Countering Dark Bead

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    Back Lot Basher
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    Re: Countering Dark Bead

    Post by Back Lot Basher on Tue Nov 27, 2012 6:32 pm

    Clerics are the best solution for Dark Bead. VoS + GMB = 4 solid minutes of cast-free enemy.

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    Re: Countering Dark Bead

    Post by EeAyEss on Tue Nov 27, 2012 6:42 pm

    Or you could be the BIG TRUCK. Nothing beats the BIG TRUCK. [url=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BJgdHvKz2_Q&feature=g-all]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BJgdHvKz2_Q&feature=g-all[/url]

    Lol Rosie is awesome.

    Though really, I don't know how Dark Bead would fare against that build. Still funny though.


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    Re: Countering Dark Bead

    Post by lordgodofhell on Wed Nov 28, 2012 12:42 am

    Fotitudo wrote:GET GOOD!
    Hell these posts are annoying as hell! >sad
    I don´t have any problems with dark magic, with lag its pretty dangerous, but what isn´t dangerous with lag?
    Fast roll + dodging skills. Whats the deal?

    So i won´t say, i´m a pro, im just "good". Nothing more. And i only died once, against dark bead. Which was my fault.

    - Vow of Silence
    - Great Magic Barrier
    - Crest Shield/Havel Shield
    - Fast roll
    - Dingy robe + big hat (helps a lot!)
    - Dark Hand, absorb dark magic without stamina and health damage!
    - Hidden Body against pursuers

    Sometime i ask myself, what do you do against great combustion or wrath of the gods? ...

    I wanted to leave this alone but I couldn't bring myself to do it.

    First, try to not come off as a tool.
    Second, "Dark hand absorbs magic without stamina and health damage." WTF??? Since when?
    Finally, you personally say that you want to know how to dodge GC and WotG .. "Fast roll + dodging skills. Whats the deal?"


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    Re: Countering Dark Bead

    Post by Sentiel on Wed Nov 28, 2012 6:08 am

    I'll share my tips on how to fight Dark Magic, suitable for everyone, so no point investments required, so GMB, VoS etc. I got none of that on my Dex build, so I use the following methods to deal with Dark Magic.

    Dark Bead

    Crest Shield
    Anyone can use it and it has good 85% damage reduction from magic. Eith 40 End and RoFaP a full hit of Dark Bead, boosted by Tin Crystalization Catalyst and Crown of Dusk does little damage, somewhere between 150-200 HP max, which can be further reduced by armor and takes around 60-70% of your stamina. Stamina drain can be a problem if you're facing a spammer, but can be dealt with by using Green Blossom before the fight and combining blocking and evading.

    Evading
    Simply roll through, or to the side of the attack. Unless lag comes into the play you'll be ok with 0 damage taken, even with medium roll.
    Skilled casters will fire Dark Bead unlocked which kills this tactic though, so be carefull and don't be ashamed to use your shield. It's better than dying, right?


    Purusers

    Crest Shield
    Contrary to the popular belief Purusers CAN be blocked, but they'll devastate you, break your guard and leave you vulenrable. However you can safely block 1-4 of them, depending on your Stamina bar size with this shield.

    Evading
    You can roll through Pursuers, but they can follow you and hit you from behind. What makes this occur is still unlcear to me, but so far, I think it depends on the length of Purusers following you, so the sooner you roll, the bigger chance they home on you again. This worked for me in 100% in combination with one of the following tactics.

    Rolling to sides is viable option, but leaves you open to subsequent spell and/or melee attacks from the caster.

    Positioning yourself so that you get some object, like a tree for example, between you and the Pursuers, so they hit that object instead of you.

    Retreating from the caster is by far the safest method I've found, because the Pursuers can't catch up with you. You have a lot of time to create some solid distance between you and the caster when he starts to cast Pursuers as they have a very long casting animation.
    The caster can run after you to try to attack you with a melee weapon, or to cast another spell, like CSS for example.
    In this case, spells are of no issue as you back off from their range before the caster manages to pull them off, or simply block them. With enough distance between you, the caster can lose lock on, thus making his spells miss you and you also get out of their effective range.
    If the caster manages to pull a spell on you, or catches up to you, you can easily evade this. Spells by rolling to the side and melee by rolling backwards and still keep your distance between you and incoming Pursuers. Or, you can, once again block, this works especially well if the caster decides to attack you with a weapon.
    However at this time, the Pursuers should be near their end.

    Roll BS is a very good method, but not everyone can do this and it's not 100% reliable, mostly thanks to lag, however it can be turned into a anti Pursuers cheese by backing away, this usually forces caster to follow you, when he's getting close, roll through Pursuers for an easy backstab. This worked for me 100% of the time, becasue the caster is in sprint and can't turn instantly to repel your roll bs.
    Also at this time, when I've rolled through Pursuers after they've chased me for some time, they never turned around to hit me and just continued their flight in the original direction, or dispersed into various directions, but none turned around.
    This makes me think that Pursuers lose the strength of their homing ability with time.

    Havel's Sheild
    All of the forementioned tactics work for fast and medium roll builds. Heavy roll builds should probably rely on Havel's Sheild, since they're usually having high Str.
    With it's Stability and defences and with good stamina managment on your side + some Green Blossom, just in case, you should be able to block it all.

    These works only when lag plays none, or minor factor in the equation. We all know when lag comes, all sort of :dung: happens.


    PS:
    I didn't try to block Dark Magic with Dark Hand, however I managed to block some type of Soulmass (I can't say which thanks to DLC bug) with Dark Hand for reduced damage and 0! Stamina damage. However this could've been thanks to lag and I didn't attempt to recreate this. Not that it matters, since evading Soulmass spells is easy.

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    Re: Countering Dark Bead

    Post by befowler on Wed Nov 28, 2012 11:51 am

    I've been croaking to DB and pursuers fairly often for a while now, and don't think lag is the major issue with them. I'm used to regular spell lag, and the worst I see is usually CSSs that completely miss on the screen but still deal damage somehow, or that weird invisible/multiple HCSM thing. But with dark magic, I'm seeing a whole new level of crazy. The most common is getting killed before the opponent's casting animation even starts -- in fights with no other signs of lag. It's hard to evade something that from your perspective hasn't even been cast yet, I'm talking before the guy even has a catalyst out. This is not rare, in fact the majority of my deaths to DB involve me suddenly dying like I'm being unplugged from the Matrix, and then my opponent pulling out a catalyst and casting DB at what from my end is already my corpse.

    Pursuers are even worse. On numerous occasions, I've watched them pursue a different person entirely, explode right on top of them, and leave that person unharmed while instead killing me halfway across the map. Again, it's hard to evade spells that are either invisible or are actually traveling in a different direction for all you know. This makes it hard to get away with VoS or roll evasions because you basically can't trust anything you see on the screen and usually by the time you realize they even plan to cast something you're dead. The "best" I've found so far is actually an offhand heavy crossbow and heavy bolts -- if I even suspect someone may be packing DB/pursuers, I just randomly ping them with bolts and hopefully stagger them before they get something off. It's better than nothing.


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    Re: Countering Dark Bead

    Post by OrnsteinFanBoy on Wed Nov 28, 2012 12:10 pm

    Try blocking DB with the Dark Hand and you'll quickly find yourself dead. Pretty much the same story the crest shield. The stamina drain on DB is massive, I've seen dark mages fling havels greatshield aside so blocking is not an option.
    I dual wield dark hands for style on one of my toons and tried to block a dark bead, instant guard break + spam spam spam = dead.

    Saying you might be okay as long as they don't spam is like saying you'll be okay against the four kings as long as they don't keep spawning.

    VoS and GMB are the only practical options and they're only usable by faith builds. Everyone else might just have to accept that every now and then a dark mage is gonna spam you to death
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    Re: Countering Dark Bead

    Post by Sentiel on Wed Nov 28, 2012 12:38 pm

    All of this lag nonesense Dark Magic has reminds of Moonlight Butterfly. As a phantom I always see it shooting it's pew pew lasery things away in the distance, like it's trying to do a lser show in the sky and then suddenly, host dies.

    Dark Magic is very like that. That's why I stated that my tactics work with little to no lag, but when that bad boy comes, it's better to cut the cable then stay there and feel the crazy if you ask me.

    @OrnsteinFanBoy:
    I'm blocking DB with Crest Shield on a daily basis and it's ok.
    I said, it does terrible stamina drain, so you're likely to die from the second cast and thus it's better to block and then evade. Blocking it is also usefull when lag comes, as then, evading is kinda impossible.

    GMB and VoS are cool and all, but not everyone has/wants the Faith to use those + they have limited duration after which you're toasted.

    EDIT:
    Or, you can be a hardass and repel DB with Force! :mask-averice:


    Last edited by Sentiel on Wed Nov 28, 2012 1:28 pm; edited 2 times in total (Reason for editing : I missed OrnsteinFanBoy's post)


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