Regarding Lagstabs [Can a mod help me move this to PvP pls thx]

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    OrnsteinBro
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    Regarding Lagstabs [Can a mod help me move this to PvP pls thx]

    Post by OrnsteinBro on Fri Nov 16, 2012 9:39 am

    No, I'm not talking about how frustrating they may be, or how to counter them. Most of the pvp savvy crowd should know plenty well about that.

    I'm doing a geographical analysis.

    If you bring up the 'recently met' menu on PC or Xbox when you invade, you'll notice that most of the hornet BSing community seemed to be made up of Spanish/German/Russian/Korean players. (especially true in the forest) I always wondered why this was so.

    All along I thought that it was because they had the largest general latency gap with everyone else (on my screen, players from these countries lagstab from much further than players listed under other nations, barring a few exceptions), and were simply taking advantage of it.

    It took this video to make me realize another possible reason:

    Now, we've all known for a while now that lag is mutual, but I was slow enough that I didn't realize up till now that they, too, get lagstabbed on a frequent basis (possibly more frequently than everyone else). So the video got me thinking, 'maybe they're just fighting fire with fire, and simply hitting back harder than everyone else!' Possibly they started out retaliating against this frustrating issue, and later discovered they were winning frequently with it, and so continued doing so. Upon doing this, they would naturally also build their playstyle and characters around it.

    It seems logical enough to explain for the impartial geographical skew of lagstabbers. Any thoughts?


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    Re: Regarding Lagstabs [Can a mod help me move this to PvP pls thx]

    Post by Tolvo on Fri Nov 16, 2012 12:22 pm

    Indeed it is the case, but the issue comes in that they are adjusted to it. They play with lag always, so if they fight a player who rarely sees lag they have the home field advantage. Though yes, they can get lagstabbed by you just as easily as you can lagstab them. 50/50 it isn't even intentional, it's just that they are playing and its either take a hit or hit them first.

    There are situations though with extreme lag where a person can invade a world, and kill the host before the host is even given the invasion message. I had a few days of bad net where I tested this in the forest and i would invade standing still gankers and kill them.

    But that was an extreme situation, most of the time it said I wasn't even online. There are ways to take advantage of the connection of course, roll BS and Counter BS are great examples of this. Those are usually things capable of being done by every single player though so that is a strictly level playing field.

    Sometimes it's the connection's fault you died, sometimes the other player just used the connection to their advantage when you didn't, it all depends on the event in question. It's really case by case.

    I'll also report this thread, not to get you in trouble but just so a moderator moves this to the PvP section for you.

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    Re: Regarding Lagstabs [Can a mod help me move this to PvP pls thx]

    Post by aprilmanha on Sun Nov 18, 2012 7:08 pm

    I just hope they restrict all PVP in the next game to people who have under 10ms pings in the next game. PVP in a game that is so unforgiving in its combat system if frankly pointless other then for grinding free souls. I have been trying to PVP since I first got into the game but have yet to have a meaningful match yet.

    If you have over the restricted ping ratings it should just ban you from online PVP and give you free should as compensation. It has the same result at the end of the day for everyone and improves it for some at least.
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    Re: Regarding Lagstabs [Can a mod help me move this to PvP pls thx]

    Post by aceluby on Mon Nov 19, 2012 1:32 pm

    aprilmanha wrote:I just hope they restrict all PVP in the next game to people who have under 10ms pings in the next game. PVP in a game that is so unforgiving in its combat system if frankly pointless other then for grinding free souls. I have been trying to PVP since I first got into the game but have yet to have a meaningful match yet.

    If you have over the restricted ping ratings it should just ban you from online PVP and give you free should as compensation. It has the same result at the end of the day for everyone and improves it for some at least.

    If it's everyone you fight there is a very high probability that you're connection is part of the issue, in which case you would probably be banned as well.


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    Re: Regarding Lagstabs [Can a mod help me move this to PvP pls thx]

    Post by Knight Alundil on Mon Nov 19, 2012 1:35 pm

    OrnsteinBro wrote:No, I'm not talking about how frustrating they may be, or how to counter them. Most of the pvp savvy crowd should know plenty well about that.

    I'm doing a geographical analysis.

    If you bring up the 'recently met' menu on PC or Xbox when you invade, you'll notice that most of the hornet BSing community seemed to be made up of Spanish/German/Russian/Korean players. (especially true in the forest) I always wondered why this was so.

    All along I thought that it was because they had the largest general latency gap with everyone else (on my screen, players from these countries lagstab from much further than players listed under other nations, barring a few exceptions), and were simply taking advantage of it.

    It took this video to make me realize another possible reason:

    Now, we've all known for a while now that lag is mutual, but I was slow enough that I didn't realize up till now that they, too, get lagstabbed on a frequent basis (possibly more frequently than everyone else). So the video got me thinking, 'maybe they're just fighting fire with fire, and simply hitting back harder than everyone else!' Possibly they started out retaliating against this frustrating issue, and later discovered they were winning frequently with it, and so continued doing so. Upon doing this, they would naturally also build their playstyle and characters around it.

    It seems logical enough to explain for the impartial geographical skew of lagstabbers. Any thoughts?

    Tolvo wrote:Indeed it is the case, but the issue comes in that they
    are adjusted to it. They play with lag always, so if they fight a
    player who rarely sees lag they have the home field advantage. Though
    yes, they can get lagstabbed by you just as easily as you can lagstab
    them. 50/50 it isn't even intentional, it's just that they are playing
    and its either take a hit or hit them first.

    There are situations
    though with extreme lag where a person can invade a world, and kill the
    host before the host is even given the invasion message. I had a few
    days of bad net where I tested this in the forest and i would invade
    standing still gankers and kill them.

    But that was an extreme
    situation, most of the time it said I wasn't even online. There are
    ways to take advantage of the connection of course, roll BS and Counter
    BS are great examples of this. Those are usually things capable of
    being done by every single player though so that is a strictly level
    playing field.

    Sometimes it's the connection's fault you died,
    sometimes the other player just used the connection to their advantage
    when you didn't, it all depends on the event in question. It's really
    case by case.

    I'll also report this thread, not to get you in trouble but just so a moderator moves this to the PvP section for you.

    This is some really odd things you've said here. You realize this is all relative and you're assuming that where you're from is the "home base" of dark souls and these european countries are outside of that?

    They play with lag always? How? What? No they dont. :|
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    Re: Regarding Lagstabs [Can a mod help me move this to PvP pls thx]

    Post by Tolvo on Mon Nov 19, 2012 2:36 pm

    I'm just speaking about people who typically face lag. Location plays a part in that of course, but if one faces constant lag the location isn't the focus.

    I was merely talking about how lag effects gameplay between players in PvP.

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    Re: Regarding Lagstabs [Can a mod help me move this to PvP pls thx]

    Post by aprilmanha on Mon Nov 19, 2012 9:23 pm

    aceluby wrote:
    aprilmanha wrote:I just hope they restrict all PVP in the next game to people who have under 10ms pings in the next game. PVP in a game that is so unforgiving in its combat system if frankly pointless other then for grinding free souls. I have been trying to PVP since I first got into the game but have yet to have a meaningful match yet.

    If you have over the restricted ping ratings it should just ban you from online PVP and give you free should as compensation. It has the same result at the end of the day for everyone and improves it for some at least.

    If it's everyone you fight there is a very high probability that you're connection is part of the issue, in which case you would probably be banned as well.

    Quite probably, at least then I could enjoy Co-op play without being ganked by lag-stabbers.

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    Re: Regarding Lagstabs [Can a mod help me move this to PvP pls thx]

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