I still say Dark Magic is physical.

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    Re: I still say Dark Magic is physical.

    Post by Emergence on Thu Dec 06, 2012 3:17 am

    Ok corroborated via further testing

    Crest shield at 95% phys 42% mag let through 167 Dmg as predicted based on above percentages.

    No shield based on above percentages should let through around 540. Testing confirms this, as 533 damage goes through without a shield.


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    Re: I still say Dark Magic is physical.

    Post by ChizFreak on Thu Dec 06, 2012 3:34 am

    Emergence wrote:Ok corroborated via further testing

    Crest shield at 95% phys 42% mag let through 167 Dmg as predicted based on above percentages.

    No shield based on above percentages should let through around 540. Testing confirms this, as 533 damage goes through without a shield.

    Too many numbers silly...

    Any conclusions?


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    Re: I still say Dark Magic is physical.

    Post by PlasticandRage on Thu Dec 06, 2012 3:35 am

    Have we decided whether or not the physical aspect scales with strength or not? I've just noticed how low the INT requirement is for a couple of those spells. If it did noticeably scale with STR, it'd be fun to make a heavy STR/dark sorcerer toon.


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    Re: I still say Dark Magic is physical.

    Post by hey its andres on Thu Dec 06, 2012 3:49 am

    Spurgun wrote:Some people say that GMB almost nullifies the ark magic, while others say that thye've been OHK through their GMB.

    If the strength scaling played that much of a part then it would make sense that we've seen such a variation in terms of effectiveness of MB and GMB. From my experience most sorcerers do invest in high strength so if they were mostly intelligence then its logical to think that GMB would almost completely cancel it out. This is all speculation, but it makes sense.
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    Re: I still say Dark Magic is physical.

    Post by Emergence on Thu Dec 06, 2012 3:51 am

    The conclusion I made is that coming from the Oolacile sorcerers it's definitely a 50/50 split in physical to magical damage. So now we need to see how PvP stat spread alters that ratio since there is no way of knowing what the NPC stat allocation is.


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    Re: I still say Dark Magic is physical.

    Post by PlasticandRage on Thu Dec 06, 2012 4:00 am

    I'm up for volunteering for some testing if that's what's happening. I have toons with all those shields, that are able to use Havel's. 120 range.


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    Re: I still say Dark Magic is physical.

    Post by Glutebrah on Thu Dec 06, 2012 11:50 am

    Emergence wrote:The conclusion I made is that coming from the Oolacile sorcerers it's definitely a 50/50 split in physical to magical damage. So now we need to see how PvP stat spread alters that ratio since there is no way of knowing what the NPC stat allocation is.

    when you see your 50/50 split? what is your str/int stat? sorry if you posted it already.

    because i know GMB agianst my Sorc who is 16str 50int, TCC, Bellowing ring, and Dusk crown, and Pursuers + upclose Dark bead doesn't come close to anything we would call significant damage


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    Re: I still say Dark Magic is physical.

    Post by Emergence on Thu Dec 06, 2012 12:59 pm

    That's the mystery we need pvp testing for. This 50/50 split is the damage done by the Oolacile Sorcerer enemies. We have no way of knowing their stat allocation to give that split. There is also a slim chance that they are using a different version of the spells than we use.


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    Re: I still say Dark Magic is physical.

    Post by Emergence on Thu Dec 06, 2012 1:09 pm

    So here's what the experiment would need, and let's mix and match people that way. Call out anything I miss or needs adding.

    A character with 50 STR/16 INT: Bare minimum INT to cast Dark Bead/Orb

    A character with 50 INT/low str

    A character with an even split of INT/STR 50/50, 40/40

    A character who can wield any shield and act as the crash test dummy (glute I believe you said you had one like that correct?)


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    Re: I still say Dark Magic is physical.

    Post by PlasticandRage on Thu Dec 06, 2012 2:03 pm

    I have 3 of those things. Only one I'd be missing is one that has even numbers between STR and INT. Are you doing this on Ps3 Emergence?


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    Re: I still say Dark Magic is physical.

    Post by Emergence on Thu Dec 06, 2012 2:06 pm

    Well it can be any system. I'm just trying to facilitate the matchmaking between people. I don't have a character who fits any of those criteria right now lol. As an Admin, I excel at delegating. Not actually doing.


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    Re: I still say Dark Magic is physical.

    Post by PlasticandRage on Thu Dec 06, 2012 2:14 pm

    Well then, I can help to do this with 3 of those types on ps3 at SL 120 range, if anyone else is into it, and can match up with that range.


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    Re: I still say Dark Magic is physical.

    Post by Glutebrah on Thu Dec 06, 2012 2:16 pm

    Emergence wrote:So here's what the experiment would need, and let's mix and match people that way. Call out anything I miss or needs adding.

    A character with 50 STR/16 INT: Bare minimum INT to cast Dark Bead/Orb

    A character with 50 INT/low str

    A character with an even split of INT/STR 50/50, 40/40

    A character who can wield any shield and act as the crash test dummy (glute I believe you said you had one like that correct?)

    emergence are you PSN? i would love to do some testing with you. i just realized we can 2hand Havel shield. i have a 50 int/16 str. and both shields. also have a guy with GMB.

    the 50 int should have 16 str (which is me). that way its 50/16 and 16/50 even split.


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    Re: I still say Dark Magic is physical.

    Post by Emergence on Thu Dec 06, 2012 2:43 pm

    I am on PSN Glute, but I don't have any characters that fit that, otherwise I'd love to. I'll definitely be present for testing though.


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    Re: I still say Dark Magic is physical.

    Post by Glutebrah on Thu Dec 06, 2012 2:50 pm

    Emergence wrote:I am on PSN Glute, but I don't have any characters that fit that, otherwise I'd love to. I'll definitely be present for testing though.

    i wonder if the magic scales with str only with Manus Cat or not.. or if str effects dark magic regardless of str.

    i should make a thread listing each type of character we need get list of people who meet the requirements and plan a meet up testing night.

    you mind if i do that? would be easier to organize and more people would see then just this thread.


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    Re: I still say Dark Magic is physical.

    Post by WyrmHero on Thu Dec 06, 2012 2:55 pm

    ^According to rosie's tests Str increases dark sorcery damage with all catalysts, but Manus gets a higher boost.


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    Re: I still say Dark Magic is physical.

    Post by Emergence on Thu Dec 06, 2012 3:02 pm

    Yup go for it Glute. It'll be the best way to gather the troops. The Str modifies the damage for sure, and we need to figure out if it also alters the damage mix between magic and physical.


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    Re: I still say Dark Magic is physical.

    Post by ChizFreak on Thu Dec 06, 2012 4:20 pm

    I have a character with 50 INT and 16 STR. And I also have a STR build, 50 STR with no INT whatsoever, which can serve as the tank.


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    Re: I still say Dark Magic is physical.

    Post by GkMrBane on Thu Dec 06, 2012 6:03 pm

    Rynn wrote:Dark Orb and Dark Bead both are almost completely not effected by spells like Great Magic Barrier. I was doing 400 damage per dark orb to a giants + Mask of Mother user who cast GMB

    Were they wearing fairy ears? Crown of dusk = 30% more dmg recieved by magic.

    GMB 90-80% reduce in Magic dmg


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    Re: I still say Dark Magic is physical.

    Post by GkMrBane on Thu Dec 06, 2012 6:27 pm

    Emergence wrote:Ok here's my testing vs Oolacile Sorcerer Dark Orb

    LVL 132 Magid D: 257 Phys D: 252 HP: 1325

    Crest Shield: 100% Phys Reduction 80% Mag Reduction: 54 dmg goes through (implies at least a strenght of 270 magical at 27 magic dmg for every 10%)

    Bloodshield: 100% Phys Reduction 30% Mag Reduction: 185 dmg goes through (using the 27 for every 10% number that would suggest 189 goes through so the numbers are consistent)

    Target Shield: 78% Phys Reduction 30% Mag Reduction: 244 dmg goes through (using the aforementioned ratio that suggests 185-189 of the dmg is magical which makes the other 59 or so physical damage. At 78%, 59 physical damage implies a close to 27-28 phys damage for every part of 10%. Thus far it seems the damage ratio is split 50/50 from physical/magic).

    Dark Hand: 80% Phys Reduction 80% Mag Reduction: this is the control. Using the numbers we have so far, it it's a split of 20% going through for each that would suggest about 54 magic going through and 54 or so physical going through. Expectation is that 108 will go through.

    Dark Hand allows 106 to go through. That's as close to a confirmation as it's going to get.

    Oolacile Sorcerer Dark Orb is 50% physical 50% magical according to what I'm seeing here.

    That totally explains it.

    Most magic builds go with dex since it compliments casting speads thats why there is so many different results. (Means that they arent getting the full scaling of dark bead on the strength side)

    This means that not only is it split 50/50 but that the physical dmg of Dark bead is also buffed when you use crown of dusk and DragCrest ring.


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