Are bonfires returning?

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    Acarnatia
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    Re: Are bonfires returning?

    Post by Acarnatia on Thu Jan 10, 2013 1:11 am

    DE5PA1R wrote:Archetypes? Hero's journey? Nobody brought that up.

    It is by definition difficult to make a sequel to a stand-alone story. This difficulty is compounded if the conclusion is open-ended, and compounded exponentially if you plan on franchising. True for everything. Literally. Every. Thing.

    Yeah, actually, you did.

    DE5PA1R wrote:
    Gyonimizotetsu wrote:But Elder Scrolls will never be as hard, dark, soul crushing, or depressing as Dark Souls. They're two separate types of video games, in my opinion. Yeah, they're RPG's, but they're just too different to compare.

    No. In fact, they're easy to compare. A narrative is a narrative; there are certain universal truths for telling a story.

    Those 'universal truths' are archetypes. (they are also known as tropes) We also don't know that Dark Souls 2 is going to be a direct sequel. The events can definitely occur in a manner that leaves the original open as long as it doesn't touch upon the original too much. We do know that it's in a different land, with a different protagonist (I think it will be some other random girl/guy) and about different events.

    Star Wars Episode 4 was made as a stand-alone. Then Lucas made episodes 5 and 6. In terms of making a sequel and then a trilogy from an original stand-alone, that was done well and done without infringing upon the original. The same thing can be done in video games, especially in this case since Dark Souls doesn't even involve the same places, characters or events.




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    Re: Are bonfires returning?

    Post by hey its andres on Thu Jan 10, 2013 1:23 am

    It is a sequel at least chronologically. It occurs in a different part of the world. I'm not seeing how that's Elder Scroll's model. Sequels like that have been done for years way before video games even existed. Anyways, it can be assumed that DkS II is a spiritual sequel not a spiritual successor. In regards to DkS being similar to Elder Scrolls in terms of narrative simply put they are not. In DkS you are one of many undead. Your story is of no significance, and all you know about your character is that you were sent to the Asylum at some point. Even then the plot of Dark Souls is about the world and the characters that inhabit it. In Skyrim you are the Dragonborn and very quickly the world starts to revolve around you and your actions. The story of Skyrim is your story and the characters you interact with. Just because they are both narrative does not mean they are similar. The Bible is a narrative and so is The Stranger and the two could not be more different.


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    Re: Are bonfires returning?

    Post by Serious_Much on Thu Jan 10, 2013 7:40 am

    Can I just say as the guy who made the initial comparison, I simply observed souls may be using elders scrolls method for building a whole world by having games in the same world, but changing the area and time allows them to build up a huge and immersive lore and background to the series.

    Obviously it's been done by many series before, but TES is the obvious comparison. I had no intention of implying siilarity between games, just that they may be considering using similar narrative methods as a way to try and help establish the series.


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    Re: Are bonfires returning?

    Post by Gyonimizotetsu on Thu Jan 10, 2013 10:39 am

    GUYS GUYS GUYS I AM NOT A LITERAL PERSON I WAS JUST SAYIN' MAN

    You guys are talking about confusing stuff for just one Dark Souls > Elder Scrolls comment. Bleh.


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    Re: Are bonfires returning?

    Post by Gyonimizotetsu on Thu Jan 10, 2013 10:41 am

    DE5PA1R wrote:
    Gyonimizotetsu wrote:But Elder Scrolls will never be as hard, dark, soul crushing, or depressing as Dark Souls. They're two separate types of video games, in my opinion. Yeah, they're RPG's, but they're just too different to compare.

    No. In fact, they're easy to compare. A narrative is a narrative; there are certain universal truths for telling a story.
    And you, I said IN MY OPINION. To me, they're just different. I never had trouble in Elder Scrolls ever, but I have trouble in Dark Souls in certain places even though I played it for a year.


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    Re: Are bonfires returning?

    Post by DE5PA1R on Thu Jan 10, 2013 12:22 pm

    Acarnatia wrote:

    Those 'universal truths' are archetypes. (they are also known as tropes) We also don't know that Dark Souls 2 is going to be a direct sequel. The events can definitely occur in a manner that leaves the original open as long as it doesn't touch upon the original too much. We do know that it's in a different land, with a different protagonist (I think it will be some other random girl/guy) and about different events.

    Star Wars Episode 4 was made as a stand-alone. Then Lucas made episodes 5 and 6. In terms of making a sequel and then a trilogy from an original stand-alone, that was done well and done without infringing upon the original. The same thing can be done in video games, especially in this case since Dark Souls doesn't even involve the same places, characters or events.



    tldr. It's been pointed out by other users, but you should change your font to something other than red on black if you want me to read what you've written. I did catch the drift of the first sentence - something about tropes and archetypes. Again, nobody brought those up.

    A trope is a narrative tool used by a writer/developer to efficiently communicate a plot to a reader/player.

    An archetype is a type of trope.

    The fact that developing a sequel to a stand-alone story with an open ending is difficult has nothing to do with narrative or delivery. It has to do with the definitions of 'stand-alone story' and 'open ending.'
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    Re: Are bonfires returning?

    Post by Serious_Much on Thu Jan 10, 2013 1:38 pm

    I agree despair, i've actually stopped reading his posts now, it's just too much effort to read it with that font.

    It's the kinda **** on the chat box you can ask people to change.. i mean i don't understand why he gets away with it here really, what's wrong with white? Not like his posts are so important they need to stand out or anything..


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    Re: Are bonfires returning?

    Post by hey its andres on Thu Jan 10, 2013 1:58 pm

    Please make your posts a little more readable, heck even dark red would be better.

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