Am I considered to be griefing?

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    Re: Am I considered to be griefing?

    Post by Hue on Fri Jan 11, 2013 8:57 pm

    Shindori wrote:
    ...what soul?
    Didn't know you were a ginger!

    But really, i think your only crime is being skilled in PvE and cutting Kalameet's tail at SL30
    I guess griefers are part of the game; but why would you do that over and over?


    Last edited by Hachouma on Fri Jan 11, 2013 9:06 pm; edited 3 times in total
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    Re: Am I considered to be griefing?

    Post by Soris Ice Goldwing on Fri Jan 11, 2013 9:00 pm

    Hachouma wrote:But really, i think your only crime is being skilled in PvE and cutting Kalameet's tail at SL30

    But guilty of using it on low levels who lack the defense against in a place not suited for PvP.


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    Re: Am I considered to be griefing?

    Post by aqueous12 on Fri Jan 11, 2013 9:14 pm

    Shindori wrote:
    ChizFreak wrote:
    Shindori wrote:THANK YOU!!
    Now see, if i was making them kill npcs or something like that, i'd understand. but i just go in, kill, get out.

    Yes it's griefing. Actually, that's exactly what griefing is, invading players while you gear that it's not commonly accesible by those of that level. Griefing stops at level 40 to me. Once you reach Anor Londo, everything goes as that's mid-game, when people should be ready to face everything (also there you have lighting weapons).

    It's like invading with an Ascended Pyromancy Hand +5 and spamming Great Combustion to level 5 players in the Burg, it's griefing.

    To me, this post just seems to be you looking for people to tell you that what you're doing it's not wrong, this tells me that a part of you feels something is wrong.

    Let me tell you, IMO it's griefing and it's wrong. Even if most people don't agree. You put your own rules, wanna grief? Okay do it, but don't fool yourself thinking it's not griefing.
    I guess it's because I see griefing different from others. I see griefing as going in with stuff you havent even worked for, then using it against other players. Like i said, aside from the sword, I got through the whole game, even sliced kalameet's tail off and only then did I begin to use the sword online, but otherwise I left it untouched. I got the armor and upgraded it myself, and all i do is kill. I dont cause problems like most griefers do. I can see how some would consider it griefing, but if I got through the game at this low level and earned my way through, why should I not enjoy the spoils of my adventures? I'll probably start invading in anor londo soon, but i can see how doing this in the sewers or blighttown might be considered griefing.

    The people that you are, yes, griefing could give less than a shiit about whether you worked for your gear or not. That has no bearing on whether something should be considered. It has to do with the effect you have on the person you attack.

    If you fight them on even ground and beat them, then even though they lost they probably had a fun challenge fighting you, so I don't consider that griefing. But if you instead go in there with way higher gear and destroy them in 2 seconds, then yes that is griefing. They stood no chance and now have to repeat part of the level.

    If you're so uber anyways, then why not fight them with level-appropriate gear?
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    Re: Am I considered to be griefing?

    Post by barrywilkins on Fri Jan 11, 2013 9:18 pm

    I highly doubt anyone down there is looking specifically for pvp. Maybe hoping to fight a darkwraith or two while they quest to break up the constant monster bashing, but not looking to pick fights. Pretty much, you are by a pretty reasonable definition: griefing. But you already knew this, you planned around this, you wanted to do it. So i'm not really seeing the issue with doing it. The wolf pack isn't going to target the healthy stag when they can just kill the newborn.
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    Re: Am I considered to be griefing?

    Post by Shindori on Fri Jan 11, 2013 9:36 pm

    aqueous12 wrote:
    Shindori wrote:
    ChizFreak wrote:
    Shindori wrote:THANK YOU!!
    Now see, if i was making them kill npcs or something like that, i'd understand. but i just go in, kill, get out.

    Yes it's griefing. Actually, that's exactly what griefing is, invading players while you gear that it's not commonly accesible by those of that level. Griefing stops at level 40 to me. Once you reach Anor Londo, everything goes as that's mid-game, when people should be ready to face everything (also there you have lighting weapons).

    It's like invading with an Ascended Pyromancy Hand +5 and spamming Great Combustion to level 5 players in the Burg, it's griefing.

    To me, this post just seems to be you looking for people to tell you that what you're doing it's not wrong, this tells me that a part of you feels something is wrong.

    Let me tell you, IMO it's griefing and it's wrong. Even if most people don't agree. You put your own rules, wanna grief? Okay do it, but don't fool yourself thinking it's not griefing.
    I guess it's because I see griefing different from others. I see griefing as going in with stuff you havent even worked for, then using it against other players. Like i said, aside from the sword, I got through the whole game, even sliced kalameet's tail off and only then did I begin to use the sword online, but otherwise I left it untouched. I got the armor and upgraded it myself, and all i do is kill. I dont cause problems like most griefers do. I can see how some would consider it griefing, but if I got through the game at this low level and earned my way through, why should I not enjoy the spoils of my adventures? I'll probably start invading in anor londo soon, but i can see how doing this in the sewers or blighttown might be considered griefing.

    The people that you are, yes, griefing could give less than a shiit about whether you worked for your gear or not. That has no bearing on whether something should be considered. It has to do with the effect you have on the person you attack.

    If you fight them on even ground and beat them, then even though they lost they probably had a fun challenge fighting you, so I don't consider that griefing. But if you instead go in there with way higher gear and destroy them in 2 seconds, then yes that is griefing. They stood no chance and now have to repeat part of the level.

    If you're so uber anyways, then why not fight them with level-appropriate gear?
    Lol.. even grounds.. Tell it to the kids with chaos scythes that take my health almost completely off.Trust me, there's not that many "Adventurers" down there. Hell, half the people led me to the little arena.


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    Re: Am I considered to be griefing?

    Post by Shindori on Fri Jan 11, 2013 9:37 pm

    barrywilkins wrote:I highly doubt anyone down there is looking specifically for pvp. Maybe hoping to fight a darkwraith or two while they quest to break up the constant monster bashing, but not looking to pick fights. Pretty much, you are by a pretty reasonable definition: griefing. But you already knew this, you planned around this, you wanted to do it. So i'm not really seeing the issue with doing it. The wolf pack isn't going to target the healthy stag when they can just kill the newborn.
    Well I dont do it to grieve, or planned on grieving. I just want a chance against the people who PVP in those areas, which i found a lot of, with gear better than mine, even.


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    Re: Am I considered to be griefing?

    Post by LunarFog on Fri Jan 11, 2013 10:04 pm

    Yep. I'd say you are. you should be ashamed of yourself silly

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    Re: Am I considered to be griefing?

    Post by reim0027 on Fri Jan 11, 2013 10:47 pm

    You are overpowered for a reasonable build in that area. What I try to do is have a fair build when I invade. But, I quickly eye the host and his phantoms up and take a SL guestimate. If they are OP, then out come OP weapons of my own.


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    Re: Am I considered to be griefing?

    Post by Shindori on Fri Jan 11, 2013 11:56 pm

    reim0027 wrote:You are overpowered for a reasonable build in that area. What I try to do is have a fair build when I invade. But, I quickly eye the host and his phantoms up and take a SL guestimate. If they are OP, then out come OP weapons of my own.
    I seem to be getting all the superop players x.x


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    Re: Am I considered to be griefing?

    Post by DoughGuy on Sat Jan 12, 2013 12:23 am

    Shindori wrote:THANK YOU!!
    Now see, if i was making them kill npcs or something like that, i'd understand. but i just go in, kill, get out.
    I stopped reading here. Obviously you never thought you were griefing you just wanted confirmation. Basically for grieifng use the common sense rule. Is the gear you are in OP for the level you are at? For you, yes. OGS is OP for the level you are at (shown clearly by you killing everyone in 2 hits) therefore you are probably griefing.


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    Re: Am I considered to be griefing?

    Post by WandererReece on Sat Jan 12, 2013 3:04 pm

    Shindori wrote:Lol.. even grounds.. Tell it to the kids with chaos scythes that take my health almost completely off.Trust me, there's not that many "Adventurers" down there. Hell, half the people led me to the little arena.

    Well I dont do it to grieve, or planned on grieving. I just want a chance against the people who PVP in those areas, which i found a lot of, with gear better than mine, even.

    I seem to be getting all the superop players x.x

    If what you say is true, then you are obviously not greifing. Your stuff would be similar to theirs, so you would be on an even playing field.

    If they still give you a hard time, then use RSS. They can't say you griefed because they saw your build ahead of time and chose to fight you.


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    Re: Am I considered to be griefing?

    Post by reim0027 on Sat Jan 12, 2013 4:12 pm

    DoughGuy wrote:Basically for grieifng use the common sense rule. Is the gear you are in OP for the level you are at? For you, yes. OGS is OP for the level you are at (shown clearly by you killing everyone in 2 hits) therefore you are probably griefing.
    That is especially obvious given you have to beat Anor Londo, then Sanctuary Garden and The Forest to even obtain that sword.


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    Re: Am I considered to be griefing?

    Post by Serious_Much on Sat Jan 12, 2013 4:42 pm

    Technically you're griefing. The general gist of what is meant is someone who purposefully invades with a character with overlevelled gear for that are, which you are.

    The fact of whether it is griefing is you should ask yourself; Can I one-shot/two shot someone with a katana? if you can then there's obviously something inherently wrong with that really.

    To be honest dunno why you'd invade with such OP gear.. it can't be fun to be able to roll up, tank their puny hits and kill them with a flick of the wrist..


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    Re: Am I considered to be griefing?

    Post by Shindori on Sat Jan 12, 2013 7:08 pm

    Serious_Much wrote:Technically you're griefing. The general gist of what is meant is someone who purposefully invades with a character with overlevelled gear for that are, which you are.

    The fact of whether it is griefing is you should ask yourself; Can I one-shot/two shot someone with a katana? if you can then there's obviously something inherently wrong with that really.

    To be honest dunno why you'd invade with such OP gear.. it can't be fun to be able to roll up, tank their puny hits and kill them with a flick of the wrist..
    That's the thing, though. No puny hits here. I die as fast as I kill because people have amazing gear. Most have either lightning or fire weapons, and not resined either. Legit gear.


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    Re: Am I considered to be griefing?

    Post by Sloth9230 on Sat Jan 12, 2013 7:17 pm

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    Re: Am I considered to be griefing?

    Post by reim0027 on Sat Jan 12, 2013 7:42 pm

    When I invaded at SL 6, I found that several phantoms were carrying elemental weapons. I just shrugged it off and continued with my legit build. I figure that's what PvP is for. Invading with a reasonably equipped build. Much more satisfying than going in with a way OP build.

    In fact, with my SL 6 build, I'm invading people with an average of 40 SL. The majority of them aren't over leveled. I'm using +10 weapons and base stats (lightning shotel and rapier if my opponent is obviously way above me). I've got 240 host kills all over Lordran. Most satisfying invasion build I've made.


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    Re: Am I considered to be griefing?

    Post by Tomhet on Sun Jan 13, 2013 1:48 am

    Yes, if you have OP gear then it's griefing, and if you are killing people with one or two hits, then your gear is definitely OP.

    Invading at low-levels with OP stuff is a really scummy practice if you ask me.
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    Re: Am I considered to be griefing?

    Post by Samurainova on Sun Jan 13, 2013 2:06 am

    Well, its kind of debateable. Most people at your level are newbies, and your coming in with fully upgraded gear and experience giving them hard time. But at the same time, your not really doing anything wrong since invasions are meant to be terrifying especially to new players. So i wouldnt say your a griefer but i dont know why youd want to give newbies such a hard time, you should be playing with people on your level instead of pwning new people with no experience. Does that make sense? :/

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    Re: Am I considered to be griefing?

    Post by Sloth9230 on Sun Jan 13, 2013 2:09 am

    Tomhet wrote:Yes, if you have OP gear then it's griefing, and if you are killing people with one or two hits, then your gear is definitely OP.

    Invading at low-levels with OP stuff is a really scummy practice if you ask me.

    I wouldn't say that just the OP gear is enough to make them a griefer. Darkmoons for instance invade down, but they don't get to choose who they invade.

    Also, I can 1-shot people at level 120 with TCC + Bellowing Dragoncrest + Crown of Dusk + Dark Bead. There are those that could argue that my gear is OP, and therefore that makes me a griefer. However, intent matters. Unless I'm doing it on purpose to piss people off, or ruin their day, I can't be a greifer. Even then, at level 120, the gear I'm using is reasonably available to everybody. There's probably other words you could use to describe me if I used such tactics, but griefer probably wouldn't be one of them. At least not in the way that this community uses the word.


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    Re: Am I considered to be griefing?

    Post by Carphil on Sun Jan 13, 2013 2:17 am

    When I used to invade at the depths, I used starting gear and drake sword +0, and some players even died in 3 hits!


    I stopped invading pre anor londo for one reason. Now that I'm better at PVP, no matter the gear I'm using, I can always wins against newbies. For me thats not fun. But everyone has a diferent opinion.

    Edit: Well said Sloth!


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    Re: Am I considered to be griefing?

    Post by reim0027 on Sun Jan 13, 2013 4:53 pm

    Sloth9230 wrote:
    Tomhet wrote:Yes, if you have OP gear then it's griefing, and if you are killing people with one or two hits, then your gear is definitely OP.

    Invading at low-levels with OP stuff is a really scummy practice if you ask me.

    I wouldn't say that just the OP gear is enough to make them a griefer. Darkmoons for instance invade down, but they don't get to choose who they invade.

    Also, I can 1-shot people at level 120 with TCC + Bellowing Dragoncrest + Crown of Dusk + Dark Bead. There are those that could argue that my gear is OP, and therefore that makes me a griefer. However, intent matters. Unless I'm doing it on purpose to piss people off, or ruin their day, I can't be a greifer. Even then, at level 120, the gear I'm using is reasonably available to everybody. There's probably other words you could use to describe me if I used such tactics, but griefer probably wouldn't be one of them. At least not in the way that this community uses the word.
    One shot builds are easy to make, but at that duelling SL, both opponents have the opportunity to make a powerful build. And, you are on even playing grounds.

    At low SL, that opportunity is not as easy. There is a larger disparity, and therefore more a sense of griefing.


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