The true essence of Dark Souls

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    LunarFog
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    The true essence of Dark Souls

    Post by LunarFog on Mon Jan 07, 2013 9:05 pm

    I got my inspiration for griefing back!



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    Re: The true essence of Dark Souls

    Post by Soris Ice Goldwing on Mon Jan 07, 2013 9:15 pm

    Not sure if thats a good thing...is it?


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    Re: The true essence of Dark Souls

    Post by LunarFog on Mon Jan 07, 2013 9:43 pm

    It's a very VERY good thing. I'm already starting to get fan mail again <3

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    Re: The true essence of Dark Souls

    Post by Shindori on Mon Jan 07, 2013 9:59 pm

    lol pretty entertaining. I dont see griefing as a bad thing. I mean... it's just a game, for crying out loud. If they mess up, it's their own damn fault for falling to our- I mean.. griefers' stupid tricks. >u>


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    Re: The true essence of Dark Souls

    Post by Soris Ice Goldwing on Mon Jan 07, 2013 10:04 pm

    heh Nice save there. Wonder what it is like to live in a hell those players minds?


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    Re: The true essence of Dark Souls

    Post by WhatDoesThePendantDo? on Mon Jan 07, 2013 10:23 pm

    I've seen that video (he also has a Greatbow griefing video as well, IIRC) before. It's harmless (and entertaining), IMO. Avelyn shots in the Blighttown swamp is kind of ******** but if you're dumb enough to attack Quelana to get to an invader, that's on you.

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    Re: The true essence of Dark Souls

    Post by Slarg232 on Mon Jan 07, 2013 10:30 pm

    I've actually talked to the guy who does those. He's a massive douchebag, very much a "I'm better than anyone else at the game" type.


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    Re: The true essence of Dark Souls

    Post by LunarFog on Mon Jan 07, 2013 10:32 pm

    Slarg232 wrote:I've actually talked to the guy who does those. He's a massive douchebag, very much a "I'm better than anyone else at the game" type.
    Eh. Gotta expect things like that. Although I'm a griefer I probably wouldn't like the company of other griefers at all. Those guys seem like pricks -3-

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    Re: The true essence of Dark Souls

    Post by Bloodpact91 on Mon Jan 07, 2013 11:49 pm

    Seriously , whats the point in doing these thing? You're just making somebody else life harder.. More than likely new players. I am probably going to be hated for having an opinion on the internet , but this is just a **** move...


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    Re: The true essence of Dark Souls

    Post by sparkly-twinkly-lizard on Tue Jan 08, 2013 12:06 am

    anonymity allows people to play out any sadistic tendencies they have, better in a game than irl, honestly only a very few people would behave this ****ishly irl. as for why anyone would want to do this i feel its a matter of needing control over others due to a lack of control in their own lives.


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    Re: The true essence of Dark Souls

    Post by Bloodpact91 on Tue Jan 08, 2013 12:07 am

    sparkly-twinkly-lizard wrote:anonymity allows people to play out any sadistic tendencies they have, better in a game than irl, honestly only a very few people would behave this ****ishly irl. as for why anyone would want to do this i feel its a matter of needing control over others due to a lack of control in their own lives.

    i see


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    Re: The true essence of Dark Souls

    Post by Soris Ice Goldwing on Tue Jan 08, 2013 12:12 am

    One person's suffering is another sadistic bliss, better in a game tha real life I say. And let's face it doing things like that bring one of two things: Much hate to the one doing it, or many new subcribers and likes on youtube.


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    Re: The true essence of Dark Souls

    Post by RANT on Tue Jan 08, 2013 12:15 am

    meh, griefing is too easy. thankfully most of the griefers are garbage(like the guy in the vid) and will not survive a good sunbro.


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    Re: The true essence of Dark Souls

    Post by Sloth9230 on Tue Jan 08, 2013 12:17 am

    I'm really trying to understand the mentality of a griefer, so help me out here. You went out and bought Dark Souls, you clearly liked it since you're still playing it, and now you've decided that other people aren't allowed to enjoy the game as much as you did? Why? What do you get out of ruining the game for others?

    And getting new players to kill NPC's is just low. The'ye stupid for falling for it, but you're just trash if you set the situation up in the first place. I hope everyone you invade just disconnects on you, if you do those kinds of things.


    Last edited by Sloth9230 on Tue Jan 08, 2013 5:07 pm; edited 1 time in total


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    Re: The true essence of Dark Souls

    Post by Bioraptor on Tue Jan 08, 2013 2:26 pm

    Sloth9230 wrote:

    I hope everyone you invade just disconnects on you, if you do those kinds of thing.
    +1


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    Re: The true essence of Dark Souls

    Post by PlasticandRage on Tue Jan 08, 2013 2:31 pm

    I actually kind of love players like this. If not for them there'd be no reason for me to have low level toons with high level gear. There's nothing quite like baiting griefers into real fights.


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    Re: The true essence of Dark Souls

    Post by Sloth9230 on Tue Jan 08, 2013 3:47 pm

    PlasticandRage wrote:I actually kind of love players like this. If not for them there'd be no reason for me to have low level toons with high level gear. There's nothing quite like baiting griefers into real fights.

    I'm not sure how I feel about anti-griefers. yes, it's good to have them around in case a greifer invades you. However, from A PVE standpoint, they're just as Op and make the game significantly easier. If the game is too easy then the host isn't really getting the true Souls Series experience.


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    Re: The true essence of Dark Souls

    Post by PlasticandRage on Tue Jan 08, 2013 3:54 pm

    I don't generally use the WSS when I'm anti-griefing. I guess sometimes I do when I get bored. Most of time I just hang out human in high griefer traffic areas and wait to be invaded.

    But also, under that rational, you'd be saying that being griefed is the "true souls experience," which I don't fully agree with. Being invaded by skilled players, when you're inexperienced is certainly part of what I'd consider the intended experience, but just watch the video man. That's not what that guy was doing.

    I'd also argue that part of what I'd consider "the true souls experience," is making your own choices regarding your behavior. The game provides you with tools, and you make the decision of how you want to use them. If that mean's people are going to grief, than so be it, but it also means if I choose that I want to hunt griefers, than so be it.


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    Re: The true essence of Dark Souls

    Post by Sloth9230 on Tue Jan 08, 2013 4:25 pm

    No, I'm saying new players should be able to play with and against other new players, without having to worry about people who enjoy ruining their game.
    Essentially I'm saying that anti-griefers shouldn't be necessary, because Griefers(Just the ones with OP gear, and the ones who get you to kill NPCs) shouldn't exist in the first place. How do you differentiate griefers from people who just found the Cracked Red Eye Orbs and would like to see how PVP workd? Kill one of those guys and you just wasted one their humanities and orbs. New players have the same right to PVP as the more experienced ones, and certainly more rights than griefers. There isn't exactly anything that can be done about elemental weapons, they're supposed to be for people who would otherwise not do decent damage with there current stats.

    People already do get choose how they behave. They're called invasions, not friendly duel stone. The general idea being that you're not welcome in the first place. However using OP gear on new players is taking what has been given to you, and exploiting it. What are the Devs supposed to do, add separate stat requirements for elemental weapons? That defeats their original purpose.

    I Played Demon Souls from the beginning, I don't recall griefers having ever been a problem back then. To me that was the true Souls Series experience. Struggling to survive, but being able to find someone willing to lend a helping hand when we needed it. Along with the occasional invader to make sure the game didn't become to easy. That's what I want, for new players to have that same experience.


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    Re: The true essence of Dark Souls

    Post by PlasticandRage on Tue Jan 08, 2013 4:31 pm

    I agree that griefing is generally bad, but it seems like you're saying anti-griefer's are equally as bad for being invaded by new players and fighting back? I don't agree with that at all. If someone invades then, by the nature of invasions, they don't know what exactly they'll be getting themselves into. If you choose to invade I think generally you accept that fact, and then live with the possible consequences. If you can't deal with the possibility of invading a more powerful player, than don't invade. It's as simple as that. Sometimes I'm not even in these places with more powerful toons for the purpose of anti-griefing. Sometimes I'm there to try to duel, because they're high traffic areas for that also, but because the cracked red eye orbs invade up, I'm still sometimes invaded by new players. Are you saying that shouldn't be permitted either?


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    Re: The true essence of Dark Souls

    Post by Slarg232 on Tue Jan 08, 2013 4:36 pm

    This is Dark Soul.net. You have no rights. Play Nice.


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    Re: The true essence of Dark Souls

    Post by aceluby on Tue Jan 08, 2013 4:49 pm

    Sloth9230 wrote:No, I'm saying new players should be able to play with and against other new players, without having to worry about people who enjoy ruining their game.
    Essentially I'm saying that anti-griefers shouldn't be necessary, because Griefers(Just the ones with OP gear, and the ones who get you to kill NPCs) shouldn't exist in the first place. How do you differentiate griefers from people who just found the Cracked Red Eye Orbs and would like to see how PVP workd? Kill one of those guys and you just wasted one their humanities and orbs. New players have the same right to PVP as the more experienced ones, and certainly more rights than griefers. There isn't exactly anything that can be done about elemental weapons, they're supposed to be for people who would otherwise not do decent damage with there current stats.

    People already do get choose how they behave. They're called invasions, not friendly duel stone. The general idea being that you're not welcome in the first place. However using OP gear on new players is taking what has been given to you, and exploiting it. What are the Devs supposed to do, add separate stat requirements for elemental weapons? That defeats their original purpose.

    I Played Demon Souls from the beginning, I don't recall griefers having ever been a problem back then. To me that was the true Souls Series experience. Struggling to survive, but being able to find someone willing to lend a helping hand when we needed it. Along with the occasional invader to make sure the game didn't become to easy. That's what I want, for new players to have that same experience.

    Of course there was griefing in Demon's Souls, it just wasn't low level griefing, it was on NG+. Tons of people just invaded 1-1 hoping to invade someone w/ a ton of souls to lose, typically w/ maxed out gear. Plus there's no summoning until after 1-1 IIRC.

    I played through all of Demon's Souls hollowed w/ half health because I learned early on that it was a better trade off to stay hollow through the level and then revive to human before the boss if necessary. I did this because I was consistently getting worked by people who had been playing much longer than me. So I adapted.

    The game is all about learning the pros and cons of each choice and deciding if the pros outweigh the cons. In the case of new players, they should learn that they can be human, summon, and be invaded; or they can be hollow and take on the level solo. It's the users choice, not the griefer's. I don't see anything really wrong w/ any of these videos, in fact, I feel this is the true souls experience since the user 'should' learn something from it.


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    Re: The true essence of Dark Souls

    Post by Sloth9230 on Tue Jan 08, 2013 4:56 pm

    PlasticandRage wrote:I agree that griefing is generally bad, but it seems like you're saying anti-griefer's are equally as bad for being invaded by new players and fighting back? I don't agree with that at all. If someone invades then, by the nature of invasions, they don't know what exactly they'll be getting themselves into. If you choose to invade I think generally you accept that fact, and then live with the possible consequences. If you can't deal with the possibility of invading a more powerful player, than don't invade. It's as simple as that. Sometimes I'm not even in these places with more powerful toons for the purpose of anti-griefing. Sometimes I'm there to try to duel, because they're high traffic areas for that also, but because the cracked red eye orbs invade up, I'm still sometimes invaded by new players. Are you saying that shouldn't be permitted either?

    I'm saying that without griefers, your job as an anti-griefer wouldn't exist either. You have ability to go anywhere with you're OP gear, New Players are limited by what they've encountered so far. That list doesn't extend to lightning weapons(spear being the obvious exception if your in Sens,), or boss weapons, any of Logans crystal sorceries, or Dark sorceries. They CAN get an Enchateded/Magic+5/Divine weapon+5 or Fire/Chaos weapon, but it wouldn't exactly be your average new player if they did have the fire weapons now would it?

    If you get invaded in Anor Londo by guy with the Drake Sword, then it sucks to be that guy. That's what he gets for not being prepared. If you get invaded by that same guy in the Burg/Parish, there ain't exactly much he could have done to prepare.

    aceluby: Except that by saying that, your saying that new players don't have the right to PVP. They do, they paid for the same game you did.

    I'm talikng about low level griefers, I got invaded plenty times in 1-1 on NG+. People who try to get you to kill NPC's, suck regardless experience level. Just disconnect on those losers, if they want to be cheap like that(Though getting Gankers to kill Shiva is extremely satisfying. Hey they're gankers, they have no rights.)


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    Re: The true essence of Dark Souls

    Post by PlasticandRage on Tue Jan 08, 2013 5:32 pm

    Yes, again I agree, without griefer's there'd be no need. But there are griefers. I'm not going to not go to those areas in case someone who isn't a griefer invades. When someone invades me and attacks, I fight back. You can't honestly tell me that you don't do the same.


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    Re: The true essence of Dark Souls

    Post by Sloth9230 on Tue Jan 08, 2013 5:40 pm

    I have never gone around with gear that couldn't reasonably be attained at that level, it's too much of a hasel to sequence break just so I can have an advantage in a low level fight. But, yes of course I fight back. Read my entry in the Inbox of a Darkwrith thread if you want to see just how unprepared I can be for invasions silly



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