An Interesting Mechanic

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    An Interesting Mechanic

    Post by Infighter on Mon Jan 14, 2013 12:03 pm

    Stances.


    Yeah, you heard me right I want to see stances in DKS2. It may be limited to classes only (Knight, Templar, Royal etc,etc) Or there could be a special trainer.

    Stances would focus on weapon strengths, or weaknesses, and It would take few seconds to change from stance to original state. Lets see a balder sword it has a very good thrust attack, so it would use a stance where thrust damage is increased.Lets take a look at this picture

    http://th03.deviantart.net/fs70/200H/f/2011/353/c/c/inuyasha__battle_stance_by_xxchiharudawnxx-d25rord.jpg

    It's bit small, but I am sure you get the point, the stance attack would deal a lot of dmg, but of course this mechanic will be high risk high reward, It could be parry - able, and roll bs-able

    A GS sword users would be pleased with a stance where their attack speed could be increased, but stun lock ability removed. Oh and of course no shield in stance types.

    Now I really didn't think off how magic could be used in a stance, or how it would be fit to a controller, but still I am jealous of Balder Knight stance


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    Re: An Interesting Mechanic

    Post by Oh_the_Humanity on Mon Jan 14, 2013 1:28 pm

    I agree with you on switching stances. The Baulder knights actually do switch stances. I was surprised the first time I used it because I thought I was going to be able to switch stances just like the Baulder knights have been doing to me. It would really cool and add a variety to work with and add realism along with immersion to ones role plying. It would basically double your attacks and would be harder to read people attacks while pvp'ing.
    I really like the way The Witcher did this. They honestly did it perfectly, by making a stance that's better at defending mobs or multiple enemies, a stance that's for faster quick attacks and another for strong or heavy attacks.
    I'm not sure if its quite right for a souls game but is a cool mechanic nonetheless. Infighter said it could be limited to classes, now that's a good idea but IMO think by limiting it to certain weapons may add more immersion, because not all weapons act the same and it makes sense for some to have different stances and others to only have one. Like a great sword would only have one stance a rapier can have multiple stances based on its actual style. It would be nice for special/unique weapons that have the special R2 attack, having the special attack in a different stance means you wouldn't have to trade a special attack for a strong R2 attack. Maybe more weapons could have special R2 attacks if there was a way to switch stances. I dunno, what do you guys think?
    Any ideas for new unique weapons for Dark Souls 2?
    what are some crazy unique ways From can make some new weapons that fit along with actual weapons from all over history. I cant wait to see what they bring to the table. cheers



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    Re: An Interesting Mechanic

    Post by DE5PA1R on Mon Jan 14, 2013 2:16 pm

    Nice emote. I support this idea.

    If my opponent had to make it clear he was trying to parry me? + for large weapon users.


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    Re: An Interesting Mechanic

    Post by Infighter on Mon Jan 14, 2013 2:44 pm

    bump for more replies and opinions


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    Re: An Interesting Mechanic

    Post by AzureCrow on Mon Jan 14, 2013 4:26 pm

    I'd really like to see stance types with effects based on the weapon type but still with unique movesets.

    For instance all Ultra greatswords would have a "Heavy" stance in which the sword would be held behind the players back, it would increase stamina to block attacks and poise damage and have a slightly increased attack speed because the animation starts mid swing however it would cause increased stamina usage when the user blocks and a delay when 2h blocking with a weapon. Also the alternate moveset wouldn't be able to combo past a 2nd or 3rd hit and would suffer from longer recovery times to balance the faster swing ending in a recovery similar to a BKGS wind up after the 3rd swing of every combo to prevent stun locking.

    This could become a unique trait for each weapon type like piercing swords having a fencing stance where the weapon hand shoulder is closer to the opponent and the offhand shoulder is facing away similar to how fencers fight. This stance would increase weapon range and thrust damage and give a slight increase to critical blows but it would require a delay to switch stance back to parry and guard leaving the user open to punishment for reckless attacks.

    Things like a slashing stance for daggers that nearly double attack speed at the cost of losing more than half the poise break for each strike. Or quick draw stances for kattanas giving unmatched swing speed for one strong strike but forcing you to sheath your sword and become unable to block then forcing the stance switch back to normal after each quick draw. Even a guarding stance for main handing a shield that caused a passive 2h guard at the cost of reduced moment speed but allows seamless shield bashing and a special parry that pushes an opponent and staggers them instead of leaving them open for a riposte.

    Additions like these with straightforward but complex mechanics could push the souls games already marvelous combat to levels only seen in fighter games.
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    Re: An Interesting Mechanic

    Post by Oh_the_Humanity on Mon Jan 14, 2013 4:36 pm

    AzureCrow wrote:I'd really like to see stance types with effects based on the weapon type but still with unique movesets.

    For instance all Ultra greatswords would have a "Heavy" stance in which the sword would be held behind the players back, it would increase stamina to block attacks and poise damage and have a slightly increased attack speed because the animation starts mid swing however it would cause increased stamina usage when the user blocks and a delay when 2h blocking with a weapon. Also the alternate moveset wouldn't be able to combo past a 2nd or 3rd hit and would suffer from longer recovery times to balance the faster swing ending in a recovery similar to a BKGS wind up after the 3rd swing of every combo to prevent stun locking.

    This could become a unique trait for each weapon type like piercing swords having a fencing stance where the weapon hand shoulder is closer to the opponent and the offhand shoulder is facing away similar to how fencers fight. This stance would increase weapon range and thrust damage and give a slight increase to critical blows but it would require a delay to switch stance back to parry and guard leaving the user open to punishment for reckless attacks.

    Things like a slashing stance for daggers that nearly double attack speed at the cost of losing more than half the poise break for each strike. Or quick draw stances for kattanas giving unmatched swing speed for one strong strike but forcing you to sheath your sword and become unable to block then forcing the stance switch back to normal after each quick draw. Even a guarding stance for main handing a shield that caused a passive 2h guard at the cost of reduced moment speed but allows seamless shield bashing and a special parry that pushes an opponent and staggers them instead of leaving them open for a riposte.

    Additions like these with straightforward but complex mechanics could push the souls games already marvelous combat to levels only seen in fighter games.

    ^ This, Exactly!
    I really think this could open up an already amazing combat system to the greatest combat based fighting ever made. Which it already is IMO
    I'm really hoping to see something new to the combat that isn't gimmicky or already been done. That's the thing that excites me about From. They like to think outside the box and bring new game mechanics to the table and blow gamer's minds. example: gravelording (the coolest online interaction in any game)


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    Re: An Interesting Mechanic

    Post by Acarnatia on Mon Jan 14, 2013 4:53 pm

    Stances, while they can work, shouldn't increase damage. That will be too easy to take advantage of and can be really game breaking. Alternatively, using stances that just change the movesets, and perhaps decrease damage for a faster moveset or such, are less dangerous and more easily balanced.
    I think that stances, if implemented, should use what has been the two-hand button as a replacement of the standard two-hand mechanic. (with two-handing being a stance that ALL weapons come with)


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    Re: An Interesting Mechanic

    Post by Infighter on Mon Jan 14, 2013 6:06 pm

    Acarnatia wrote:Stances, while they can work, shouldn't increase damage. That will be too easy to take advantage of and can be really game breaking. Alternatively, using stances that just change the movesets, and perhaps decrease damage for a faster moveset or such, are less dangerous and more easily balanced.
    I think that stances, if implemented, should use what has been the two-hand button as a replacement of the standard two-hand mechanic. (with two-handing being a stance that ALL weapons come with)

    The disadvantage of stance whilst increasing attack would be : It would take few seconds to actually "activate" a stance 2nd It would drain a bigger amount of stamina each attack, I don't get point of mobility increase, unless we are talking about roll frames, stances should add a spicy flavor to game a more fast-paced or slow-paced if you are using defensive stance.


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    Re: An Interesting Mechanic

    Post by AzureCrow on Mon Jan 14, 2013 6:30 pm

    Oh_the_Humanity wrote:
    ^ This, Exactly!
    I really think this could open up an already amazing combat system to the greatest combat based fighting ever made. Which it already is IMO
    I'm really hoping to see something new to the combat that isn't gimmicky or already been done. That's the thing that excites me about From. They like to think outside the box and bring new game mechanics to the table and blow gamer's minds. example: gravelording (the coolest online interaction in any game)

    That's presicly where I was trying to go with it, I think if anyone can introduce rich combat into an rpg without getting overwhelmed by chains of static combos it'll be From. Praise the Sun


    Acarnatia wrote:Stances, while they can work, shouldn't increase damage. That will be too easy to take advantage of and can be really game breaking. Alternatively, using stances that just change the movesets, and perhaps decrease damage for a faster moveset or such, are less dangerous and more easily balanced.
    I think that stances, if implemented, should use what has been the two-hand button as a replacement of the standard two-hand mechanic. (with two-handing being a stance that ALL weapons come with)

    I agree with you 100% I tried to make an example where the stances would benefit the secondary attributes of a weapon like heavy weapons should be forced to fight all out but in return receive more push and "weight". Only smaller weapons that would focus on DPS would even have the opportunity to raise their DPS at all.

    I was trying to say piercing weapons would get a higher thrusting bonus not a flat damage boost, like more piercing through armor and raised counter bonuses essentially replacing the leo ring. Mind blip lol!
    Replacing the 2h mechanic for a more intricate dual stance mechanism makes a lot of sense and would balance out the bonuses and the forced animation for switching between stances could give the tactical delay on guarding and parrying I was looking for. Especially for weapons like ultra greatswords and rapiers which wouldn't be 1 handed or 2 handed respectively in the real world.
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    Re: An Interesting Mechanic

    Post by Forum Pirate on Mon Jan 14, 2013 6:35 pm

    Acarnatia wrote:Stances, while they can work, shouldn't increase damage. That will be too easy to take advantage of and can be really game breaking. Alternatively, using stances that just change the movesets, and perhaps decrease damage for a faster moveset or such, are less dangerous and more easily balanced.
    I think that stances, if implemented, should use what has been the two-hand button as a replacement of the standard two-hand mechanic. (with two-handing being a stance that ALL weapons come with)
    This.

    attack bonuses get way out of hand very quickly. A balder side sword can top 700 damage with the leo ring, and remember all the complaining people do because a hring bs could easily break 1300 hp?

    If it doesn't get out of hand like that though, its not worth it anymore. Why take a 10% ar bonus on a zweihander when you're twice as likely to get bsd for your trouble or you could have 20% more hp instead?

    Magic isn't used in the real world.


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    Re: An Interesting Mechanic

    Post by Infighter on Mon Jan 14, 2013 6:43 pm

    Now that I think of it, I forgot something about fist weapons.

    I think Fist weapons should get unique stance a brawler stance, that would entirely change move-set rroll would be replaced with duck/dash with same frames as fast roll but with slight slide action, also attack animation of Dragon Bone fist is meeeh I would like to see more combo attacks or chain attacks (links) for example R1 R1 Duck Uppercut and ofc R1 would not be like only right hand is striking but left one too.

    In order to use brawler stance : 1st you MUST wear light armor or you will be unable to duck/dodge 2nd Your both hands must be equipped with fist weapon archetype.

    I would love to see this


    a duck example http://www.boxing-4-fitness.com/images/defhookslip.jpg


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    Re: An Interesting Mechanic

    Post by Oh_the_Humanity on Mon Jan 14, 2013 8:14 pm

    Acarnatia wrote:Stances, while they can work, shouldn't increase damage. That will be too easy to take advantage of and can be really game breaking. Alternatively, using stances that just change the movesets, and perhaps decrease damage for a faster moveset or such, are less dangerous and more easily balanced.
    I think that stances, if implemented, should use what has been the two-hand button as a replacement of the standard two-hand mechanic. (with two-handing being a stance that ALL weapons come with)

    I definitively agree with you about stances not changing damage. I think it should just change the movesets. They should definitely not replace (Y) or (triangle). 2 handing is a huge part of what makes DkS so awesome, maybe holding (Y) could change the stance. I think that could work beautifully.
    Ducking could be cool as well. I could see that working if done right.


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    Re: An Interesting Mechanic

    Post by Acarnatia on Mon Jan 14, 2013 9:55 pm

    By replacing that, I meant that two-handing could just be one of the stances and that stances can be accessed by the two-handing button. Perhaps weapons can cycle through it's stances, like attuned spells. It can go like this; sheathed, 1-handed, alternate 1-handed stances (if any), 2-handed, alternate 2-handed stances, (if any) then back to sheathed.


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