next build suggestion?

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    tard01
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    next build suggestion?

    Post by tard01 on Sat Sep 15, 2012 11:57 pm

    hey guys, looking for suggestion on next build.

    I just finished a playthrough using dex/balder side sword w/ greater magic weapon
    i just got GSoA(cursed) and was very not impressed (sad face).

    I am considering (in order)
    Moonlight greatsword - int/vit/end
    man-serpent +15 - str/vit/end
    I lean away from dragon king great axe and the dragon 50str sword... i forgot name. however, i am debating them none-the-less.

    are there any other builds i should consider for high damage? not just crazy buff burst dmg for 1 minute. i'd like higher damage/speed for clearing, and then just add in something for bosses.

    Thanks in advance.

    side note - i've never tried a faith build. i'd be willing to try one, but can't find a suitable weapon for it.....
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    Re: next build suggestion?

    Post by CandleMax on Sun Sep 16, 2012 2:49 am

    If you're looking for a good faith weapon, try the grant. At 50 strength and 40 faith it has 725 AR.


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    Re: next build suggestion?

    Post by tard01 on Sun Sep 16, 2012 10:55 am

    ya, but that AR is split between two - phys and magi. ive read a lot of people screaming to avoid that. not sure where it stacks up.

    also, i assume great hammers attack speed is on par with ultra swords? or is it great swords? I have reluctance using ultra swords.

    also, the design looks like poo, but i may give it a go anyway.
    i hate that it is in catacombs/tombs... i try to avoid that place at all costs, hah.


    any idea if it can be buffed?
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    reim0027
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    Re: next build suggestion?

    Post by reim0027 on Sun Sep 16, 2012 1:50 pm

    Are you talking about the Grant? The Grant can't be buffed.


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    Re: next build suggestion?

    Post by Siegfried. on Sun Sep 16, 2012 2:04 pm

    When you say damage, do you mean strike damage or DPS? Because strength builds will excel at landing high damage in a single hit, but dexterity builds can deal significantly more damage in the same timeframe with the correct opportunities.

    In any case, I'm currently enjoying my ranger-ish build right now. In terms of stats, it's more or less a standard dexterity build with 16 strength for the Silver Knight Sword, but with archery for backup. For some reason, the Silver Knight Sword heavy attacks just seem to wreck most enemies and bosses, at least in PvE. That sword cleaves right through Smough & Ornstein, Priscilla, Gwyndolin and Sif like it isn't even a thing. I'm almost entirely sure its heavy attacks allow it to deal damage way, way outside of its weapon class. And quite rightly so, I'd say, given the high stamina cost of the heavy attacks.

    Another build you could try is the Lifehunt build. Same stats, really -- a dexterity build with 16 strength. You use the Lifehunt Scythe, the Bloodbite Ring, the Bloodshield and any armour that provides high resistance to bleeding. Congratulations -- enjoy your 750 bleed resistance, effectively making you immune to the ill effects of the Lifehunt Scythe while also allowing you to cut an enemy's HP in half as long as you don't kill them before the bleed effect takes place.

    Another idea is to make a "quality faith" build with the Dragonslayer Spear, the Leo Ring and the Hornet Ring. Essentially, you take your strength to 24, then max out your dexterity and faith as much as possible without too heavily hurting your endurance and vitality. The Leo Ring increases damage by a whopping 40% for interrupting an enemy's attack with your own, and I shouldn't have to explain the Hornet Ring. This is an ideal combination for fighting simultaneously with your adversary via intercepting attacks and parries, rather than striking first or waiting for an enemy to spend their attacks.

    Although, for me, the ultimate damage-dealer (in balance with other factors) is the quality zweihander build. You know the drill -- 27 strength, 40 dexterity and a massive bloody sword. In two hands, your zweihander should have an attack rating of 610 and deal stupid amounts of poise damage. This isn't the most efficient way to deal damage over time, but it's a simple build that wrecks Tokyo like Godzilla because of its combination of range, HP damage and poise damage.
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    Re: next build suggestion?

    Post by tard01 on Sun Sep 16, 2012 2:44 pm

    Siegfried. wrote:
    Although, for me, the ultimate damage-dealer (in balance with other factors) is the quality zweihander build. You know the drill -- 27 strength, 40 dexterity and a massive bloody sword. In two hands, your zweihander should have an attack rating of 610 and deal stupid amounts of poise damage. This isn't the most efficient way to deal damage over time, but it's a simple build that wrecks Tokyo like Godzilla because of its combination of range, HP damage and poise damage.

    i may go back and try a Zwei build. I was running claymore/man-serpent/Zwei when starting a STR build, but i diverted my STR char to build an artorias cursed sword char.

    I was liking the claymore until i stopped upgrading it due to the damage being less than the man-serpent. I was doing decent with man-serpent, but it never quite felt as powerful on bosses as the Z did.



    Why would i go minimum str and max dex with zwei? It scales C str, D dex. Am i missing something?
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    Re: next build suggestion?

    Post by Siegfried. on Sun Sep 16, 2012 2:50 pm

    Efficiency. When you use two hands, your strength is multiplied by 1.5, not counting decimals. So 27 strength gets an additional 13 points of strength added to it, providing you, ultimately, with 40 strength. The zweihander's attacks are also faster when used two-handed, and its combination of poise damage and range mean you can use its attacks to defend yourself rather than a shield as long as you control the fight.

    So you save 13 points of strength with no real downside, which allows you to invest said points in other stats for whatever kind of build you want. You could, for instance, splash into a bit of attunement and intelligence, using Great Magic Weapon and an Oolacile Ivory Catalyst to add even more damage. Or you could just throw those points into vitality. Or whatever you like, really. The point is that you save 13 points, and your character build will be that much more efficient for it.
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    Re: next build suggestion?

    Post by tard01 on Sun Sep 16, 2012 4:20 pm

    Siegfried. wrote:Efficiency. When you use two hands, your strength is multiplied by 1.5, not counting decimals. So 27 strength gets an additional 13 points of strength added to it, providing you, ultimately, with 40 strength. The zweihander's attacks are also faster when used two-handed, and its combination of poise damage and range mean you can use its attacks to defend yourself rather than a shield as long as you control the fight.

    So you save 13 points of strength with no real downside, which allows you to invest said points in other stats for whatever kind of build you want. You could, for instance, splash into a bit of attunement and intelligence, using Great Magic Weapon and an Oolacile Ivory Catalyst to add even more damage. Or you could just throw those points into vitality. Or whatever you like, really. The point is that you save 13 points, and your character build will be that much more efficient for it.


    i get the logic behind 2h'ing it and saving STR points. i guess i didnt understand why you said dex. I guess you were just tossing out a random stat.


    i've never done a faith build before. I'm mildly curious. All my previous builds were splashed with INT for greater magic weapon, but mainly focused on power within.


    I made a list just now of all weapons i cam considering either spec'ing for, or using along the way for a comparable spec.


    I've never considered the demon great machete before... it has my attention right now.

    you mention poise damage - is tehre any way to calculate this? Or are all weapons of that type the same (all ultra GS's the same?) I was considering using a Ultra-GS and GS secondary. Below are incoherent data i pulled from char planner using +15 normal when given the option. Only the machete and man-serpent are buffable, leaving me to choose them. All stats were compared at 40 unless otherwise stated.

    ====================
    ULTRA GREATSWORDS
    cursed GSoA - 40/40/40/40 - 539 < ignoring, just there to compare
    black knight greatsword - 596 40/40 (b/e)
    *demon great machete - 655/636 - b str to A str ----- 641@ 30str
    dragon greatsword -585- no scaling


    ===============
    GREATSWORDS
    *man-serpent greatsword - 521 40 (scale b str)





    I am now also debating giving club/mace/great club/large club a try also since they also use STR.

    And since i'm debating going faith, Grant is now also on my list as a possible choice for at least testing to see if i like it. it's quite a large stat investment, so i'd probably just work towards it, rather than for it specifically.




    I didnt seem to care much for the axe's.
    I was also very concerned about the moonlight sword doing proper/comporable damage. I'm not a giant fan of the damage spells using int. I mainly just use INT to buff.



    i've done a build using balder side sword... i'm wondering how effectively different uchi/aito is considering the bleed effect. Is it that noticeable?





















    =========================================
    HAMMER
    *club - 407/392
    *mace - 442


    *great club - 657 (a str - 28str/1h) <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<
    *large club - 634 @40 - a scale
    demon's great hammer 647 @ 40



    grant -
    34str/30faith - 674 (split damage) - str/faith scale, cant buff - 2h
    50str/30faith - 684
    40/40 - 729


    =============================================
    AXES
    black knight greataxe - 632
    dragon king greataxe -570- no scaling
    demon greataxe - 40str - 670 - str A scaling / 50str - 686
    black knight greataxe - 50/18 637


    ==========================
    DEX SWORDS
    *balder side sword - 399 @ 40/40
    *uchi - 420 w/ bleed 40d
    chaos blade - 372
    *aito - 410


    ============
    INT SWORDS
    moonlight 40int 472 (all magi) - S scale int
    Zwei - 40 str 551 c/d str/dex scale all phys
    40str/40dex = 621
    24str/40dex = 589




    * = buffable
    only weapon that sales with faith on this is grant.
    only weapon that scales with itn on this is moonblade greatsword.
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    Re: next build suggestion?

    Post by reim0027 on Sun Sep 16, 2012 4:35 pm

    You can't compare weapons by their AR. That is very misleading. IT varies significantly once you take your opponent's defenses into account. Typically, weapons that split their damage among other paths (like physical/fire or physical/magic) have more reductions in their damage and are therefore weaker. That is where +15 shines (and weapons that deal pure magic, like MLGS).


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    Re: next build suggestion?

    Post by RANT on Sun Sep 16, 2012 5:07 pm

    go with Grant!! its really the only great 'club' i never get bored of because its so cool, clubs get boring really fast(i love them though). i always one hand my weapons since it gives you more moves and more versatility with whatever weapons youre using. my very first pvp build was a grant(leeroy) build and to this day its my favourite build i have, you can use any str weapons and you can buff and have defensive spells like force and wog for those parry spammers.


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    Re: next build suggestion?

    Post by IV_Mark_VI on Mon Sep 17, 2012 6:12 pm

    If you're relatively new to the game, I'd suggest this route:

    Pump 27str, and some into vit/end. Use a claymore or Bastard sword. Then pump Dex to 40. Two handed weapons are like a 40/40 quality build; claymores are awesome, and so are things like the Silver Knight Spear in PvP. Then focus on Faith.

    This was one of the most fun builds / approaches I've used, because you can use almost every weapon and is very effective for PvP very quickly.


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