TCC increases damage of...miracles???

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    TCC increases damage of...miracles???

    Post by WyrmHero on Tue Aug 21, 2012 10:07 pm

    Watch the video in this thread posted by chizfreak.

    http://soulswiki.forumsrpg.com/t10214-terrorist-in-lordran

    Now if you notice, the guys casts Karmic Justice, and immediately takes out TCC. When Karmic Justice explodes, it does +1000 damage. Is there something we don't know about TCC?


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    Re: TCC increases damage of...miracles???

    Post by WhatDoesThePendantDo? on Tue Aug 21, 2012 10:14 pm

    I'm not very familiarized with this particular miracle, can it hit for 1000 damage under normal conditions, i.e., no TCC?

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    Re: TCC increases damage of...miracles???

    Post by Rin on Tue Aug 21, 2012 10:19 pm

    I think my m8 told me sumthing about this, im totaly gonna make a build like that when i get back wyrm, 8) maby its an int build he is using velkas

    Anyway FOREST GANGERS HEAR I COME


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    Re: TCC increases damage of...miracles???

    Post by Rin on Tue Aug 21, 2012 10:29 pm

    To answer the question, no it dosent... its just the way KJ works


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    Re: TCC increases damage of...miracles???

    Post by WyrmHero on Tue Aug 21, 2012 10:32 pm

    How does it work? The most damage I could get with KJ is ~400 damage, with 50 faith and the ring of the sun.


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    Re: TCC increases damage of...miracles???

    Post by Rin on Tue Aug 21, 2012 10:38 pm

    Its a buff that fires a spell... hmmmmm but TCC dose half every spell in you have right? needs to be tested... but i think its just a way KJ works maby when the blast is set off the game thinks you casted with the TCC


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    Re: TCC increases damage of...miracles???

    Post by DoughGuy on Tue Aug 21, 2012 11:07 pm

    Yeah it could simply try to read the closest mag adj and read the wrong one.


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    Re: TCC increases damage of...miracles???

    Post by sparkly-twinkly-lizard on Wed Aug 22, 2012 1:58 am

    or it could register the spell triggering as a "cast" and use the tcc or tcc+velka t magic adj...


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    Re: TCC increases damage of...miracles???

    Post by Seignar on Wed Aug 22, 2012 8:57 am

    I tested it a bit. This is going to be weird, turns out Karmic Justice is a SORCERY treated as a miracle!

    Holding the TCC will increase the power of Karmic Justice whether or not you have the talisman used on you. Bellowing Dragon crest ring WILL NOT boost Karmic Justice because damage is treated as miracle-based. TCC recognizes Karmic Justice as a Sorcery and just increases all the damage, regardless of what kind of damage it is.

    BUT,
    TCC does not recognize Karmic Justice as a Sorcery IF you switched the talisman for the TCC, assuming they are both int the same hand.

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    Re: TCC increases damage of...miracles???

    Post by IV_Mark_VI on Wed Aug 22, 2012 1:12 pm

    Sorta.. makes sense? Since Velka uses Int to cast spells, and this is a Velka Miracle?


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    Re: TCC increases damage of...miracles???

    Post by sparkly-twinkly-lizard on Wed Aug 22, 2012 2:59 pm

    hey, the spell needed something to make it competitive, so no complaints here!


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    Re: TCC increases damage of...miracles???

    Post by IV_Mark_VI on Wed Aug 22, 2012 3:02 pm

    In your tests, do you need to use Velka's Talisman, or do you need to have the required INT to wield TCC?


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    Re: TCC increases damage of...miracles???

    Post by Seignar on Wed Aug 22, 2012 3:08 pm

    It works with any talisman, it doesn't have to be specifically Velka's. Velka's is just more convenient because you'll be investing in INT more than Faith. The only requirement is that you have a TCC in the hand opposing the talisman used, but you don't necessarily need to keep the talisman on you for the power to stay, you just can't switch to TCC by switching the talisman is all.

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    Re: TCC increases damage of...miracles???

    Post by befowler on Wed Aug 22, 2012 3:19 pm

    Has anyone tested whether KJ is triggered by dragon roars? Specifically the infinite roar glitch? I've been trying to get glitchers to spam me while I have KJ on and they keep running away instead, which makes me suspect it might work.


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    Re: TCC increases damage of...miracles???

    Post by IV_Mark_VI on Wed Aug 22, 2012 3:39 pm

    But can you have an INT of 8 and still hold the TCC and will it work?


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    Re: TCC increases damage of...miracles???

    Post by Seignar on Wed Aug 22, 2012 4:26 pm

    Okay, so I did a bit more varied testing and actually discovered something fascinating. To answer your question, yes it WILL work, but it will be nerfed to 20 damage because the adjustment of the catalyst is weaker.

    Which led to a realization, KJ deals magic damage, but in truth, the magic damage ISN'T strictly affected by TCC, EVERYTHING affects it! My past statement was wrong; HERE is what happens:

    KJ is bugged! Upon cast, it only calculates RIGHT HAND adjustment and never left hand where most talismans are at. What happens here is that KJ is casted with a left-hand talisman, it attempts to calculate the adjustment of your RIGHT HAND, where, more times than not, the adjustment is standard. So it deals a static damage. Test it yourself: Use a weak talisman, preferably one you don't meet the requirements, then test KJ with a talisman you can use. The damage is always (or nearly) the same.

    So what happens? Due to this bug, whatever adjustment is in your right hand is applied to KJ regardless of what it is (It WILL take in Pyromancy flame, an unusable/usable talisman/catalyst). This is why using a TCC that you don't meet the requirements for hurts it. Yet why a working TCC boosts it by a ton.

    Your normal magic/adjustment is 100 and due to this bug, KJ will always work as 100 mag adjust. unless you have a magic/adjustment item in your right hand. Go on, try it. Use an unusable talisman to cast KJ in your left hand and an ascended flame in your right hand when it goes off. You should deal around 600 damage with no buffs.

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    Re: TCC increases damage of...miracles???

    Post by IV_Mark_VI on Wed Aug 22, 2012 4:44 pm

    Thanks for the testing!

    So, if you have a faith build, you just have to have your Faith talisman in your right hand when it goes off for it to work? Is that correct?
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    Re: TCC increases damage of...miracles???

    Post by Seignar on Wed Aug 22, 2012 4:50 pm

    Correct. Cast the talisman in your right-hand for the REAL damage. The left-hand is bugged damage. Also, I'm doing some extra testing and ultimately I feel as if KJ is one of the most awkward spells ever...

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    Re: TCC increases damage of...miracles???

    Post by Rin on Wed Aug 22, 2012 4:52 pm

    its the most unique spell i feel stupid that i used KJ for ages now and never knew


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    Re: TCC increases damage of...miracles???

    Post by Rin on Wed Aug 22, 2012 5:55 pm

    I KNOW! I KNOW I KNOW I KNOW !!!!!!!

    I know how he dose it and TCC is just a realy small part of this!!

    he used HR it works o KJ like it dose on bs'ing

    red tear, hornets, crown and tcc in your right i managed to get to 2k+ damage


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    Re: TCC increases damage of...miracles???

    Post by IV_Mark_VI on Wed Aug 22, 2012 5:59 pm

    Hornet's Ring works on Karmic Justice as well? Can someone confirm this?


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    Re: TCC increases damage of...miracles???

    Post by Rin on Wed Aug 22, 2012 6:05 pm

    lol i did :shock: it jumped from 1200 to bout 2k after i put hornets on


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    Re: TCC increases damage of...miracles???

    Post by WyrmHero on Wed Aug 22, 2012 6:08 pm

    Wow amazing discovery Seignar. Rin I don't think he used Hornet Ring because the HR symbol (a small sword) only appears after he casts KJ, not because he has hornet. He must have ring of the sun.


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    Re: TCC increases damage of...miracles???

    Post by WyrmHero on Wed Aug 22, 2012 6:09 pm

    Why HR affects it though? Is KJ a critical attack?


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    Re: TCC increases damage of...miracles???

    Post by IV_Mark_VI on Wed Aug 22, 2012 6:17 pm

    They're not saying that the guy in the Video uses Hornets Ring, they're saying they made a new discovery that Hornets Ring boosts the damage.


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