DeS II, the Souls Franchise & Miyazaki as Joss Whedon

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    DE5PA1R
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    DeS II, the Souls Franchise & Miyazaki as Joss Whedon

    Post by DE5PA1R on Tue Dec 11, 2012 3:53 pm

    This is a message I sent over to ENB earlier and thought I might open up discussion. Sorry so long.

    One question that's been running through my mind is: What is Miyazaki doing, if not working on Dark Souls? He's been intentionally vague when interviews mention his future at FromSoft, and though he's directed 2 extremely popular sleeper hits, he's been moved out of a director's role into that of "supervisor." Questions about his new role linger. He was director of 2 of From's (and Namco's) biggest hits; though new to the
    field, after having directed a handful of games he's approaching veteran status; and he is still at From.

    There's another creator whose career echoes Miyakazi's in the west: Joss Whedon. He went from doing low-budget TV shows, to high-budget TV shows, then directed exactly 1 movie (the cult classic Firefly) and subsequently directed the Avengers. Now, he's the "supervisor" of Marvel Phase 2, which includes Iron Man 3, Thor 2, Captain America 2 and other projects, which will lead to his return as director for The Avengers 2. For a lot of stars and movegoers, Joss Whedon is in some ways an ideal creator.

    In From's eyes, Miyazaki must represent this ideal. As ENB has pointed out, investment in Demon's Souls and to an extent Dark Souls was minimal. They weren't sure of the potential, and when both games became popular it turned a great profit for the company. I believe this resulted in a new title and perhaps a promotion for Miyazaki to Franchise Supervisor. This begs the question: what is he supervising? The obvious answer is Dark Souls 2. I speculate that an additional obfuscated answer is Demon's Souls 2, and perhaps yet another unrelated Souls title.

    I recognize that there is a sizeable amount of speculation here. But, there is some evidence supporting the theory.

    First: like I said before, Miyazaki is an ideal director and he's still at From. From wouldn't throw out or "bench" a star player, especially to replace him with someone who may have considerable experience but falls short of Miyazaki's success. They likely wouldn't call him a supervisor of the team, and there wouldn't be co-directors for Dark Souls II. No game developer that takes itself seriously has co-directors without a head honcho actually calling the shots. Supposing From did do something so stupid as bump
    Miyazaki down a notch, he would likely have moved to another company or started his own by now.

    Second: While Miyazaki has been vague about his next position since the release of Dark Souls, in interviews leading up to its release he spoke very confidently about the franchise and his involvement in it (here). According to my theory, talk about branching out into 2 or more titles began after Dark Souls proved the series was very profitable.

    Third: Miyazaki has expressed that part of his team has a lot of interest in mobile/portable gaming (here). Aside from tablets and smartphones, the Vita is the only portable gaming device we can take seriously. The Vita is owned by Sony. Sony owns the rights to Demon's Souls. If From wanted to get into portable gaming, it would almost certainly publish on the Vita. If they were to do so, why not use an established franchise?
    The fact that Dark Souls II will not be on the Vita supports this theory - surely From would not ignore an opportunity to turn a profit, get in Sony's good graces and fulfill employee wishes.

    Finally, there was talk of Demon's Souls 2 even while Dark Souls, then called "Project Dark," was well underway. You can read that here.

    This leads me to the belief that Demon's Souls II is coming soon, perhaps as soon as 6 months after Dark Souls II; that it will come out for the Vita and maybe the PS3; and that Miyazaki will either direct the game or will supervise another director that is separate from the Dark Souls II team. If Namco is pushing From to create a more "accessible" game, and Miyazaki does not want to, this is a solution for both of them. The Dark series will cater to a perhaps more populous casual crowd and the Demon's series will cater to more hardcore gamers.

    What do you guys and gals think?


    Last edited by DE5PA1R on Tue Dec 11, 2012 4:06 pm; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : Formatting.)
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    Re: DeS II, the Souls Franchise & Miyazaki as Joss Whedon

    Post by Djem on Tue Dec 11, 2012 3:59 pm

    Man, I hope this is true. Even though I don't own a Vita, a new Souls game is always welcome. And it just doesn't make sense for From Software to cast aside their most succesful director.
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    Re: DeS II, the Souls Franchise & Miyazaki as Joss Whedon

    Post by Tomhet on Tue Dec 11, 2012 11:24 pm

    Another Souls game for the PS3? That would suck since I don't intend to buy one. I hope you are wrong.
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    Re: DeS II, the Souls Franchise & Miyazaki as Joss Whedon

    Post by ViralEnsign_ on Wed Dec 12, 2012 1:28 am

    Im terrified that he will take a good franchise and squander it on portable gaming systems like Valkyria Chronicles did.

    I remember the director of that game saying that he would not be making another console version of the game unless they were pushing the boundaries and treading new ground.... from what I hear Miyazaki said something like that as well.....I hope to god they dont take Souls over to the Vita....

    Dark Souls and Demon's Souls are great they are designed for consoles. They should stay there. (Make no mistake I'm not being discriminatory but I think From should look to its roots and say this was what made us great lets work on that)


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    Re: DeS II, the Souls Franchise & Miyazaki as Joss Whedon

    Post by raecor14 on Wed Dec 12, 2012 2:25 am

    they could do it like ruin where its the exact same game for the portable and you can transfer saves over big grin that would be AWESOME


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    Re: DeS II, the Souls Franchise & Miyazaki as Joss Whedon

    Post by Tomhet on Wed Dec 12, 2012 5:35 am

    Comparing Miyazaki to Whedon is a very bad comparison, the former is a genius, the latter not, well, so much. I still can't understand why Avengers was so darn popular, it was freaking terrible.
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    Re: DeS II, the Souls Franchise & Miyazaki as Joss Whedon

    Post by SetaSensei on Wed Dec 12, 2012 8:15 am

    I honestly don't think that any of the Souls game could fit any portable format (phone or console).
    The Souls games don't have a proper "pause" except save and quit. That's part of the player's stress (if anything happens IRL while you're fighting, you just freak out).
    Online play's mechanics don't fit either. Although being invaded by someone who's in the same place as you would be awesome. You cannot force players to stay online or connected due to the format.

    And the last argument is : these games are mostly about observation and learning patterns.
    How can you spot a pattern on messy bosses such as the Four Kings or huge ones like Iron Golem on tiny screens ?

    They can be working on other Souls games, or a Ruin reboot. But a Souls game on portable devices ? I really don't think so.
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    Re: DeS II, the Souls Franchise & Miyazaki as Joss Whedon

    Post by Serious_Much on Wed Dec 12, 2012 9:37 am

    It's an interesting opinion, but to me it could just as easily be he's going to direct a different game for from and only really check on souls. He did say if he wasn't sure what he could do for souls he'd go onto something else, perhaps that's what has happened


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    Re: DeS II, the Souls Franchise & Miyazaki as Joss Whedon

    Post by DE5PA1R on Wed Dec 12, 2012 12:43 pm

    Another Souls game for the PS3? That would suck since I don't intend to buy one. I hope you are wrong.

    Why? If you're not going to get the game, then you're not going to get the game. Whether it's released or not.


    Comparing Miyazaki to Whedon is a very bad comparison, the former
    is a genius, the latter not, well, so much. I still can't understand why
    Avengers was so darn popular, it was freaking terrible.
    The comparison is excellent because both are geniuses. Avengers is one of the best movies ever. Debate someplace else please.

    People said the Souls series wouldn't work portable.

    This is true; the Souls games as we know them would probably be worse on portable due to some of the reasons listed above. However, tweaking the formula a bit could result in a very good game. If there's any AAA developer that can do it well, I think it's From.


    It's an interesting opinion, but to me it could just as easily be
    he's going to direct a different game for from and only really check on
    souls. He did say if he wasn't sure what he could do for souls he'd go
    onto something else, perhaps that's what has happened.

    That's a definite possibility, though I think we would have heard something by now. And, like I pointed out earlier, no developer that takes itself seriously would appoint 2 co-directors without someone actually calling the shots. But maybe Miyazaki really has moved to another game. Which would make me sad

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