Am I the only one not concerened

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    Fry1156
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    Am I the only one not concerened

    Post by Fry1156 on Tue Dec 18, 2012 7:30 pm

    I've seen the trailer and while it may not have blown me away, I didn't think that it was that bad.
    With all the talk of a new director, it being made easier and more accessible I'm going to wait till I see in game action before I make any judgments.
    I could be proved completely wrong, but on the plus side if they do make a mess of it that's a few hundred hours of my life saved. Bow

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    Re: Am I the only one not concerened

    Post by bosslugger on Tue Dec 18, 2012 7:49 pm

    how dare you come in here spouting common sense?!?! BE OFF WITH YOU!! lol

    All kidding aside, I have no idea what to expect, so until I see gameplay footage, I'll have to reserve judgement.
    Weather elements sounds rad though. Even though they're totally separate games, I loved how weather and time cycles (day/night) was handled in Skyrim, really beautiful.
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    Re: Am I the only one not concerened

    Post by Forum Pirate on Tue Dec 18, 2012 7:53 pm

    I'm very concerned. The words accessibility and change were used. Improve and refine are good words change is not.

    BTW to judge it before its out would be foolish


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    Re: Am I the only one not concerened

    Post by Fry1156 on Tue Dec 18, 2012 7:58 pm

    I'd not heard about the weather elements, rolling round in the mud or snow and it having an effect on how fast you roll or how much stamina it takes would add something different.

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    Re: Am I the only one not concerened

    Post by bosslugger on Tue Dec 18, 2012 8:00 pm

    Fry1156 wrote:I'd not heard about the weather elements, rolling round in the mud or snow and it having an effect on how fast you roll or how much stamina it takes would add something different.

    It's not confirmed, the EDGE article said the team was investigating it, but it'd be great to work it in. The storm the hero fights the masked assassins in looks badass.
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    Re: Am I the only one not concerened

    Post by MasterofShadows on Tue Dec 18, 2012 8:09 pm

    Forum Pirate wrote:I'm very concerned. The words accessibility and change were used. Improve and refine are good words change is not.
    Accessibility is a great word. Change is neutral until you know exactly what is changed and how.

    Forum Pirate wrote:BTW to judge it before its out would be foolish

    Which is exactly what many from the naysayer group have a strong habit of doing as of late.


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    Re: Am I the only one not concerened

    Post by Deathsitexxi on Tue Dec 18, 2012 8:17 pm

    I'm concerned but not in a way where I'm thinking it will be the destruction of the series lol. I just hope they use the good framework that was left to them and not try to entirely recreate the wheel =). However, it does seem that many folks are one extreme or the other. The one thing that I'd say is concerning has been a shift in the DS community. We all know our community is known as being one of the best, and lately I've seen a lot of... well …aggression is a nice way of putting it lol.


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    Re: Am I the only one not concerened

    Post by steveswede on Tue Dec 18, 2012 8:24 pm

    MasterofShadows wrote:Accessibility is a great word.

    In the gaming world that means casual which means dumb down.

    It funny when publishers use accessibility for promoting a new game because it sounds like they're catering for all people, in truth they're actually make it inaccessible to people who want a none hand holding game. My brain actually shuts off to a lot of them because I don't have to use it with games telling me everything up front.
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    Re: Am I the only one not concerened

    Post by Forum Pirate on Tue Dec 18, 2012 8:27 pm

    No its really not a great word. "Accessability" killed ninja gaiden and Resident evil and deadspace and mass effect and dragon age, its working on tes and the list goes on. That word often reduces every affected game in any genre to mindless action games.

    I like mindless action games, but I don't like that its all anybody ever makes to capitalise on the casual crowds.

    Change when used in this industry often means the removal of core mechanics and the introduction of different core mechanics. (like the narrative story bs) frequently with the goal of aiding, accessibility.

    Refinement or polish is the term used to indicate a simple bettering of the core mechanics, maybe the addition of a few new ones.

    I track developers continually, I'm just relaying the patterns I noticed.


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    Re: Am I the only one not concerened

    Post by callipygias on Tue Dec 18, 2012 8:32 pm

    The only thing that concerns me is how I'm going to manage the wait.


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    Re: Am I the only one not concerened

    Post by MasterofShadows on Tue Dec 18, 2012 9:48 pm

    Excessive use of QTEs and a complete departure from the original formula killed Ninja Gaiden.

    The elimination and the survival-horror element and over-emphasis on action killed RE.

    Elimination of Strategy and tactics, and instead and emphasis on button-mashing, as well as the decision to focus most of the game's content into a single location is what killed Dragon Age.

    The elimination of strategy, tactics, and any type of challenge is the reason that TES is boring (for me). I prefer Dark Souls over Skyrim, because I actually have more fun. There is more thinking involved, and there is much more risk. Skyrim is WAY too easy for me.

    Didn't play the first Mass Effect 1, only 2 and 3, so I'll leave that to you. I only played one of the Dead Space games.

    Accessibility and polish are two different things, and are both good for games. Unfortunately, the word accessibility gets misused a lot, which is the reason many people associate it with "dumbing down". However, its a very positive term, especially if applied correctly.


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    Re: Am I the only one not concerened

    Post by Forum Pirate on Tue Dec 18, 2012 10:04 pm

    No its not. The dumbing down and departure from good formulas, that was accessibility at work.

    Its not bad in everything, for example saints row is accessable, but the goal was never deep challenging gameplay like in RE or giaden or a detailed and immursive story or world like in TES. The point was mayhem and ludacres fun.

    Accessability, especially in a niche game like dark souls/RE/giaden is the attempt to get them out of the niche. They're niche games for a reason, leaving the niche means abandoning most or all of why the core fans (whos support made the game possible btw) liked it in the first place.


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    Re: Am I the only one not concerened

    Post by ARSP on Tue Dec 18, 2012 10:08 pm

    It make economic sense to make it more accessible so that more players cna play it. This will make the people at from more money but the difficulty is part of the charm of Dark souls hopefully there is someway other than some ridiculous challenge to increase the difficulty


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    Re: Am I the only one not concerened

    Post by ComaPrison on Tue Dec 18, 2012 10:12 pm

    ARSP wrote:It make economic sense to make it more accessible so that more players cna play it. This will make the people at from more money but the difficulty is part of the charm of Dark souls hopefully there is someway other than some ridiculous challenge to increase the difficulty

    Get used to the idea that the core fan base of DeS and DaS are nothing more than a stepping stone on the way to expanding the fan base to include the casual gamer. We've served our purpose, and they're now going to kick us to the curb in order to cater to the tastes of casuals. Prepare for save/load function, difficulty slider, quest journal, map, and quest compass.
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    Re: Am I the only one not concerened

    Post by MasterofShadows on Tue Dec 18, 2012 10:18 pm

    Forum Pirate wrote:No its not. The dumbing down and departure from good formulas, that was accessibility at work.

    Its not bad in everything, for example saints row is accessable, but the goal was never deep challenging gameplay like in RE or giaden or a detailed and immursive story or world like in TES. The point was mayhem and ludacres fun.

    Accessability, especially in a niche game like dark souls/RE/giaden is the attempt to get them out of the niche. They're niche games for a reason, leaving the niche means abandoning most or all of why the core fans (whos support made the game possible btw) liked it in the first place.

    We are going to have to agree to disagree on this one. I subscribe to the official/traditional meaning of the word. I apologize on behalf of those who have misused it so much that you and others apply such a negative stigma to it.


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    Re: Am I the only one not concerened

    Post by ComaPrison on Tue Dec 18, 2012 10:22 pm

    MasterofShadows wrote:
    Forum Pirate wrote:No its not. The dumbing down and departure from good formulas, that was accessibility at work.

    Its not bad in everything, for example saints row is accessable, but the goal was never deep challenging gameplay like in RE or giaden or a detailed and immursive story or world like in TES. The point was mayhem and ludacres fun.

    Accessability, especially in a niche game like dark souls/RE/giaden is the attempt to get them out of the niche. They're niche games for a reason, leaving the niche means abandoning most or all of why the core fans (whos support made the game possible btw) liked it in the first place.

    We are going to have to agree to disagree on this one. I subscribe to the official/traditional meaning of the word. I apologize on behalf of those who have misused it so much that you and others apply such a negative stigma to it.

    Prepare to be extremely disappointed when the game comes out. I, on the other hand, will already be expecting the game to be absolutely casualized. And if it turns out to be a genuine sequel honoring all the core values of Dark Souls, then I'll be pleasantly surprised! You, and others like you, however, will have nowhere to go but down.

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    Re: Am I the only one not concerened

    Post by callipygias on Tue Dec 18, 2012 10:28 pm

    ComaPrison wrote: Prepare for save/load function, difficulty slider, quest journal, map, and quest compass.
    Haha, not a chance in hell.

    Facts is facts, and the last time they tried to increase their fan base was with the PC release of Dark Souls. The new content they added for that release is some of the most difficult and most fun of the entire game. And no map, no easy mode, no save function was added.

    I can understand why people are afraid their game will change for the worse, but I think the DLC is the only factual indicator we have of what's to come. I don't even trust interview translations much, personally.


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    Re: Am I the only one not concerened

    Post by carlucio on Tue Dec 18, 2012 10:55 pm

    Wider audience means worse games, always.

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    Re: Am I the only one not concerened

    Post by callipygias on Tue Dec 18, 2012 10:57 pm

    Dark Souls expanded to include Xbox.


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    Re: Am I the only one not concerened

    Post by Forum Pirate on Tue Dec 18, 2012 11:02 pm

    Accessible : easy to communicate or deal with

    This are websters definitions btw

    Niche : a specialized market.

    Specialised : designed, trained, or fitted for one particular purpose or occupation.

    Thus unless the purpose is accessibility, niche things will not be welcoming or easy to deal with. Accessability detracts from the specialisation here and the specialisation is what makes the games so great.

    Counter point cappy, FFXIII. The expansion to the xbox (new fans) was hugely limiting and detrimental to the experience because of those limits. (linear, even for a FF game, dissapointingly little character development, 2d magic in an otherwise gorgeous game [seriously, wtf])


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    Re: Am I the only one not concerened

    Post by ComaPrison on Tue Dec 18, 2012 11:23 pm

    Exactly. By definition, Namco's desired changes will water down Dark Souls 2 until it's a cheap piece of sh that will appeal to the average dumb moron that can't even wipe their own a-hole.

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