post by Peaceful Wollyhop on Mon Jan 14, 2013 6:53 pm

    Samurainova wrote:
    Peaceful Wollyhop wrote:I swear you've come to these forums just to ask everybody's opinions

    I enjoy what others have to say. Its who I am ^^

    Kinda annoying though the amount of threads your posting
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    Re: Temperary stat enhancers

    Post by Jester's Tears on Mon Jan 14, 2013 6:54 pm

    Bad Idea.

    I don't really see the problem with Grass. The only think that you could Tweak with Buffs were WEAPON BUFFS. MAKE THEM SHORTER. Problem Solved.


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    Re: Temperary stat enhancers

    Post by Soris Ice Goldwing on Mon Jan 14, 2013 6:59 pm

    As much as I tend to hate the weapon buffs I really can't much for the grass. It's used so much in PvP I'm starting to think it's linked to the subconscious when fighting. Though I'm glad that there are not many buffs for stats here.


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    Re: Temperary stat enhancers

    Post by Onion Knight on Mon Jan 14, 2013 7:03 pm



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    Re: Temperary stat enhancers

    Post by The Letter X on Mon Jan 14, 2013 7:07 pm

    Onion Knight wrote:

    At least he asked for our opinions. Much better than saying we should have them.


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    Re: Temperary stat enhancers

    Post by barrywilkins on Mon Jan 14, 2013 7:07 pm

    I'd say that the way the buff system has been designed in this game was pretty good. Except for the fact that certain buffs just plain beat out the other ones.

    Iron Flesh: Makes frontal assaults a complete pain, but backstabs and ranged combat are your kryptonite.

    Flash Sweat: No real cons, but the pro doesn't outweigh anything else you could use. Fire damage still hurts you quite a bit and doesn't come up a lot in pvp past the 100 mark.

    Power within: Deal amazing damage at the cost of hurting yourself. When people see this, they know its easy to turtle until you die.

    Great magic barrier: long cast time, but makes you practically immune to mages.

    Tranquil walk of peace: slows enemy down to iron flesh levels, but you have to be in melee range to abuse this.

    Replenishment: The regens ok, but if you're getting hit enough to need it, it wont save you.

    Green blossom: quick to eat, gives almost infinite stamina, no cons to using it beyond the buff slot being taken up.

    Weapon buffs: Resins don't exactly add much to your attacks. It can definitely turn the tables if you really needed that extra 30 or so damage. Enchanted weapons make you practically a god for 60 seconds. Even if you survive the 60 seconds of close combat, its rather difficult to dodge every attack, and running might not be an option.

    Karmic Justice: Sounds great in theory, but is rather weak in pvp. It takes several hits in a row to even activate, which very likely will never happen.

    I kinda feel like most of the body buffs are just plain outclassed by the one everyone can use regardless of spec: Green Blossom. Even a heavy armor user can regen the stamina in far less time than a naked guy leading to a constant assault that the other player can really only counter by being able to do the same thing.
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    Re: Temperary stat enhancers

    Post by Samurainova on Mon Jan 14, 2013 7:14 pm

    Onion Knight wrote:

    Lol hilarious pic, and sorry you feel that way. ^^
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    Re: Temperary stat enhancers

    Post by WaffleGuy on Mon Jan 14, 2013 8:40 pm

    Samurainova wrote:
    Peaceful Wollyhop wrote:I swear you've come to these forums just to ask everybody's opinions

    I enjoy what others have to say. Its who I am ^^

    I might not always answer on topics, but I've got to admit I think most of your posts are fresh and interesting


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    Re: Temperary stat enhancers

    Post by Samurainova on Mon Jan 14, 2013 9:37 pm

    WaffleGuy wrote:
    Samurainova wrote:
    Peaceful Wollyhop wrote:I swear you've come to these forums just to ask everybody's opinions

    I enjoy what others have to say. Its who I am ^^

    I might not always answer on topics, but I've got to admit I think most of your posts are fresh and interesting

    You have no idea what that means to me. Thank you happy
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    Re: Temperary stat enhancers

    Post by ClassicBlaze on Mon Jan 14, 2013 11:25 pm

    I deeply dislike temporary buffs, because, well, they fade eventualy, and I hate relying on a clock timer, also they grant an clear advantage over others through mere little items or speels wich isnt a good thing imo, at least not in this game, so thats a no for you kind sir, sorry.


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    Re: Temperary stat enhancers

    Post by Samurainova on Tue Jan 15, 2013 12:44 am

    ClassicBlaze wrote:I deeply dislike temporary buffs, because, well, they fade eventualy, and I hate relying on a clock timer, also they grant an clear advantage over others through mere little items or speels wich isnt a good thing imo, at least not in this game, so thats a no for you kind sir, sorry.

    I accept your no, and appreciate your opinion deeply. thank you happy
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    Re: Temperary stat enhancers

    Post by Aznul on Wed Jan 16, 2013 3:34 am

    I think it has the potential to add complexity and depth to combat, but also the potential to be horribly abused. While it would be an interesting way to boost your damage without splitting damage types, it could also be very difficult to balance. Another thing to consider is whether or not you could use a weapon which you normally would be unable to use with them. Allowing this could allow a player to basically boost their soul level AFTER their opponent has already been chosen based on soul level, which would be rather unbalanced and unfair.

    Perhaps it would have to be in the form of an item that has a long cooldown. It could work, but I think a few limits would be necessary. It would need to be unable to boost stats above their maximum, for one. Also, it would have to be used BEFORE any attempt of invasion/summoning was attempted, and it should adjust the soul level of your character temporarily. If done this way, I believe that allowing it to make a player able to wield a weapon which they normally couldn't would be entirely acceptable. Since all or your bonus stats would be accounted for, it would be just like fighting someone of a higher soul level.

    This could help expand the flexibility of characters which are built to a certain level and kept there, since they could temporarily boost into a different level range and interact with different players as equals. Also, since it would have no way of allowing a player to lower their level, it would not negatively affect new players. It could actually help them by allowing them to experiment earlier and with more flexibility.

    But, I voted neutral as it could only be beneficial if done properly. Any glitch or mstake allowing for the abuse of such an ability or item could have catastrophic consequences on pvp.

    However, even this version could be abused in pve, so perhaps it should be a pvp only item, like a soapstone that treats you as a higher level and boosts your stats when you arrive. This way you wouldn't be able to just boost past anything that gave you the slightest trouble. So, it shouldn't be used by hosts. But if it is used only by phantoms and accounted for when selecting who you are matched with, I see no reason to have something that could last until you return to your world.


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