For the next Souls-Game: Lets get some Economics

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    vixder/pennywise
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    For the next Souls-Game: Lets get some Economics

    Post by vixder/pennywise on Tue Oct 30, 2012 11:09 am

    Well, since it can be too long, until the next title drops (1 year, fingers crossed), I thoght about what they could change for the next instalment. What I would wish for is a deeper financial system, which allows players to trade and interact in a market economy. And I don´t mean an auction house.
    This is what I came up with so far:

    New Area: "The Market Place":
    You´ll warp here from a bonfire or archstone. You will apear here as an Phantom, but you won´t be able to use weapons. Via a some kind of comunication (maybe carvings or soulsigns or gestures) you can let other players know your intentions, e.g. "seeking ore", "seeking weapon", "offering souls". If you find a player, who is willing to trade with you, the game could bring both of you to a trading menu, maybe similar to "Fallout"-games, where each player puts stuff on his side of a table and when both click on an "agree"-buton, the trade will be completed.

    New Covenant "The Soul Bank":
    In this market place there could be a covenant to join: the Soul Bank. Members of the bank can offer loans to other players.
    Imagine you are a new charakter and you are in an area you can´t complete, because you are to week. Normally you would start farming/grinding to get more powerful. With this new covanant, you could travel to the market place and visit the soul bank. There several members of the bank would offer you loans with fixed interests and payback deadlines (which are fixed by the member of the bank). So you borrow, i don´t know, like 50.000 souls with an interest of 1.5% per day (Oh yeah, Night/Day-cycles for the next souls game would be necessary) which you have to pay back in 14 days.
    If you fail to pay your debt in time, the member of the bank will receive an orb, which allows him to invade you at any time you and him are online, doesn´t matter if you´re hollow or human. If the member kills you, he will receive all the souls you are carrying and your bloodstain won´tt give you your souls back. This will go on, until all the debt plus interest is paid back. At that point the orb will disapear from the members inventory.

    New Covenant "Arms for hire":
    Like the Sunbros, only you will have to pay souls for summoning these guys. The soul signs of this covenant should include a trail/victory-ratio. Let´s say an Arms for Hire was summond 20 times for a boss and defeated the boss 18 times. You would have to pay him more to summon him, than you´d have to pay someone, who was summond 20 times, but only defeated the boss 15 times.

    New Covenant "The Headhunters":
    So, you get invaded and your invader turns out to be an ******. Backstabbing, spell-spamming, rude, whatever. Instead of putting his name into the "Book of Guilty", you can put a bounty on his head. For a small administrative charge you can put out an contract for the headhunters. This guy made you mad and you are willing to pay like 50.000 souls for his head. Now the headhunter finds your contract at HQ, takes the contract (for another small administrative charge) and gets an orb which lets him invade the world of said offender. If he kills him, he gets the reward, the guy who put out the contract gets some kind of souvenier of reprisal. If the headhunter gets killed by the offender, he loses the contract and will have to buy it again.

    So, these are my thougts so far. Also thinking about some kind of "Warlords"-Covenant, which are covenants made by players, but I´m not to sure right now, where I wanne go with this.
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    Re: For the next Souls-Game: Lets get some Economics

    Post by Conrack on Tue Oct 30, 2012 2:37 pm

    My problem with this is all of these new ideas is that they all effect multiplayer only, Traditionally the souls games are singleplayer with an multiplayer spin (which I love, its very inovative and fun).

    The singleplayer aspect has been whats drawn me into the series more than the multiplayer, most importantly how death was handeled.

    that said an improvement to the darkmoon bades (allowing them to invade sinners even if the boss is dead) would make sin have more weight, rather than "oh hey I sinned oh well more phantoms to kill".

    sorry if this isnt completely relevent as this is my first post on this forum.
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    Re: For the next Souls-Game: Lets get some Economics

    Post by Mr. Tart on Tue Oct 30, 2012 2:39 pm

    I don't feel that it would be very Soul-like, but y'know, the idea itself isn't bad. If somehow it could be changed to go along with the Soul Series than yeah, that would be cool. It's just kind of hard imagining the idea of economy in a world such as the one present in the Soul Series, y'know?


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    Re: For the next Souls-Game: Lets get some Economics

    Post by FruitPunchNinja on Tue Oct 30, 2012 2:48 pm

    Lots of fans seem to want to turn Souls into a completely different game, its formula is damn near perfect there is no need for any major changes. I would like to see maybe another Fromsoft action rpg, or some other good developer take note on the amazing combat and online mechanics.
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    Re: For the next Souls-Game: Lets get some Economics

    Post by vixder/pennywise on Tue Oct 30, 2012 2:53 pm

    I know what you mean. But I think, that the Souls you get become useless at some point. You don´t want to level too high cause of PVP, you don´t need to upgrade your equipment anymore. And thats basically the point I want to make. It would be cool to have a way to use your souls (or ore or humanity) for something completly diffrent.

    And I think it depents on how you package it. I loved the save haven that was the Nexus in Demon´s. The market could be like that, the only place in the world, where you´re not threatend by anything.
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    Re: For the next Souls-Game: Lets get some Economics

    Post by Mr. Tart on Tue Oct 30, 2012 3:03 pm

    How about just implementing a trading system were if you do this certain gesture, a trading window opens up, if the other player accepts it, and then you can just trade. Easy as that.

    As for offline mode, one could just make it possible to sell items to the characters that you can buy from as well.


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    Re: For the next Souls-Game: Lets get some Economics

    Post by mugenis4real on Tue Oct 30, 2012 3:06 pm

    I think souls is perfect the way it is right now to be honest. Praise the Sun

    Implementing a marketplace into the game just doesn't feel very "Souls" to me. Shrug
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    Re: For the next Souls-Game: Lets get some Economics

    Post by Corporal Maxey on Tue Oct 30, 2012 5:40 pm

    Mr. Tart wrote:How about just implementing a trading system were if you do this certain gesture, a trading window opens up, if the other player accepts it, and then you can just trade. Easy as that.

    As for offline mode, one could just make it possible to sell items to the characters that you can buy from as well.
    I agree with the trading thing. I'd like a system like Borderlands 2's trade.
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    Re: For the next Souls-Game: Lets get some Economics

    Post by ViralEnsign_ on Tue Oct 30, 2012 6:07 pm

    You know I was talking with Billy about adding ann economy system to Dark Souls or the next souls game.... instead of having NPC merchants you have Players become merchants themselves, finding and selling items.

    I realise there would be those total idiots who try to sell items at ridiculous prices but if I got my hands on gear to sell I would be very reasonable in my pricing.


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    Re: For the next Souls-Game: Lets get some Economics

    Post by JoeBroski09 on Tue Oct 30, 2012 6:21 pm

    I like the idea Viral implemented, where the players are the merchants instead of the in-game merchants. Though, I think that'd kinda kill offline mode.

    Here's my spin on Viral's spin on the original idea. A Trade Summon Sign. Make it green or blue or something, and you come up, in the Domhnall of Zena position, and you have a set of things you can say, like gestures. It's things that indicate if you're selling weapons, trinkets, or something else, and you have to have only one type of item to sell. If you're selling weapons, that's it, same with armor, arrows, etc. Also, I think it'd be awesome to have a Domhnall of Zena covenant, like the Player Made Covenant.

    You can only summon if the area boss is alive, that way you can only buy things if you need help, and the level restriction would apply. This way, a high sl can't sell a bunch of slabs, or something like that.

    And I think the items couldn't be upgraded. Makes it simpler.


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    Re: For the next Souls-Game: Lets get some Economics

    Post by ViralEnsign_ on Tue Oct 30, 2012 6:23 pm

    OH I LIKE THAT! I did think summon sign for getting the phantoms into your world.... perhaps event a window where the merchant can place his wares and set the price for them prior to the trade.

    Or a trade window where a player can demand a weapon or offer one to sell and the merchant can match that demand or item.

    OH and Joe therre was a Dark Souls Domnhall merchant group... Zena Peddler Princes...but Skare and I were the only practicing merchants....


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    Re: For the next Souls-Game: Lets get some Economics

    Post by JoeBroski09 on Tue Oct 30, 2012 6:28 pm

    Hmm. Ok, Ok. If you're not in the covenant, you get a buy stone. If you are in the covenant, you also get a sell stone. You can set up what you have in the menu by "checking your summon sign." Then waiting. You can only still see signs if you have a boss alive. This makes the covenant more attractive because you can still trade even if you've killed bosses. If you put down your buy stone sign, then you then get summoned, and people can then sell the items you already set up.

    You can't see the items before you summon, but you can see what type, like weapons, armor, ore, etc. Like if you see someone dressed as a mage before summoning them, you know what type of combat they are. You can then set up a tank, mage, or whatever.

    I could go on, but the details would be up to From.


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    Re: For the next Souls-Game: Lets get some Economics

    Post by Onion Knight on Tue Oct 30, 2012 6:32 pm

    Sounds like a genre of games I've played before ..... what were they called? All those PC games were you played with hundreds of other players online ... if only I could remember the name of that genre ....


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    Re: For the next Souls-Game: Lets get some Economics

    Post by JoeBroski09 on Tue Oct 30, 2012 6:33 pm

    Lol. Well, summon sign would completely make it so much more separated than an MMMO's auction house. That is, if you're replying to my post.

    If you're replying to the OP, yeah, it looks a bit like an auction house.


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    Re: For the next Souls-Game: Lets get some Economics

    Post by Onion Knight on Tue Oct 30, 2012 6:38 pm

    To the op. Seen lot's of weird suggestions on here like separating the PVE and the PVP into separate servers. Combine that with this idea , you've basically got Guild Wars.


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    Re: For the next Souls-Game: Lets get some Economics

    Post by vixder/pennywise on Wed Oct 31, 2012 7:55 am

    Well, I have never played an mmorpg in my life, so I wouldn´t know. I realy want the series to stay the same in that regard: Every player has his own world, this world can only be manipulated by that player and for multiplayer he must summon someone to his world or travel to another players world.
    As for the changes in the series: I would be disapointed if the next soul title is just a clone of Dark Souls with new textures.There were a lot of changes from Demon´s to Dark Souls and all were for the better (well, maybe they could bring world/character tendencies back). Going from Level-based structure to an open world was a big deal and I expect a similar change for the next game.

    Also, I would love the inclusion of new area, comperable to the ancient cave in Lufia (or Lufia 2, I get confused). Like a tower with a bonfire at the bottom, where you have to defeat several diffrent levels of mobs and boss-mobs, with a super rare, super awsome item at the top.

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