semi noob help - armor sets

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    tard01
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    semi noob help - armor sets

    Post by tard01 on Mon Sep 10, 2012 4:26 pm

    Ok, i'm partial noob. Gotten past new lando once, then stopped playing that char and made a bunch of test chars that i never really got the hang of.

    fast forward, i picked up DkS again and i feel much more comfortable.

    Right now I've just entered new lando for the first time using my new char and i've gone 16str/16dex, 33end, 21vit, and i just began to put points to get 2 spell slots (atunement) and will eventually get 12 or 15 int for power within/magic weapon.

    (I'm playing on 360)
    My concern is, pretty much the moment i hit Sen's, my +6 longsword felt super weak. My backup weapon is a +4 estoc. I have balder's shield and eagle shield. When I picked up the lightning spear, it felt ultra powerful to the point that it made the longsword/estoc combo i was using feel pretty useless. Long term i was probably going to go with power within + crystal magic sword to try and take advantage of the faster attack speed + base dmg increase. I was basically going to use the lightning spear until i could get some more blacksmith upgrades on the longsword/estoc and also in hte process unlock magic weapon, then long term crystal weapon. I guess my question is - does this seem like a viable build/path? I'm at the point where it'd be super easy to edit my build, but going any further would basically make me feel compelled to start over if i made a bad choice. I've gone 16str/16dex and primarily the rest in end/vit and barely anything in atunement, so now is the time to change or get recommendations.
    note - i'm not real good at knowing what types of drops to go get. everything i've gotten has been luck to this point basically. i got the gold-armor set behind ceaseless discharge and gargoyle helm. havel's ring and ring of favor/protection, if curious. Eagle/balder shield.





    2nd question -
    I am conflicted between 2 concepts.
    1) edit my existing char from 16str/dex to 24-28str for bigger sword (zwei or serpent GS or claymore) and continue trying to stick to lighter armor and avoidance/shield using 1hand.

    2) i've always wanted to try a pure 2h STR char. The mistake i always made in hte past was going for light weight too much vs poise. I never understood what poise did and didn't feel the dmg mitigation from heavier armor was that effective.
    So - my actual question is - if i decided to go for a pure 2h STR char, can someone recommend some early armor sets? Ideally i'd like to almost exclusively go 2h and only use shield for certain fights. What is some easy to get early-game armor with dmg reduction and POISE to get?
    Also, if i chose to use a STR wep at 24str... should i stop at 24str, or raise it up more? I tend to like the idea of maybe doing 40end, 24 (or 28) STR, 14atunement, 15+ int, and vitality.

    that being said, i've never even come close to trying a pure 2h build and have no idea what they're like or if i'd be able to play well with one. I'm far from newb at fighting, but i'm no pro. I've got maybe 9 deaths to new lando? most on capra demon (bad luck) hah.



    side note - i tend to prefer skipping drake sword. I also tend to go for 16 dex so i can use poison arrows / bow.



    this post got a LOT longer than originally intended, so any resposnes/time from people are greatly appreciated.


    I'm also tempted to buy teh Prepare to Die edition for PC just for some of the balance fixes they did.
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    Re: semi noob help - armor sets

    Post by Pratix on Mon Sep 10, 2012 4:42 pm

    Well first off. I think that having 16/16 dex and str isn't very efficient. Although it isn't too late. If you can get a +10 katana, make the Chaos blade from Quelaags souls. Also for a good amount of poise I'd suggest elite knight armor. It has good def and poise. But the new update will ruin the Dark Wood Grain ring.

    So my setup for you would be:
    Armor: Any lightweight armor you like.
    Rings: RoFaP and Wolf Ring
    Stats:
    Vitality:25-30
    Attunment:12
    End:40
    Str:16
    Dex:40
    Magic:15-30

    Weapons: Chaos Blade +5 and ten soft humanity, Balder Side Sword +15
    Sheilds: Grass Crest max level.

    Spells: PW, and Great Magic weapon. But if you get 30 Magic get Crystal Magic Weapon.

    This setup is a good setup with 40 poise, strong weapons, and good spells.

    For str build try using this: http://tinyurl.com/8f9d93w

    It can use CMW for buffing the Zweihander +15 to a whopping 800+ AR. And has a backup gravelord sword for faster swings. Also with Black Iron you get great poise and high def.

    Hope this helps!!


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    Re: semi noob help - armor sets

    Post by callipygias on Mon Sep 10, 2012 4:57 pm

    So it sounds like you're a strength guy. Assuming this character is mainly for PvE and you're happy 2-handing the bigger swords (for now), I'd probably spend some levels getting a few attune slots, and getting your int to where you can use the spells you want, then I'd start raising strength, eventually getting to 40. You'll also want to get Endurance to 40, and eventually Vitality too if you're going through NG+.

    You can get the Black Iron armor set in Anor Londo, in the room with the giant painting of Ariamis. You enter that room from the upper part of the moving bridge platform when it is in its lowet position. Even with the FaP Ring you won't have better than a medium roll though, if that matters to you


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    Re: semi noob help - armor sets

    Post by tard01 on Mon Sep 10, 2012 5:26 pm

    is there a better hvy armor set i can get before anor lando? seems fairly late in the game to get before i'd feel comfortable trying for exclusive 2hand style.

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    Re: semi noob help - armor sets

    Post by IV_Mark_VI on Mon Sep 10, 2012 5:28 pm

    Your two concepts don't really go hand in hand I feel.

    You're new to dark souls, so what you're looking for is a levelling up guide/path.

    If you go with a big, 2H weapon, Magic weapon and Great magic weapon don't make much difference.

    Your idea to use a lighter weapon and buff it is viable; not optimal, but viable. I have a build I'm doing that myself. Magic weapon/greatmagic weapon/crystal magic weapon all add in their damage per attack; so if you attack frequently with a light weapon, that stacks up the damage, where abig weapon you can only swing twice, doesn't maximize on that. It's good for PvP end game builds, but not on this PvE first time through build.

    My advice, try out your original concept of using Magic Weapon and Great magic weapon. Leave your INT at 15 for now. Longsword is good, but upgrade it to +10. Sen's Fortress sells large shards. Get the Oocaile catalyst (it's in Dark Root Basin). An ATT of 12 is fine for now.

    I've read the posts on recommended areas to beat, and this is the order that I would recommend a new player beating the game:

    Burg, Parish, Lowerburg, Sewers, Forest (moonlight butterfly and hopefully some anti-poison), Blight town (kill queelag), Dark Root Basin (kill hydra), possibly get Stone Armour depending on your build), then Sen's. Forest can be done before Sewers, the Elite Knight Armour and Wolf ring are so valuable. Also, if you don't take Master Key, getting the key from the forest to Havel is amazing as well.

    Most people do: Burg, Parish, Lowerburg, Sewers, Blighttown, Sens, only running into the forest to get some key gear.

    For your build, the Ooc catalyst is very important and will add a lot of bang. You only need a 10 INT starting off, a 12 to use the catalyst, and a 15 for Great magic weapon. Not much investment.

    Get a lingering dragon ring. You can cast with the ring on, then swtich it for something else and the duration stays increased. Good for entering a boss fight or other tough area. Use a weapon that swings fast for low stamina. Longsword, falchion, lots of weapons fit into this category. Dex weapons fit into a buffed build better, so levelling up Dex as opposed to STR is better I think.

    Your stats and build are good; just have to upgrade your gear.

    EDIT: If you want to go big 2H weapons, kill the Hydra, and sneak in the back way to get the Stone Armour to the Forest. Even if you're moving at slow speed, the defence it offers is top notch. With your endurance, grab Havel's ring and you should be just fine.


    Last edited by IV_Mark_VI on Mon Sep 10, 2012 5:38 pm; edited 1 time in total


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    Re: semi noob help - armor sets

    Post by tard01 on Mon Sep 10, 2012 5:31 pm

    callipygias wrote:So it sounds like you're a strength guy. Assuming this character is mainly for PvE and you're happy 2-handing the bigger swords (for now), I'd probably spend some levels getting a few attune slots, and getting your int to where you can use the spells you want, then I'd start raising strength, eventually getting to 40. You'll also want to get Endurance to 40, and eventually Vitality too if you're going through NG+.

    You can get the Black Iron armor set in Anor Londo, in the room with the giant painting of Ariamis. You enter that room from the upper part of the moving bridge platform when it is in its lowet position. Even with the FaP Ring you won't have better than a medium roll though, if that matters to you


    honestly, i partially viewed this as a dex build just because i add in bow/estoc and use "faster" weapons and have 2 shields with low str requirements. i figured when i eventually got to crystal weapon buff that the faster attacks would add up to more damage than the slower buffs.

    but the 2h build i want to try, i'd really like to try it without burning my bridge on this current character i have. it also sounds really exciting trying to do most of the game again as a 2h char. minus maybe gargoyles/capra. i feel like i might be able to sneak in the rest of the game minus a few tricky spots just using only a 2h wep. that challenge excites me since i've never come close to trying it.


    i do have a SL123 char that i did the dragonhead glitch with way way back in the day when the game first came out to test gear. i didn't play the game with him, i only leveled him to test some concepts. he's a bit of a bust, but i can at minimum try certain things.
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    Re: semi noob help - armor sets

    Post by tard01 on Mon Sep 10, 2012 5:39 pm

    IV_Mark_VI wrote:Your two concepts don't really go hand in hand I feel.

    You're new to dark souls, so what you're looking for is a levelling up guide/path.

    If you go with a big, 2H weapon, Magic weapon and Great magic weapon don't make much difference.

    Your idea to use a lighter weapon and buff it is viable; not optimal, but viable. I have a build I'm doing that myself. Magic weapon/greatmagic weapon/crystal magic weapon all add in their damage per attack; so if you attack frequently with a light weapon, that stacks up the damage, where abig weapon you can only swing twice, doesn't maximize on that. It's good for PvP end game builds, but not on this PvE first time through build.

    My advice, try out your original concept of using Magic Weapon and Great magic weapon. Leave your INT at 15 for now. Longsword is good, but upgrade it to +10. Sen's Fortress sells large shards. Get the Oocaile catalyst (it's in Dark Root Basin). An ATT of 12 is fine for now.

    I've read the posts on recommended areas to beat, and this is the order that I would recommend a new player beating the game:

    Burg, Parish, Lowerburg, Sewers, Forest (moonlight butterfly and hopefully some anti-poison), Blight town (kill queelag), Dark Root Basin (kill hydra), possibly get Stone Armour depending on your build), then Sen's. Forest can be done before Sewers, the Elite Knight Armour and Wolf ring are so valuable. Also, if you don't take Master Key, getting the key from the forest to Havel is amazing as well.

    Most people do: Burg, Parish, Lowerburg, Sewers, Blighttown, Sens, only running into the forest to get some key gear.

    For your build, the Ooc catalyst is very important and will add a lot of bang. You only need a 10 INT starting off, a 12 to use the catalyst, and a 15 for Great magic weapon. Not much investment.

    Get a lingering dragon ring. You can cast with the ring on, then swtich it for something else and the duration stays increased. Good for entering a boss fight or other tough area. Use a weapon that swings fast for low stamina. Longsword, falchion, lots of weapons fit into this category. Dex weapons fit into a buffed build better, so levelling up Dex as opposed to STR is better I think.

    Your stats and build are good; just have to upgrade your gear.



    your reply sounds dead on with what i had in mind, but lacked the knowledge to pull off. this gives me confidence to try 2 chars.
    1) stick with my current char, go to atune 12, int 15, 16str, 16dex, and for now 40end/20-30vit.
    this will let me get away with using longsword/estoc.
    i do have balder's side sword and plan on going back for ricard's rapier just based on comments ive heard about them. i have no idea how i'll like them yet.

    2) start a new char ignoring weapon buffs. start with 24-27str/end/vit and figure out what i want to do with the rest of the stats after that.
    can someone recommend to me what to do after that? if you're saying the weapon buffs are weak for 2h bigger swords, are there spells that i should consider isntead?



    i do like the idea of getting at least enough int/atunement to get light casting. i think i quit on tomb of giants last time. i just hated the dark. i also did the catacombs without a faith weapon cause i didnt know better =P




    also, what is needed to enter final fight/kiln?
    sif ring
    lord vessel
    (quelag/gargoyles)
    anything else as a dead minimum requirement? is nito needed?

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    Re: semi noob help - armor sets

    Post by callipygias on Mon Sep 10, 2012 5:47 pm

    tard01 wrote:is there a better hvy armor set i can get before anor lando? seems fairly late in the game to get before i'd feel comfortable trying for exclusive 2hand style.
    The Stone Set is available to you. It's in Darkroot Garden, behind the building after Alvina. Pretty cool-looking, but heavy.


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    Re: semi noob help - armor sets

    Post by callipygias on Mon Sep 10, 2012 5:50 pm

    [quote="tard01"]
    IV_Mark_VI wrote:also, what is needed to enter final fight/kiln?
    sif ring
    lord vessel
    (quelag/gargoyles)
    anything else as a dead minimum requirement? is nito needed?
    All four Lord Souls: Bed of Chaos, Four Kings, Seath, and Nito.

    [quote="tard01"]
    IV_Mark_VI wrote: if you're saying the weapon buffs are weak for 2h bigger swords, are there spells that i should consider isntead?
    They aren't weak, they're strong as hell, it's just that the damage that comes from the buff is more effective on a weapon that swings faster.


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    Re: semi noob help - armor sets

    Post by IV_Mark_VI on Mon Sep 10, 2012 5:56 pm

    Only go to 15 INT after Sen's Fortress. You can't get Great Magic Weapon until Anor Londo.

    Final fight is a joke usually; you shouldn't have many issues. Other boss fights will be harder.

    For your first character, I would stop pushing END and start pushing Dex. Magic weapon helps, but won't be a primary source of damage. With a 15 INT you can cast things like Hidden Body and Light which helps in Tomb of Giants.

    For your pure STR character, in PvE, you don't need buffs if you're going with pure STR. If you do go pure STR, get a Man-Serpent greatsword once you reach Sen's Fortress; get the Gold Serpent's Ring, and kill them till they drop it. Excellent pure STR weapon. Grab the stone armour from the forest by going through the Hydra's area, and then killing the Cat thigns by baiting them, and then retreating into the trees and whacking them. Push STR, END, and VIT, and kindle all the bonfires (you'll need the flasks as you'll take lots of chip damage).


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    Re: semi noob help - armor sets

    Post by IV_Mark_VI on Mon Sep 10, 2012 5:57 pm

    @call: Yeah, that's exactly what I'm saying. The buff is applied per attack, so in PvE, it's better on a Dex weapon than a Str weapon. I shouldn't have said weak, I should have said weaker.


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    Re: semi noob help - armor sets

    Post by tard01 on Mon Sep 10, 2012 6:03 pm

    IV_Mark_VI wrote:@call: Yeah, that's exactly what I'm saying. The buff is applied per attack, so in PvE, it's better on a Dex weapon than a Str weapon. I shouldn't have said weak, I should have said weaker.

    i guess my concern with this is the relatively low damage when not buffed and clearing trash. this may just be something i have to experiment with and may be lack of knowledge on my part.

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    Re: semi noob help - armor sets

    Post by IV_Mark_VI on Mon Sep 10, 2012 6:08 pm

    +6 weapon for Sens is very weak. Snakemen are also highly damage resistant, and are hard to spam attack, so I would recommend clearing the Darkroot garden, Darkroot Basin, and even going back to Blighttown to farm Leeches (they drop large titanite). You need that weapon to be higher than what it is; get it to +10. And start pumping Dex; your END/VIT are good enough.

    What are your current stats and rings?

    Another approach is to get a Raw Weapon, push that to +10, while continuing to focus on VIT/END. You can still buff it, and it'll do more damage overall than a +10 weapon. However, you'll lose overall time because eventually you'll want a +14/+15 normal weapon to buff. This would just be to get you through Anor Londo.


    Last edited by IV_Mark_VI on Mon Sep 10, 2012 6:13 pm; edited 1 time in total


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    Re: semi noob help - armor sets

    Post by tard01 on Mon Sep 10, 2012 6:11 pm

    IV_Mark_VI wrote:+6 weapon for Sens is very weak. Snakemen are also highly damage resistant, and are hard to spam attack, so I would recommend clearing the Darkroot garden, Darkroot Basin, and even going back to Blighttown to farm Leeches (they drop large titanite). You need that weapon to be higher than what it is; get it to +10.

    alright. i don't know what proper item rank-up scaling is for areas. i thought i was doing ok for +6 or +7. I just got to anor londo on this play, so expecting the giant knights to be a pain until upgraded.


    also... i've yet to spend anything upgrading armor because i havent found a set i am committed to stick with using this build. i might need to get like 40k souls and go back to andre and upgrade stuff, then into sen's later and upgrade the rest. i'd rather not drop a ton of upgrades on gear i aim to replace at some point.




    also, should i go ahead and abandon longsword for estoc/ricard rapier... or balder's side sword (forget if its dex or str, i'll check later) and upgrade that instead of longsword?



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    Re: semi noob help - armor sets

    Post by callipygias on Mon Sep 10, 2012 6:17 pm

    Good move with the armor. Wait till you find what you like. It's important, but not nearly as important as damage output.

    +6 or 7 will get you through Sen's okay, it just won't be too easy. If you're into farming, like Mark suggested, go for it, but I'd sooner pull enemies one-at-a-time when possible (which is almost always), and even die a few extra times if necessary.


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    Re: semi noob help - armor sets

    Post by IV_Mark_VI on Mon Sep 10, 2012 6:18 pm

    Ok your rings are fine, for armour Elite Knight set is really good. Medium weight, and has lots of protection. Also looks good.

    I personally like the longsword; estoc/rapier are good for backstabs and parries/ripostes, but two-handing a straight sword buffed and going at it feels right to me. Balder's side sword is a really good weapon as well. All of them will work, depends on your playing style. Balder's has excellent range and move set, I would go with that or Longsword. Once you know how to parry well, you might enjoy the Rapier/estoc. With my build, I use a longsword.

    Edit: You won't need much farming, with the Gold Serpent's Ring, those guys drop shards like crazy. Also, you can use Kingseeker Frampt to change the Green shards into regular shards, and they'll drop 5 greenshards (equivalent of 15 normal shards once you convert them) allowing you to upgrade a variety of armour and weapons.


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    Re: semi noob help - armor sets

    Post by tard01 on Mon Sep 10, 2012 7:20 pm

    IV_Mark_VI wrote:Ok your rings are fine, for armour Elite Knight set is really good. Medium weight, and has lots of protection. Also looks good.

    I personally like the longsword; estoc/rapier are good for backstabs and parries/ripostes, but two-handing a straight sword buffed and going at it feels right to me. Balder's side sword is a really good weapon as well. All of them will work, depends on your playing style. Balder's has excellent range and move set, I would go with that or Longsword. Once you know how to parry well, you might enjoy the Rapier/estoc. With my build, I use a longsword.

    Edit: You won't need much farming, with the Gold Serpent's Ring, those guys drop shards like crazy. Also, you can use Kingseeker Frampt to change the Green shards into regular shards, and they'll drop 5 greenshards (equivalent of 15 normal shards once you convert them) allowing you to upgrade a variety of armour and weapons.

    how does my primary weapon matter with parrying when 1handing? thought all the parry math was done with teh offhand.

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    Re: semi noob help - armor sets

    Post by callipygias on Mon Sep 10, 2012 7:32 pm

    He just meant the Estoc and Rapier do more critical damage (backstab/riposte), not that it changes the timing or anything. Good to have at least one juiced critical weapon to one-shot mobs (like the serpent men).


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    Re: semi noob help - armor sets

    Post by IV_Mark_VI on Mon Sep 10, 2012 7:33 pm

    I meant Rapiers do a lot of damage when you Riposte with them. Change that sentence to "estoc/rapier are good for backstabs and ripostes" as they do additional damage. But you can also use them on your offhand to parry if you want to be a bada**

    Edit: what he said ^


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