An idea for STR weapons...

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    Seignar
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    An idea for STR weapons...

    Post by Seignar on Wed Jan 02, 2013 10:54 pm

    Imagine this:

    A random invading player comes in a with an elemental greataxe and you block it with your shield, stand your ground and even poke with your spear.
    You win, then another random invading player with a non-elemental greataxe comes in and does the same attack and you block with the same shield, but...this time your stamina nearly depleted from max and you got sent flying as if you got hit with that bulldozer-sized axe of the Taurus Demon :0

    What was the difference? Player A had 20 STR; Player B, 50.

    So my proposition, I shall explain in detail:

    There will be a hidden stat called "Knockback effect". The stat can vary from weapon to weapon, but its value is greater for heavier and STR oriented weapons, as well as the STR stat. The stat itself affects 3 factors:

    - The amount of poise damage it inflicts
    - The amount of stamina drains it consumes upon being blocked
    - The amount of knockback it deals when connecting a hit.

    The amount of scaling this stat gets from STR depends on the weapon. Perhaps it scales with a E with DEX weapons like scimitars or katanas; A, with axes and maces; S, with greataxes.

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    Re: An idea for STR weapons...

    Post by Sloth9230 on Wed Jan 02, 2013 11:04 pm

    As long as it's not the first hit, poise damage on strength weapons would be kind of pointless if every hit just sent them flying. If it's the 2nd or 3d hit then it would be fine, it would help prevent infinite stunlocking too.
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    Re: An idea for STR weapons...

    Post by Forum Pirate on Wed Jan 02, 2013 11:09 pm

    I like stunlocking, but thats a decent idea. I don't have a specific reason it wouldn't work. I would only apply the huge knockback to specific weapons or moves though, to keep things fresh.


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    Re: An idea for STR weapons...

    Post by steveswede on Wed Jan 02, 2013 11:35 pm

    Ya know it would be better if knock back was just related to you strength stat investment, like how spell casting speed is related to dex investment. Adding something like greater stamina drain conflicts with improving the stability of shields. Just keep the application of perks simple.
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    Re: An idea for STR weapons...

    Post by FruitPunchNinja on Wed Jan 02, 2013 11:51 pm

    I really just think they need to bring back hyper armor, and i doubt they will but i would love to see a return of some Sharp/Crushing/Qaulity type ugrade paths(Crushing Knight Sword silly). I like the idea of poise, but i think it could be improved a bit more. Overall Demon's Souls had a very good balance between STR and DEX, both were very good. In Dark Souls legit STR builds are difficult to play as compared to DEX, unless you just fish for backstabs. Even then i would say it is still more difficult.
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    Re: An idea for STR weapons...

    Post by Serious_Much on Thu Jan 03, 2013 12:01 am

    I think poise is good being set to weapon classes, it works well and it gives the guys who like to spend more time making builds than playing with 'em some fun numbers to think about.

    The ideas for extra stamina reduction and knockback is a great idea, but i think it should be kept relative to the original power of the weapon, a subtle difference like dexterity does to casting time. On larger weapons, the effect is more pronounced than smaller ones, but the effect is always present.

    Decent idea, i'd like to see strength weapons get something to even it up, they seem a bit unlucky when you can get 700 AR balder swords using buffs that 2-3 shot people.


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    Re: An idea for STR weapons...

    Post by YourBigSpoon on Thu Jan 03, 2013 12:30 am

    I would like to see strength builds have more of an equal PVP presence. The good thing is they will have dedicated servers so combat should be smoother.

    The ability to knock back foes should be limited to certain weights or weapons. They could add a shield with knockback resistance but not 100 percent. I'd like to be able to sent foes off a ledge with a great axe or great club if they block, but at the same time I hate getting knocked off the ledge by the Iron Golem. That is assuming they won't dodge and stand their ground.
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    Re: An idea for STR weapons...

    Post by Serious_Much on Thu Jan 03, 2013 12:40 am

    I hate the way everyone welcomes the servers when its gonna quash pretty much all the coop scene, let alone wreck EU online play for the most part.

    Anywayss i agree str weapons get the crap end of the stick, and really making the attacks really pummel your opponent even when blocking would and could make a good difference.

    I'd suggest perhaps too a damage threshold on shields too? If a weapon is above the AR that the shield can take, regardless of stability you will take damage. However as the amount leaked through (if properly balanced) will not be much, only 50-15 AR at most, the damage will not be overawing. I think this idea would give an interesting twist on shield selection too, with the AR threshold combined with stability and defenses adding to the potential for shield diversity.


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    Re: An idea for STR weapons...

    Post by Sloth9230 on Thu Jan 03, 2013 12:41 am

    They should also return greatsword swing speeds to the way they were, and simply lower how much poise damage they do by a little.


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    Re: An idea for STR weapons...

    Post by raecor14 on Thu Jan 03, 2013 12:48 am

    while i like the idea of hidden stat effects this may be going to far.


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    Re: An idea for STR weapons...

    Post by Sloth9230 on Thu Jan 03, 2013 12:52 am

    It wouldn't really be "hidden" though. Wog doesn't knock you down if you have enough poise, but it still stuns you. Just apply that to weapons instead. Just have separate meters for stun and knockback, like bleed.

    You'd only be able to touch your opponents knockback resist meter if you have already broken through their poise. That way your first hit wouldn't send someone with 0 poise flying.


    Last edited by Sloth9230 on Thu Jan 03, 2013 1:09 am; edited 4 times in total


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    Re: An idea for STR weapons...

    Post by steveswede on Thu Jan 03, 2013 12:53 am

    Serious_Much wrote:I hate the way everyone welcomes the servers when its gonna quash pretty much all the coop scene, let alone wreck EU online play for the most part.

    Yeah people don't realize that the activity will be nothing compared to what we have now and us lot from Europe will have a very quiet experience. Because of this I will be getting the US release. Also let's not forget that they could shut them down whenever they want. Imagine still being able to link up on DkS but not DkS2. All of this for the sake of lag.
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    Re: An idea for STR weapons...

    Post by Serious_Much on Thu Jan 03, 2013 1:07 am

    how could you get the US release to work? arent games region locked anymore?

    yeah, i think massively slimming everyone's online play abundance to solve what most of the time is manageable lag is a bit ridiculous, but oh well it's only pvp getting .000001 of a second better correction thats important not having a steady stream of fights and plenty of coop signs.


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    Re: An idea for STR weapons...

    Post by Sloth9230 on Thu Jan 03, 2013 1:11 am

    Serious_Much wrote:how could you get the US release to work? arent games region locked anymore?

    yeah, i think massively slimming everyone's online play abundance to solve what most of the time is manageable lag is a bit ridiculous, but oh well it's only pvp getting .000001 of a second better correction thats important not having a steady stream of fights and plenty of coop signs.

    I hate not being able to play with my friends whenever I want to though. And most summon/invasion attempts tend to be failures.


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    Re: An idea for STR weapons...

    Post by steveswede on Thu Jan 03, 2013 1:20 am

    Serious_Much wrote:how could you get the US release to work? arent games region locked anymore?

    PS3 isn't region locked. I have both the Atlus and Bandai Namco versions of Demon's Souls and I can use both of them with no issue.
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    Re: An idea for STR weapons...

    Post by Serious_Much on Thu Jan 03, 2013 1:43 am

    interesting... though i gotta say i might have to go with EU version as by then any nocturnal time i have will have to be spent studying or sleeping :|


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    Re: An idea for STR weapons...

    Post by steveswede on Thu Jan 03, 2013 1:54 am

    Serious_Much wrote:interesting... though i gotta say i might have to go with EU version as by then any nocturnal time i have will have to be spent studying or sleeping :|

    Honestly that's not an issue, if anything America's quiet time is like Europe's prime time.
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    Re: An idea for STR weapons...

    Post by Serious_Much on Thu Jan 03, 2013 2:02 am

    ummm, im kinda confused by that comment.. i was saying i wouldn't be able to use american version very well as i couldn't play it when people would most likely be playing.. which i think is what youre saying? :confused:


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    Re: An idea for STR weapons...

    Post by steveswede on Thu Jan 03, 2013 2:15 am

    Serious_Much wrote:ummm, im kinda confused by that comment.. i was saying i wouldn't be able to use american version very well as i couldn't play it when people would most likely be playing.. which i think is what youre saying? :confused:

    I'm pointing out that when Europe is at it's most busiest online, it would be about the same size as the American player base in their quiet hours. Not only that but if it is true that we will be separated by region, I bet alot of European souls fans will get the US version due to size of the American player base which will make the Euro servers even more of a ghost town.

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