New, Bigger, Faster, Better, Louder, Darker, Scarier, Awesomer

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    New, Bigger, Faster, Better, Louder, Darker, Scarier, Awesomer

    Post by BIG TIME MASTER on Sat Dec 15, 2012 11:39 am

    I'm going to keep this direct and skip all the reasoning. If you agree with me you'll already understand, if not, state your opinion.

    I don't see any need or advantage to make the sequel "new, exciting, and different". I'd prefer DKSII to be refined, polished, and have new environments, gear, and enemies that fall within the same governing parameters as DKS.


    Discuss, but please, try to keep stupid comments to a minimum!

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    Re: New, Bigger, Faster, Better, Louder, Darker, Scarier, Awesomer

    Post by Strigoi on Sat Dec 15, 2012 11:45 am

    Agreed.
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    Re: New, Bigger, Faster, Better, Louder, Darker, Scarier, Awesomer

    Post by Juutas on Sat Dec 15, 2012 11:56 am

    Yeah, well...I'm hyped as f*ck for the Dark Souls II...I just can't help but be happy~


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    Re: New, Bigger, Faster, Better, Louder, Darker, Scarier, Awesomer

    Post by The Letter X on Sat Dec 15, 2012 12:04 pm

    I don't care if the pace or feeling of the game is changed. As long as it's a quality Souls game I'll be content.


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    Re: New, Bigger, Faster, Better, Louder, Darker, Scarier, Awesomer

    Post by RedderAI on Sat Dec 15, 2012 12:37 pm

    I'm thinking it will be much darker this time around. I'm excited as hell for this game.
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    Re: New, Bigger, Faster, Better, Louder, Darker, Scarier, Awesomer

    Post by BIG TIME MASTER on Sat Dec 15, 2012 1:00 pm

    RedderAI wrote:I'm thinking it will be much darker this time around. I'm excited as hell for this game.

    What do you mean "darker"?

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    Re: New, Bigger, Faster, Better, Louder, Darker, Scarier, Awesomer

    Post by RedderAI on Sat Dec 15, 2012 1:31 pm

    BIG TIME MASTER wrote:
    RedderAI wrote:I'm thinking it will be much darker this time around. I'm excited as hell for this game.

    What do you mean "darker"?

    Based off of the trailer, concept art, and the article leads me to think that dks2 will be just that. Darker. More death in the designs of environments. Take Demons Souls for example. The concept and level design was just far more gruesome. Tower of latria, valley of defilement, bolataria has corpses every where. The atmospher of demo souls was far "darker" than darks souls. I'm thinking they are going to go back to the more "darker" atmosphere.
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    Re: New, Bigger, Faster, Better, Louder, Darker, Scarier, Awesomer

    Post by GrinTwist on Sat Dec 15, 2012 1:41 pm

    I'm just hoping for a few more original places this time. Just because whenever I walk into Blighttown I just think of the Valley of Defilement.

    I wouldn't mind a darker atmosphere, but I don't think the game would need 10 dead bodies in every room that we walk into. Possibly just a soundtrack that has a darker feel to it and maybe have enemies have more of a disgusting design to them.


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    Re: New, Bigger, Faster, Better, Louder, Darker, Scarier, Awesomer

    Post by carlucio on Sat Dec 15, 2012 1:46 pm

    I Agree, i wanted Dark souls II to improve upon Dark souls, but it's clear that they will dumb down the game just for sales.
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    Re: New, Bigger, Faster, Better, Louder, Darker, Scarier, Awesomer

    Post by BIG TIME MASTER on Sat Dec 15, 2012 1:52 pm

    RedderAI wrote:
    BIG TIME MASTER wrote:
    RedderAI wrote:I'm thinking it will be much darker this time around. I'm excited as hell for this game.

    What do you mean "darker"?

    Based off of the trailer, concept art, and the article leads me to think that dks2 will be just that. Darker. More death in the designs of environments. Take Demons Souls for example. The concept and level design was just far more gruesome. Tower of latria, valley of defilement, bolataria has corpses every where. The atmospher of demo souls was far "darker" than darks souls. I'm thinking they are going to go back to the more "darker" atmosphere.

    So, darker means more focus on death and decay?

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    Re: New, Bigger, Faster, Better, Louder, Darker, Scarier, Awesomer

    Post by GrinTwist on Sat Dec 15, 2012 2:00 pm

    BIG TIME MASTER wrote:
    RedderAI wrote:
    BIG TIME MASTER wrote:
    RedderAI wrote:I'm thinking it will be much darker this time around. I'm excited as hell for this game.

    What do you mean "darker"?

    Based off of the trailer, concept art, and the article leads me to think that dks2 will be just that. Darker. More death in the designs of environments. Take Demons Souls for example. The concept and level design was just far more gruesome. Tower of latria, valley of defilement, bolataria has corpses every where. The atmospher of demo souls was far "darker" than darks souls. I'm thinking they are going to go back to the more "darker" atmosphere.

    So, darker means more focus on death and decay?


    I wouldn't think those would be the only things that would be focused on and to be honest those two subjects should always be downplayed in a game. If they aren't and they go over the top with "death" it would seem like a little kid designed the level and it would probably only make it laughable in the eyes of someone that knows something about atmosphere.

    There are also the feelings of loneliness, constant depression, bitterness, desperation, claustrophobia, and anxiety that can be achieved if the atmosphere is done right. Some of these things can be achieved just through good voice actors (which the souls series has had), a darker soundtrack, and then lighting effects. Dead bodies don't always work with atmosphere if they are sprawled all over the level.


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    Re: New, Bigger, Faster, Better, Louder, Darker, Scarier, Awesomer

    Post by carlucio on Sat Dec 15, 2012 2:04 pm

    Can i post scans of Edge in this forum?
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    Re: New, Bigger, Faster, Better, Louder, Darker, Scarier, Awesomer

    Post by Acarnatia on Sat Dec 15, 2012 2:06 pm

    Someone already has in another thread.


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    Re: New, Bigger, Faster, Better, Louder, Darker, Scarier, Awesomer

    Post by Juutas on Sat Dec 15, 2012 2:07 pm

    carlucio wrote:Can i post scans of Edge in this forum?

    You can but it has already been done once...better scans would be nice though.


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    Re: New, Bigger, Faster, Better, Louder, Darker, Scarier, Awesomer

    Post by Buggy Virus on Sat Dec 15, 2012 2:10 pm

    Just putting a ton of polish on the system they already have would easily make DkS II my favorite game, but that's not saying much as Dark Souls is my favorite game.


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    Re: New, Bigger, Faster, Better, Louder, Darker, Scarier, Awesomer

    Post by BIG TIME MASTER on Sat Dec 15, 2012 2:17 pm

    AT GRIN TWIST-


    Ah, that's a good answer.

    I get it. But, let me throw something at you. I started playing an older action rpg game called Dantes Inferno (based on the old poems) that takes place in hell (duh). The environment design, sound, and whole shebang is so overwhelming intense that I have been finding it hard to want to finish the game, even though it's really pretty fun. When I do play it I can only go for like an hour or two before I have to get some fresh air.

    Now, DKS is a pretty gloomy atmosphere, but its balanced out with certain areas (the sunlight Altar, anor londo, the views from the undead burg) and with certain characters, and bonfires and the like. It never becomes overwhelming because its all balanced out. Dantes Inferno never gives you any respite.

    So, with that in mind, if DKSII has to be "darker", because sequels always have to push the envelope, I hope that it still maintains it balance of dark/light, despair/hope, frustration/exaltation.

    Also, when I was in Afghanistan (don't ask me any more about it), one thing that struck me was that the country is really beautiful. Sweeping mountain ridges, lush valleys, glorious sunrises and sunsets. The fact that there is a war going on there adds something to the beauty, and I think that that is the same reason why fighting through areas like the Parish and Anor Londo have a certain charm to them. The whole time I'm in Blightown, the Depths, or the Tomb of the Giants, I'm just thinking "I need to get the hell out of here!"

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    Re: New, Bigger, Faster, Better, Louder, Darker, Scarier, Awesomer

    Post by Buggy Virus on Sat Dec 15, 2012 2:51 pm

    BIG TIME MASTER wrote:AT GRIN TWIST-


    Ah, that's a good answer.

    I get it. But, let me throw something at you. I started playing an older action rpg game called Dantes Inferno (based on the old poems) that takes place in hell (duh). The environment design, sound, and whole shebang is so overwhelming intense that I have been finding it hard to want to finish the game, even though it's really pretty fun. When I do play it I can only go for like an hour or two before I have to get some fresh air.

    Now, DKS is a pretty gloomy atmosphere, but its balanced out with certain areas (the sunlight Altar, anor londo, the views from the undead burg) and with certain characters, and bonfires and the like. It never becomes overwhelming because its all balanced out. Dantes Inferno never gives you any respite.

    So, with that in mind, if DKSII has to be "darker", because sequels always have to push the envelope, I hope that it still maintains it balance of dark/light, despair/hope, frustration/exaltation.

    Also, when I was in Afghanistan (don't ask me any more about it), one thing that struck me was that the country is really beautiful. Sweeping mountain ridges, lush valleys, glorious sunrises and sunsets. The fact that there is a war going on there adds something to the beauty, and I think that that is the same reason why fighting through areas like the Parish and Anor Londo have a certain charm to them. The whole time I'm in Blightown, the Depths, or the Tomb of the Giants, I'm just thinking "I need to get the hell out of here!"


    Oh my, Dante's inferno. . .

    Such an interesting. . .

    Broken game.


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    Re: New, Bigger, Faster, Better, Louder, Darker, Scarier, Awesomer

    Post by exod FEAR on Sat Dec 15, 2012 5:22 pm

    BIG TIME MASTER wrote:

    Also, when I was in Afghanistan (don't ask me any more about it), one thing that struck me was that the country is really beautiful. Sweeping mountain ridges, lush valleys, glorious sunrises and sunsets. The fact that there is a war going on there adds something to the beauty, and I think that that is the same reason why fighting through areas like the Parish and Anor Londo have a certain charm to them. The whole time I'm in Blightown, the Depths, or the Tomb of the Giants, I'm just thinking "I need to get the hell out of here!"


    I agree, hope DkS2 is darker, but without the presence of happy times there will be no comparison. and you won't ever get that "i need to get the F### outta here! where's Firelink Shrine??" because you know there is no salvation.
    If you have reason to believe the next area is worse, then you have less motivation to want to get out quick.

    hmmmm, on second thought. Maybe salvation should be fewer and far between. More NPC's that are out to take advantage of you. and random occurences will keep you on your toes on different playthroughs.
    I mean, you only fall for traps the first time, but if there's minotaurs walking around the maze, you'll remember they're there but you won't know what corner they're hiding behind.


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    Re: New, Bigger, Faster, Better, Louder, Darker, Scarier, Awesomer

    Post by MasterofShadows on Sat Dec 15, 2012 6:06 pm

    I for one, welcome evolution. While I enjoyed both of the past games, I'm not just looking for the equivalent of an huge expansion with some patching here and there. By the way some of the community talks, it seems that this is really what a lot of people want. I don't share that sentiment.

    One thing that I've learned is that change is not always bad, even when you are immensely pleased with what already exists. Sometimes, change can help you discover things that you didn't realize were missing because you were so stubbornly resisting anything different, out of fear. Having said that, I just hope that FROM is smart enough to know what needs to be polished, what needs to be added, and what really just needs to be dropped. I like Miyazaki. I like him a lot. But two things:

    1. All game designers can eventually run out of fresh innovative ideas to push a series forward, calling for fresher minds to be brought in to keep things moving
    2. As a hobbyist game designer who knows a number of game designers who actually work in the Industry, I can tell you that designers tend to have a massively long list of things they'd like to do or work on. I seriously doubt that someone as talented as Miyazaki would only want to work on the Souls series for the rest of his life. That would be seriously stifling to his creative spirit.

    For one, I welcome much more straightforwardness to things like the game mechanics and the covenant system. Regardless of how much it fostered good community interaction, having to repeatedly leave the game and spend more time on a wiki just to understand the games most BASIC features is not good game design. This can easily lead to players making ill-informed choices about their build, which is a very common problem in many role-playing games, and needs to be improved.

    I will say that I hope that they don't go too far in the Demon's Souls direction regarding the darkness of lore and level design. I felt that Dark Souls had a much better balance with that. It was very refreshing to be able to finish Blight Town and climb my way out of it to see the beeming sun again. Emerging from the tense experience of Sen's Fortress to behold the sunlit beauty that is Anor Londo was also breathtaking, and I'm sure that many here knew that feeling. I never got that feeling with Demon's Souls. There were often times where I had to just put down the game and play something lighter because it was just too dark and disturbing at times. There just needs to be some balance between the Dark and Light.


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    Re: New, Bigger, Faster, Better, Louder, Darker, Scarier, Awesomer

    Post by BIG TIME MASTER on Sat Dec 15, 2012 6:35 pm

    MasterofShadows wrote:I for one, welcome evolution. While I enjoyed both of the past games, I'm not just looking for the equivalent of an huge expansion with some patching here and there. By the way some of the community talks, it seems that this is really what a lot of people want. I don't share that sentiment.

    One thing that I've learned is that change is not always bad, even when you are immensely pleased with what already exists. Sometimes, change can help you discover things that you didn't realize were missing because you were so stubbornly resisting anything different, out of fear. Having said that, I just hope that FROM is smart enough to know what needs to be polished, what needs to be added, and what really just needs to be dropped. I like Miyazaki. I like him a lot. But two things:

    1. All game designers can eventually run out of fresh innovative ideas to push a series forward, calling for fresher minds to be brought in to keep things moving
    2. As a hobbyist game designer who knows a number of game designers who actually work in the Industry, I can tell you that designers tend to have a massively long list of things they'd like to do or work on. I seriously doubt that someone as talented as Miyazaki would only want to work on the Souls series for the rest of his life. That would be seriously stifling to his creative spirit.

    For one, I welcome much more straightforwardness to things like the game mechanics and the covenant system. Regardless of how much it fostered good community interaction, having to repeatedly leave the game and spend more time on a wiki just to understand the games most BASIC features is not good game design. This can easily lead to players making ill-informed choices about their build, which is a very common problem in many role-playing games, and needs to be improved.

    I will say that I hope that they don't go too far in the Demon's Souls direction regarding the darkness of lore and level design. I felt that Dark Souls had a much better balance with that. It was very refreshing to be able to finish Blight Town and climb my way out of it to see the beeming sun again. Emerging from the tense experience of Sen's Fortress to behold the sunlit beauty that is Anor Londo was also breathtaking, and I'm sure that many here knew that feeling. I never got that feeling with Demon's Souls. There were often times where I had to just put down the game and play something lighter because it was just too dark and disturbing at times. There just needs to be some balance between the Dark and Light.

    Enlightening! This is why I make a post like this.
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    Re: New, Bigger, Faster, Better, Louder, Darker, Scarier, Awesomer

    Post by MasterofShadows on Sat Dec 15, 2012 6:43 pm

    exod FEAR wrote:More NPC's that are out to take advantage of you. and random occurences will keep you on your toes on different playthroughs.
    I mean, you only fall for traps the first time, but if there's minotaurs walking around the maze, you'll remember they're there but you won't know what corner they're hiding behind.

    Either way, more NPCs period would be cool, as long as most of them have mysterious ties to the lore like many of the characters in Dark Souls.

    Regarding random encounters/enemy placements, as much as I've wished for this, if its not done right, it can be severely frustrating. What if you are just trying to pass through an area that you've traveled through 100s of times, but now have to slow down your travel to a crawl just to make sure that you don't get creamed by a random enemy? The only thing I can think of is to add in fast-travel/warp much earlier, so that you don't always have to travel through that particular area if you don't feel like it. I say this reluctantly, though, because I, like most of the role-playing community, have a love-hate relationship with fast-travel.


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    Re: New, Bigger, Faster, Better, Louder, Darker, Scarier, Awesomer

    Post by exod FEAR on Sun Dec 16, 2012 1:56 pm

    MasterofShadows wrote:
    exod FEAR wrote:More NPC's that are out to take advantage of you. and random occurences will keep you on your toes on different playthroughs.
    I mean, you only fall for traps the first time, but if there's minotaurs walking around the maze, you'll remember they're there but you won't know what corner they're hiding behind.

    Either way, more NPCs period would be cool, as long as most of them have mysterious ties to the lore like many of the characters in Dark Souls.

    Regarding random encounters/enemy placements, as much as I've wished for this, if its not done right, it can be severely frustrating. What if you are just trying to pass through an area that you've traveled through 100s of times, but now have to slow down your travel to a crawl just to make sure that you don't get creamed by a random enemy? The only thing I can think of is to add in fast-travel/warp much earlier, so that you don't always have to travel through that particular area if you don't feel like it. I say this reluctantly, though, because I, like most of the role-playing community, have a love-hate relationship with fast-travel.

    i see your concern, but my issue is that i only got the "true" souls experience on my first playthrough. Which meant that halfway through my second playthrough I said "eh, I'll just pvp now".
    DarkSouls is near infinite replayability, I think random occurrences and mobile enemies is all that's missing.
    Also, just in terms of story, it just gets boring to see the same enemies in exactly the same spot! I mean, yeah they're hollow but c'mon! go for a walk or something?!?
    Finally, i dont agree with how every enemy is on the sole quest to kill the player. Like, if i lure a skelly from the catcombs entrance, why is he not interested in petrus(who will watch you get killed)? I'd like to see more intelligent interaction with enemies and NPC's make them seem REAL.
    I know it's a lot to ask for

    edit: like crystal golems shouldnt have beef with the crystal soldiers obvs, but Petrus should love to kill a skelly! but he just acts like he cant see em! maybe involve factions that are allied/neutral/hostile with others?


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    Re: New, Bigger, Faster, Better, Louder, Darker, Scarier, Awesomer

    Post by MasterofShadows on Sun Dec 16, 2012 2:54 pm

    Believe me, I really do want something like that. It just needs to be done right, or it can be pretty annoying later on in the game when you are just trying to get from point A-B. Fast Travel would need to be implemented again.


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