Remove Region free PVP

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    aprilmanha
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    Remove Region free PVP

    Post by aprilmanha on Fri Nov 23, 2012 5:07 pm

    After an evening of trying to have some fun PVP, I have noticed one very obvious streak.

    Every game I have with people from the UK (as I am) other then the forest farmers, was a fun and close match, with smart moves and some bad moves.

    Games against other people however are a glitchy lag fast that were not even worth fighting.

    So the solution is obvious, ban people from invading other people outside their territory. This will massively improve the PVP experience for all then!

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    Re: Remove Region free PVP

    Post by Spurgun on Fri Nov 23, 2012 5:12 pm

    I hope this never happens. Part of what makes DkS fun for me is that i can play with anyone. I wouldn't be able to play with most of my friends if this happened.

    The lag isn't as bad as most people make it out to be. Sure, you come across some people who are very laggy, but it doesn't happen very often.

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    Re: Remove Region free PVP

    Post by aprilmanha on Fri Nov 23, 2012 5:30 pm

    I would prefer a more fun play experience then being invaded by a teleporting lagger who BS's me from 20 foot infront of me.

    Sure let me invite these people to my game but don't force them on me.
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    Re: Remove Region free PVP

    Post by AzureCrow on Fri Nov 23, 2012 5:42 pm

    The problem is once you restrict region your reducing the player pool, as is it is very difficult to get summons/invasions if your not within a relatively small level range for each area but even then your relying completely on there being players there as well. If you imagine all the times when you're in range and still not seeing any signs that's a pool of players across the globe, reduce the numbers and we would be seeing dramatically less players.


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    Re: Remove Region free PVP

    Post by aprilmanha on Fri Nov 23, 2012 5:48 pm

    Yes, but Banning region free PVP would only stop invasions, so summoning people would not be touched since you are choosing to let those players into your game.
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    Re: Remove Region free PVP

    Post by Onion Knight on Fri Nov 23, 2012 5:55 pm

    Region locking is a terrible idea for this game. Divides the player population even further across 3 platforms, go look at Demon's Souls for further evidence of why it's a terrible idea. The European server is dead for both PvP and Co-op and that's with a population on only 1 platform.


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    Re: Remove Region free PVP

    Post by Reaperfan on Fri Nov 23, 2012 5:58 pm

    I will always stick by the same belief:

    Lag is impossible to remove the way current online functionality works. It can be reduced, but never removed purely based on the mechanics of online connectivity. Until someone invents an entirely new method of networking, lag will always be present, and any attempt to fight it is an uphill and ultimately hopeless battle.

    Sure we can reduce lag with things like region locking, meaning we are less likely to encounter situations where lag will be a big factor, but it will always be a factor and even across the smallest of distances lag can still be very harsh. And at the same time, I've had matches with players in the UK and Japan that have been virtually lag-free. All region locking would do is make it so we get 60% less matches with 15% less chance of bad lag happening. (numbers are 100% made-up winking)

    Also, imagine all the Fight Clubs out there that would have to be broken up. (including ours sad)


    Last edited by Reaperfan on Fri Nov 23, 2012 5:59 pm; edited 1 time in total


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    Re: Remove Region free PVP

    Post by aprilmanha on Fri Nov 23, 2012 5:59 pm

    I still would rather quality PVP and get only 10 matches an evening then have 100 lag-stab invaders from around the world getting in the way of an otherwise good game.

    The only reason for Deamon Souls becoming empty is because Dark souls took 90% of the fan base.

    Edit: I also don't see how this can be thought of as breaking up pvp fight clubs either. If you see their Summon sign on the ground then invite them. I have already said I think this ban should only be on the random invasion side, not the summon system.


    Last edited by aprilmanha on Fri Nov 23, 2012 6:01 pm; edited 1 time in total
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    Re: Remove Region free PVP

    Post by Reaperfan on Fri Nov 23, 2012 6:01 pm

    aprilmanha wrote:I still would rather quality PVP and get only 10 matches an evening then have 100 lag-stab invaders from around the world getting in the way of an otherwise good game.

    The only reason for Deamon Souls becoming empty is because Dark souls took 90% of the fan base.

    There's also the fact that someone like me, being on the NA server, could never play with someone like you on the UK server. There's the whole "dividing the playerbase" thing at work there.


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    Re: Remove Region free PVP

    Post by aprilmanha on Fri Nov 23, 2012 6:02 pm

    Reaperfan wrote:
    There's also the fact that someone like me, being on the NA server, could never play with someone like you on the UK server. There's the whole "dividing the playerbase" thing at work there.

    If you invited me to join in some jolly fun coop, of course we could play together!
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    Re: Remove Region free PVP

    Post by Onion Knight on Fri Nov 23, 2012 6:06 pm

    But this reduces the invasion rate percentage when compared to the summoning percentage, which then unbalances the game. Eh this whole problematic suggestion is making my head hurt.


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    Re: Remove Region free PVP

    Post by Reaperfan on Fri Nov 23, 2012 6:10 pm

    aprilmanha wrote:If you invited me to join in some jolly fun coop, of course we could play together!

    Actually no, we couldn't. Because our character data is being handled by completely separate information networks. It would be, quite literally, virtually impossible for our characters' data to connect to one another. If we wanted to connect to each other, one of us would have to set up a separate PSN account on our non-native server, and invite back in the issue of potentially increased lag.


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    Re: Remove Region free PVP

    Post by aprilmanha on Fri Nov 23, 2012 6:12 pm

    I don't see where the problem is. If we can Coop now, we can still coop if random invasions are limited to same country invasions.

    Coop is not invasions...
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    Re: Remove Region free PVP

    Post by Onion Knight on Fri Nov 23, 2012 6:15 pm

    I think you need to read up on how network architecture works, otherwise this thread will be going round in circles for ever.


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    Re: Remove Region free PVP

    Post by Forum Pirate on Fri Nov 23, 2012 6:16 pm

    But you wouldn't get 10 good matches a night, You'd be lucky to get one good match a night.

    And that is not how region locking works. I'm fairly sure its all or nothing, I don't think co-op can be seperated from pvp for region locking purposes without a second disk specifically for co-op (which would then be invasion free.)

    Priority can be set in game, if the devs give that option, but they didn't and I've yet to see a game other than halo and maybe cod do so, which leads me to elieve it would be very expensive to include.


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    Re: Remove Region free PVP

    Post by aprilmanha on Fri Nov 23, 2012 6:21 pm

    Look seriously, all it needs is for when your game is looking for a random person to invade, it just looks for people only in your region. Nothing more. Its not like I am asking for them to make a USA server and a UK server and split them entirely.

    None of this daft "network infrastructure" issue. Geez, just save that till the next game and do online play properly
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    Re: Remove Region free PVP

    Post by Reaperfan on Fri Nov 23, 2012 6:24 pm

    aprilmanha wrote:I don't see where the problem is. If we can Coop now, we can still coop if random invasions are limited to same country invasions.

    Coop is not invasions...



    Forgive me, I thought we were still discussing the matter in relation to how things worked in Demon's Souls, and my previous comment was made under the context of connectivity in that game.

    Either way, I'm not sure on the feasibility of region-locking only one facet of the online connectivity. You have to consider the possibility of a non-native phantom and how that would interact with a natively-locked invading system. If I, as a host in the NA region, summon a phantom from Japan, would I now be immune to invasions because invaders can't connect to non-native players? Or would this be an exception case and the invader would still be allowed in, in which case nothing changes from the present and the multiple regions present result in severe lag? Either way it breaks the balance of PvE by eliminating the one large downside of summoning help (which is the threat of invasion) or it changes nothing.


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    Re: Remove Region free PVP

    Post by aprilmanha on Fri Nov 23, 2012 6:32 pm

    I guess invasions would be allowed in if they were still from your region in that case.

    Reaperfan wrote:Either
    way it breaks the balance of PvE by eliminating the one large downside
    of summoning help (which is the threat of invasion) or it changes
    nothing.
    True, but if its the option of No summons and No invasions from Lag-stabbers or geting Lag-stabbed, I would pick No summons.

    But this is a game made much more fun by jolly PVP (I would have it as 4 player coop if I could) So I have to make do with farming humanity at every chance to make up for all the times I'm going to get lag-stabbed. It really spoils the game though and really could be done without.

    I'm sure From did not mean to allow their game to become the laggy mess it becomes now and then, when the rest of it is so polished
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    Re: Remove Region free PVP

    Post by TehInfamousAmos on Fri Nov 23, 2012 7:12 pm

    aprilmanha wrote:I guess invasions would be allowed in if they were still from your region in that case.

    Reaperfan wrote:Either
    way it breaks the balance of PvE by eliminating the one large downside
    of summoning help (which is the threat of invasion) or it changes
    nothing.
    True, but if its the option of No summons and No invasions from Lag-stabbers or geting Lag-stabbed, I would pick No summons.

    But this is a game made much more fun by jolly PVP (I would have it as 4 player coop if I could) So I have to make do with farming humanity at every chance to make up for all the times I'm going to get lag-stabbed. It really spoils the game though and really could be done without.

    I'm sure From did not mean to allow their game to become the laggy mess it becomes now and then, when the rest of it is so polished
    '

    Sir... This is a complete over-exaggeration of how laggy pvp was, you ever play DeS - the pvp on there even with dedicated region locked servers were more laggy than the P2P of DkS... It may be a surprise to know that but it still is true. On a note, no offence to you but it seems like you want to edit the game purely to your own needs ' single-player!? Why! That destroys the lifetime of the game... If you're fed up with lag then just play offline. Sorry if I have put forth a terrible argument but I am sleep deprived so it is to be expected.


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    Re: Remove Region free PVP

    Post by aprilmanha on Fri Nov 23, 2012 7:16 pm

    TehInfamousAmos wrote:
    Ma'm... This is a complete over-exaggeration of how laggy pvp was, you ever play DeS - the pvp on there even with dedicated region locked servers were more laggy than the P2P of DkS... It may be a surprise to know that but it still is true. On a note, no offence to you but it seems like you want to edit the game purely to your own needs ' single-player!? Why! That destroys the lifetime of the game... If you're fed up with lag then just play offline. Sorry if I have put forth a terrible argument but I am sleep deprived so it is to be expected.

    So region locked P2P will be even less laggy.

    And as I have said before, I don't want to play single player. I love Coop, it makes the game much more fun.

    I usually fight each boss 2-3 times before I actually do my run on it so that I can help as many people with their game as I can!
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    Re: Remove Region free PVP

    Post by TehInfamousAmos on Fri Nov 23, 2012 7:42 pm

    You don't understand that the fanbase despise the idea of region locked - you realize the games are split across three gaming platforms... now region locking to 3 regions once again will ruin the series. You will be hosting and run into give or take 1 person per hour. You won't meet anyone from this forum (many of the people who I associate with on the forum I consider my friends). It will destroy Fight Clubs as it will ostracize regions from the current FC hosted by NA's. It would be the end of the soul series April - I would rather live with a few laggy matches that are still easy as piss to win than be ostracized from the gaming community. As a youtuber also it would mean that I would only run into 10 subscribers from the EU region.


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    Re: Remove Region free PVP

    Post by aprilmanha on Fri Nov 23, 2012 7:45 pm

    So how do you summon people for planned PVP events then?
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    Re: Remove Region free PVP

    Post by Forum Pirate on Fri Nov 23, 2012 8:03 pm

    Meet in the same place, rss/ cancel 3 times. If we still can't be seen or see the rss we're looking for, reload.

    It works surprisingly well, only rarly do I have to reload when meeting someone for a trade or duel.


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    Re: Remove Region free PVP

    Post by aprilmanha on Fri Nov 23, 2012 8:08 pm

    So you are saying that your PVP would not be changed in the slightest if random invasions were made region locked?
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    Re: Remove Region free PVP

    Post by Forum Pirate on Fri Nov 23, 2012 8:18 pm

    Only that it would be slower. Some of my laggiest matches ever are against people within 500 miles of me where I have had many mostly lag free fights against people in japan, several thousand miles away.


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