How do you beat Spears?

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    Seignar
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    How do you beat Spears?

    Post by Seignar on Fri Sep 28, 2012 12:34 am

    How do you beat these guys? I don't mean the newbies that can be parried, I'm talking professional spear users that are impossible to parry. You can't hit them because they have insane reach (and good damage output), you can't quite use a bow or they'll get aggressive with you (they kinda are already), you can't use magic because they have quick recovery. In some cases you can't even roll BS because they are just THAT good.

    I mean, say what you like about their damage ourputs, but I would place the Demon's Spear as one of the top weapons in PVP just because its insane reach and the fact that it is still mildly decent with little to no stat investment (and you kind of do invest some stats to it in builds). The DSS requires some investment, but its damage is noticeable and can make quick work of you. If for some reason, you actually force them to switch from 2H to spear&shield, they have the option to turtle you and even poke you for good damage with the Leo Ring (and that nerf rarely means anything because they'll just do it more slowly; you can't chase them forever).

    How do you kill something you can't hit? Most spear users CAN chip damage you with lightning and even magic if it's the Butterfly Spear.

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    Re: How do you beat Spears?

    Post by cloudyeki on Fri Sep 28, 2012 12:42 am

    Bow and poison arrows and kiting (baiting them to charge and landing an arrow in their head to stop their attack) or using a weapon with a great running r1 and locking off.

    In other words, keep moving and placing the occasional hit.


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    Re: How do you beat Spears?

    Post by goober0331 on Fri Sep 28, 2012 12:45 am

    Just stick close to em if your fast rolling. If your med or fat rolling then your just screwed.

    I have a SKS build and the only thing that really troubles me is tank flippers and phantom range, which is so very annoying. I hate being clearly out of someones range only to have my health get chopped away a few seconds after they attacked cause the lag is awful. And tank flippers dont require any explanation.

    But yea just stick close and try to hit em right before/during their rolls and you will be able to chip their health away.

    And as always, BE PATIENT!!!!

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    Re: How do you beat Spears?

    Post by lilpoindexter98* on Fri Sep 28, 2012 12:46 am

    wat i do is use Wrath of gods on then wen u get the opening
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    Re: How do you beat Spears?

    Post by DoughGuy on Fri Sep 28, 2012 12:50 am

    Approach them at an angle. Head slightly o the left or right so their thrust misses you.


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    Re: How do you beat Spears?

    Post by WyrmHero on Fri Sep 28, 2012 12:59 am

    They can't be beaten, they're immortal. Just kidding btw.

    I spent a whole fight against one of my friends who used a SKS spear firing my crossbow. The fight lasted around 15 mins. I bring his HP almost to 25%, while my was at around 75%. He then panicked and began BS fishing and changed his strategy and defeated me. The best ways to counter spears is by using this method (kiting with a bow), turtling with a spear or rapier, and spear vs spear dodging poke madness.


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    Re: How do you beat Spears?

    Post by WarriorOfBenOwnage on Fri Sep 28, 2012 1:05 am

    Try some of the overhead Halberds (i.e. Gargoyle's, Black Knight's, Regular Scythe). They have almost spear worthy range, really high damage, and good speed. Take every opening possible and out aggressive them.


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    Re: How do you beat Spears?

    Post by lilpoindexter98* on Fri Sep 28, 2012 1:13 am

    using halberds an scythe leave u open to a attack u can take advantage of them wit spears
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    Re: How do you beat Spears?

    Post by Forum Pirate on Fri Sep 28, 2012 1:23 am

    My only counters are the washing pole (which shouldn't need explination) greatscythe running attacks, fast rolling large club roll r1 spam, and using a spear my self.


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    Re: How do you beat Spears?

    Post by mugenis4real on Fri Sep 28, 2012 1:51 am

    Just be really aggressive and go for the backstab. Shrug

    There's no way your busting through a Havel's Greatshield without packing a nuke so that's really your best bet. After being in the fight a while, they usually slip up.
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    Re: How do you beat Spears?

    Post by Forum Pirate on Fri Sep 28, 2012 1:54 am

    They'll kick or counter bs or counter parry. I watch it happen. I've done it.


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    Re: How do you beat Spears?

    Post by mugenis4real on Fri Sep 28, 2012 2:13 am

    Forum Pirate wrote:They'll kick or counter bs or counter parry. I watch it happen. I've done it.

    I don't know why but for some reason I read your post in a gruff "I'll kill your whole family" voice. I think that little "Iv'e done it" right at the end there is the culprit. :pale:

    And good point although this hasn't happened to myself, I could definitely see it happening. Proper Bow
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    Re: How do you beat Spears?

    Post by somnam on Fri Sep 28, 2012 2:35 am

    Spear users are actually kind of predictable, you can see when they stop strafing and are actually looking to stab at you, and once they press R1 they're immobile.

    Those things together usually mean roll bses are on the table for anyone who is fast rolling or flipping.

    If you aren't fast, then take a high amount of poise and a huge weapon and do a jump attack, they usually act like you can't possibly reach them and that hubris is worth punishing.
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    Re: How do you beat Spears?

    Post by Rynn on Fri Sep 28, 2012 3:22 am

    spear users are not invincible, but they are using one of the best weapons in the entire game. Most spears fall into the jack of all stats criteria.
    http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/JackOfAllStats

    The Jack-of-All-Stats is often a good character for beginners to use as they get the hang of the controls; this character lacks the extremes that might trip up a novice. It is also a solid choice for advanced players who do not want to worry about opponents preying on their weaknesses. Whether the character retains his usefulness as the player's skill grows depends on how much the game rewards versatility as opposed to pure power, but the Jack-of-All-Stats is almost never the best character in any given game or a Game Breaker.

    So, seriously enough, the longer spears, the greatsword of artorias, and the washing pole are the jack of all stats weapons in this game. The strengths of most spears and greatswords make them insanely good weapons, as do Katana's, most notably the washing pole.

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    Re: How do you beat Spears?

    Post by Rynn on Fri Sep 28, 2012 3:28 am

    Now personally, i think the Dragon Slayer Spear is, just honestly, objectively the -best- weapon in the entire game. It's got Very high speed, damage, range, and viable weight, while also having a special ability. I don't think it can be debated that the dragonslayer spear is at least better then 80% of the weapons in the game, in each category, giving it the perfect amount of strength, speed, damage, etc... to be considered balanced, but still the overall best weapon in the entire game. The fact thsat Dragon Slayer Spear users are still killed, in my opinion, does not discredit my point, but rather proves gear is not everything in this game.
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    Re: How do you beat Spears?

    Post by DamageCK on Fri Sep 28, 2012 4:19 am

    A lot of times, you don't.


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    Re: How do you beat Spears?

    Post by Raptrojo on Fri Sep 28, 2012 7:52 am

    A good spear user cant be won...the only way i have found is butterfly horn and turtle or hornet/backs...
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    Re: How do you beat Spears?

    Post by lordgodofhell on Fri Sep 28, 2012 8:43 am


    Practice your parry more. Everyone has some viable ideas that will all work to varying degree depending on how skilled and aware of your tactics the spear user is.

    After some practice, I find Buckler to be great against spear user/turtlers. I combo that with a chaos blade/zap rapier right hand.

    For your build I would advise having lots of HP and at least enough poise to tank 2 consecutive 2 handed thrusts. The reason for this is that 2 handed a kat breaks 61 poise after only 2 hits. So if you can win a war of attrition and stun them before they do you, you have higher damage and bleed on your side.

    The flippy ring makes spells of all kinds less viable than if they do not use it.

    A steady balance of locked off swings will let you be able to spam them without fear of being parried and will give you a good chance of dead angling with the katana (which I love !)

    What I am getting at is using a wep with higher stun capabilities and keeping the zap rapier in secondary RH to inflict the riposte damage.

    Make them think you are out of stam, when you have just enough to parry them. This can be done by attacking a few times consecutively, allowing them to reduce some of your stam with a kick (usually followed by one spear thrust), or even bow baiting them if you have it. They often thrust after you make your move, just be sure it is one that can have a follow up parry!



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    Re: How do you beat Spears?

    Post by WyrmHero on Fri Sep 28, 2012 8:53 am

    ^It's actually 62. I have done that strategy and it works pretty well but now that the DWGR's getting nerfed I'm aiming to 93 with med roll to tank 3 hits.


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    Re: How do you beat Spears?

    Post by lordgodofhell on Fri Sep 28, 2012 9:04 am

    WyrmHero wrote:^It's actually 62. I have done that strategy and it works pretty well but now that the DWGR's getting nerfed I'm aiming to 93 with med roll to tank 3 hits.

    62 poise would TANK 2 hits. I said that the 2 handed Kat BREAKS 61 i.e. stuns at 61. Sorry for the confusion.


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    Re: How do you beat Spears?

    Post by Lord of Ash on Fri Sep 28, 2012 10:57 am

    Im a spear and longsword user and like you said its hard for people to reach me the best way to kill us is have high poise and great sword (Enchanted or moonlight work best for shields) and just rush in break any gaurd they have, a WOG wouldnt hurt either.


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    Re: How do you beat Spears?

    Post by WyrmHero on Fri Sep 28, 2012 11:07 am

    lordgodofhell wrote:
    WyrmHero wrote:^It's actually 62. I have done that strategy and it works pretty well but now that the DWGR's getting nerfed I'm aiming to 93 with med roll to tank 3 hits.

    62 poise would TANK 2 hits. I said that the 2 handed Kat BREAKS 61 i.e. stuns at 61. Sorry for the confusion.

    That happens when I read too fast looking for numbers lol. Sorry me. silly


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    Re: How do you beat Spears?

    Post by OrnsteinBro on Fri Sep 28, 2012 6:37 pm

    goober0331 wrote: I hate being clearly out of someones range only to have my health get chopped away a few seconds after they attacked cause the lag is awful.

    Hahaha, that. But to use that special latency sorcery you kind of have to be European, lol.


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    Re: How do you beat Spears?

    Post by Forum Pirate on Fri Sep 28, 2012 6:42 pm

    I wouldn't rely on parrying to counter spears. Its extremely easy to be entirely un parriable with a spear due to the long range. If someone lets you parry their spear their abilities with said spear are suspect.


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    Re: How do you beat Spears?

    Post by cloudyeki on Fri Sep 28, 2012 6:51 pm

    Ya know, how many people have tried rolling straight through a spear users r-1 spam and come out of said roll with a parry? I've done it once while I was a forest hunter, and I just smashed O and my fingers slipped on the triggers. BAM Instant reposte and it took me a second to realize what I did.


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